Do any of you guys have an idea what it would cost to completely restore a 1930 ford model A couple? Not running, rough, sat for 40 years, but complete car. I've build several model A hot rods in my shop, but never a restoration, so I'm a little bit lost as to what to quote this guy. I've done some research on the web and from what I've seen it's between $55.000 and $75.000. Does that sound about right? Any and all help appreciated, thanks!
just got a quote on rebuilding the engine from H&H flatheads, engine is $3800 and trans id $850. Better that I thought.
alot depends on how far you want to go & how much you can do . rebuilt motors run between 2k - 7k . hot rods are use what ya got , where as restoration is what is correct . after market parts vary in quality . labor is your killer ........... unfortunately a good hot rod is worth more & ez to sell . restored cars depend alot on the restoration . not much help , but more time than money .
always helpful to have pictures.. Dude , its such and open ended question..you should know that obviously the first 2 posts were telling you that with out laying a hand on it, or an eye on it..its somewhere between $1..and $100,000... that should give you as much as you gave us
Seriously though...... Figure up all the parts & labor you need, plus all the parts & labor you think you might need, and double it. Then, take the amount of time you think it'll take to do the job and triple it. It's just like building a house, man.
Yeah, that's about what I was thinking, it's just these things aren't worth shit when they are done. Going price for a running, restored model A is between $15.000 and $25.000. Crazy to think it would cost three times as much to restore it. I told the guy $50.000 to $60.000 from what I can estimate. But I told him I would ask around and do some research.
It wont be an investment thing in a return sense of the word if thats what he's thinking..there wont be a return bigger than you put into it..It has to be done for the love, at least in this market. but i wouldnt say they aint worth shit., that would just be mean I'll never get out what I put into mine, but that wasnt my intention be straight up with the guy.. hey, just had to pull your chain..you know you asked an open ended question.. right?
Yeah, I know. Question is hard to answer. Just though one of you guys might know somebody who had one restored and knew what it cost.
I follow ya... tuff to tell.. depends on a lot of factors frame condition, Body condition...engine condition..the list is long, chances are, it will cost more in parts and labor than he would ever get out of it if he sold it after the restoration... I guess he needs to be told , if he's going to do this , its not going to be for the money..its going to be for the passion of owning something that is no longer made, and being proud of bringing one back to life..to gain out of it monitarily isnt going to happen but than sometimes you just cant put a price on the nostalgia, if you know what im sayin'
Yeah, he inherited this car from his grandfather, the guy who owns it is in his late fifties now and wants it just like it was when his grandfather bought it. He just retired.
It's a hard question to answer but you have to figure that it won't have a lot of the hours in it that you would spend to modify it into a nice little rod. The chassis is take apart, repair wear or damage, paint, reassemble. With a bit of time figuring out where the hell this an that go and which end turns which way. But none of the usual xxx hours of frame jig time that a rod with the same frame would get. No body mods but fixing rust an dings can eat up the clock pretty quick. Plus does it need a complete wood kit or just pieces replaced. Paint cost depends on what he wants just like any other paint job. Interior, top insert, running board covers and glass should be pretty well set prices for the right kits or a bid from the glass man. Still he is going to have double the going retail sales price in the restoration and maybe more. And if you do the level of work that you would do on a show winning rod he should have a restored Model A that can hold it's own at national Model A meets. The big pain in the butt for you is probably going to be that the car needs to be exactly as original right down to the little doodads that hold this and that on. Not like on a rod where you can change things and call it good.
well it sounds like it means something to him, so possibly his intentions are on the good side of making the resoration, and not worring that it wont be "worth" the reciepts..that is if he has the disposable income..(savings) I have seen a few guys with the right intentions to restore a Model A, just for it to sit looking like a monogram model kit threw up in their garage...for years and years,And YEARS... only to "let it go" for way less then they have into it..and mostly because they know they will never finish it. shame..sometimes thats where a Hot Rodder comes into the picture and has a go with it.
This! Modifying something or making something can be a lot easier that making it look just like the original. No freedom to make it the way you want it. The more I think about it,the more I think it will cost as much as a Hot Rod. Show car is show car, no matter if custom or restoration. Just got an E-mail back from a shop in MO that restores only model A's. They said best case $50.000 and worst case $80.000.
We have a local Model A engine/trans rebuilding shop near here. When he opened about 20 years ago, he told me of some "fact" from some published guide on A's, that they take 500 hours to restore. I tried to argue how impossible that was, but he stuck to that story for some time. If the car was almost perfect, no rust/or dents, perfect wood, well maybe... I would say that a well kept survivor that runs and has decent parts, would be at least 30-35k. Yours is rough, so it has to go up from there.
I think you should have him define to you what he considers a restoration. If it is just a driver quality rebuild in a stock looking configuration then your numbers are probably not to far off. If it is a full on restoration with every correct nut, bolt, part and finish then it is going to be very expensive and labor intensive. Those jobs are probably something for someone that enjoys the process of the restoration as opposed to having one done. I know a gentleman doing a 1930 four door sedan and is hiring out most of the restoration and he is in around 70,000 at this point. Still no interior yet. He is having it done with every correct part for the year and month of manufacture. It is cheaper to just buy one already done than have one restored but if it has family value then it can get quite expensive. Hope it all works out for all of you.
Good point, need to find out if he wants a perfect, 100 point restoration or a nice looking driver restoration. From what I've red on the web on some restoration websites, they claim between 800 and 1200 hours, depending on initial condition and level of Restoration. Man, this is not gonna be cheap. But I just talked to him on the phone and he says money isn't an issue. Thanks for the replies sofar.
It all depends on what you want- there was a blue Model A roadster in the shop I apprenticed in (this was an excellent shop with a great history of top line restorations). Every once in a while, my boss would stop in front of it, mumble a few curses at it, then walk away. After a few weeks of this, I had to ask... The boss's son told me that the fellow who brought it in wanted a Nat'l 1st place winner, and began dumping money into the project. NOTHING fit right, EVERYTHING needed major tweaking, rewelding, etc. Anyway, his wife stepped in at $75,000 (it was a painted, rolling shell at that point) and said, "No more". So there it sat for a few years until the storage fee got high enough for the boss to sell it. Like a few have said before, if you're looking to do a full resto, it just isn't worth it, and in the end, it's still just a "one of the millions" Model A. Then again, from reading your latest post... the customer is always right- do as he/she wants
Unless the owner has some deep emotional attachment to this car and is willing to spend more money than a properly restored model a would return upon resell, he would be ahead to buy one already restored. Of course as a business man trying to generate revenue for your shop I realise this would not be very beneficial to you to advise him of this fact. If you research some restored model a ford prices you will see what I am referring to. I actually paid to much for a model a myself. If I were to sell this car I would be lucky to break even.
After doing loads of full restos for years, I started convincing customers just to let me get one done already for 1/3 the price for them. If you do a nice job on the build, a rule of thumb would be your car is worth 1/3 of what you have in it. So just find a car in the condition that he wants, figure out what the car would actually sell for ( not what person thinks his car is worth), then triple that amount is probably what it would cost to build the sAme car. I just don't like customers to bite off more than they can chew, or for people to have unrealistic expectations on what they are going to get for their money. That is absolutely the worst when everyone is not on the same page.
Remember, compared to a car from the 50's or 60's, Model A's are rather simplistic. You'll also find many items are available with 'decent' aftermarket support, such as LeBaron Bonney for an interior, new bumpers, etc. This also isn't a flathead V8 and bangers and transmissions are rather simplistic. The paint is old fashioned lacquer and the single largest expense may be body wood and metal work. Panels are available from Brookville Roadster, amoungst others. I'd be shocked if this got anywhere near $50,000. Is anything missing from the car that looks like it would be difficult to source?
See if your customer would consider sliding an already restored A chassis under his A body. They pop up all the time. I've seen plenty of A coupe Hot Rod builds that started with a restored car. The body is pulled off and the stock chassis, interior, hood, lights, etc are sold off to go toward a Hot Rod frame build up and drivetrain. Buy a restored A such as the 15k one posted and use the chassis, electric, lebaron-Bonney interior, etc. Then place the body on his unrestored chassis and sell it to recoup half the money. You'd probably be miles ahead of busting down/rebuilding his chassis.
You can't do it. The primary serial number is stamped on the frame rails. Those guys selling rolling chassis are risking selling their title in the process.
You also have to consider what a dollar means to the customer. For some $50K is a fun weekend, for others it's 2 years' salary. The key is to agree on an approach and be honest about it. Pay as you go, billed by the month is a way to go. Keep the communication ongoing and open and you can both be happy. Of course, you need a *reasonable*, knowledgable owner to make that work... Good luck.
Really if he cant do the work himself or at least the easy stuff then it could easily be 75 large . You really got to love it for that kind of money.
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