NOT to hone the cylinders on rebuild???? Anyone ever put new rings on used pistons without honing the cylinders? I've got a small-block with a good, smooth std. bore (still has visible crosshatching) pulled apart to inspect and figured while I've got it torn down I'd throw new rings, bearings, and an oil pump in it. I was planning on borrowing/renting/stealing a dingle-berry hone and making a few passes up and down the bore to deglaze it. After I saw that it says not to hone the cylinders on rebuild in the "gospel" of Chevy factory engine performance, i'm wondering....
Got no facts on it but once I just knocked the glaze off the cyl. walls with scotchbrite during wash down. Engine didn't smoke but the rings rotated on me. Noticed that after a tare down about a year later. And it wasn't from my ring compressor, I use a tapered ring compressor. Must of been that neg. cable or magnet thing I read a while back as to why they turned on me .
I do know that my old pappy (who taught me most of my mechanical aptitude) never honed his rebuilds...for what it's worth....!?!
I would! Just do a few light passes with the dingle ball hone just to break the glaze.. And use lotz of WD-40!!
Put a light hone on it. The slight bit of material you remove isnt going to be worth the hassle when you have to tear it back apart due to rings not seating. Also especially so if you use Chromemoly rings, and don't put a hone on it, you might as well have tossed a few hundred out the window. Prefer a good 3 stone myself, over the dingleberry'ers.
I heard of a guy that would just let his cylinder walls get a "coat" of surface rust on them before putting pistons in bore. I like the ball hone with trans fluid myself. There use to be a concern about moly rings needing a certain smoothness of hone so not to chip moly facing off of rings. The Moly was sprayed on. I think technology has improved and this is not a factor, as much, anyway. With cast iron rings, honing is not necessary, but I always would knock the glaze off so oil will stay on cylinder walls better IMO during break in. Hone marks don't stay on Chevs very long from my experience. I used to be a Mercedes Benz Technician and their metals and machining were superior to most. I recall doing a valve job on a v8 with close to 200k miles and hone marks were still present, I was impressed.
Just grabbed my book, and this is what it says about block prep (pg, 3-7)," Present day piston rings are lapped during their manfacture and no longer require a rough bore finish for good seating. On rebuilds, bores should not be rehoned unless absolutely necessary if maximum power is to be achieved from minimum ring friction." Later on in the section on piton rings (pg. 3-15) it says, " The smooth bore finish currently recommended in all Chevrolet engines is largely a result of modern ring manufacturing techniques that virtually do away with lengthy run-in time on new engines to seat the piston rings. All rings are lapped in hardened steel cylinders during manufacture which eliminates the need for a rough bore finish to accomplish ring seating. (italics theirs) Elimination of rough bores one initial build and no rehoning on rebuild results in a sizeable power increase due to decreased engine friction." I alway though honing was a necessary step when rings got replaced. That said, if Chevrolet thinks it's better NOT to rehone and put it in the book twice AND in italics I'm not so sure. I haven't done any measuring of pistons or bores (other than to verify std. with a dial caliper), but I'm REALLY tempted to throw a cheapo re-ring kit in this lump and toss it in my truck just to see what happens. If it blows up or smokes, no big deal. I only bought the engine for the crank, oil pan and timing cover, and I didn't pay much for it. When I started tearing it down I found it in WAY better condition than I expected.
I suppose it depends on what you are using for rings. Chrome rings like the walls to be rougher than cast rings for example. I think if I could still see the cross hatch I would be inclined to just use a glaze breaker as opposed to a hone. my little brother used to use a piece of 600 grit wet or dry. I never have figured that one out it was just something that he did. I never used to hone my Hawg when I stuffed rings in it. Of course it sometimes happened in a motel room or on the side of the road.
I understand what "GM" is saying, but I don't think I could slide the pistons in the bore without at least a light hone..................just rubs me the wrong way.
I've done a few wet-or-dry sandpaper hones on vintage 2-stroke bike engines at the track after a seizure. Never had to do rings on a Harley at a motel, though. Nikalsil and chrome bike bores usually don't get honed-usually just a light scuff with Scotchbrite pad.
The bike in question was my home for several years. When it came time to do the top end it got done. If I was near a brother's digs then a visit was in order but if I wasn't it well where ever was available.
It depends on "just" a few things here... Just saying..do this or don't do that... without knowing exactly what's being used here is for the most part usless !? IF..the rings are of a high quality, medium quality, lower quality, really cheap...!? IF...the bores are truly clean and scratch free....!? MOST used bores aren't fully scratch free after much use. Use a FINE (they do come in a varity of grits!) grit, ball hone with a constant wash of fine/light oil. If the rings are anything but high cost, high quality, use a FINE grit ball hone with a good constant wash of light oil. If.....the engine/cylinder walls have been "very" lightly used and high quality rings are used...just put them on. Note, that "seeing" a crosshatch pattern in the cylinder wall and having it actually help the rings are two completely different things. Best bet...a few light passes with a light grit ball hone and clean well. Mike
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