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MIG to MIG with GAS(ARGON)

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by capten icon, Apr 6, 2011.

  1. capten icon
    Joined: Oct 28, 2010
    Posts: 54

    capten icon
    Member
    from Lodi

    Hello,

    Today my Dad and I got a kit for our Lincoln WeldPak 100 Mig wirefeed to convert it to using gas by adding the solenoid to spray in argon for a cleaner weld. Set it all up to the directions that came with the kit.

    Problem is when welding, it makes a constant popping noise and the weld doesn't come out as smooth as it seems it should. I know there will be comments made about my skills in welding but that honestly isn't the case. Checked the inner flap of the weldpak to see what setting I should have the welder set to, tried all of the variations and adjusted the pressure of the Argon too. Same thing.

    Anyone else have this problem? Anyone know the exact pressure I should adjust the gas to? Anyone know how to fix it? Haha. Thank you all for your time.

    -Pete
     
  2. Harris
    Joined: Feb 15, 2007
    Posts: 863

    Harris
    Member

    Did you swap the positive/negative hookups?
     
  3. capten icon
    Joined: Oct 28, 2010
    Posts: 54

    capten icon
    Member
    from Lodi

  4. honkey84
    Joined: May 31, 2010
    Posts: 13

    honkey84
    Member
    from IL

    If you guys are using Argon as a shielding gas on steel thats your problem. You need to use a mix of carbon dioxide and argon such as 80/20.
     

  5. capten icon
    Joined: Oct 28, 2010
    Posts: 54

    capten icon
    Member
    from Lodi

    Got this from Lincoln's website.

    K610-1 MIG Conversion Kit for the WELD-PAK —
    Complete kit for use with .025" (0.6 mm) electrode wire
    and either CO2 or Argon-mixed gas. Includes .025-.030"
    (0.6-0.8 mm) cable liner, two .025" (0.6 mm) contact tips,
    gas nozzle, 2 lb. spool of .025" (0.6 mm) L-56 electrode,
    gas regulator, gas hose, regulator adapter for CO2 cylinders and gas solenoid assembly, with all necessary hardware and easy instructions for installing gas solenoid.
    Use with .030" (0.8 mm) wire requires additional .030"
    (0.8 mm) contact tip and electrode wire.


    We got this kit from California Welder's Supply. Guy sold us the kit and the Argon. Said we could use the Argon OR CO2, just as the excerpt from Lincoln says.
     
  6. did you change the wire to solid core?
     
  7. gsport
    Joined: Jul 16, 2009
    Posts: 677

    gsport
    Member

    that, and make sure you have a good ground
     
  8. shinysideup
    Joined: Sep 1, 2008
    Posts: 1,627

    shinysideup
    BANNED
    from ruskin, fl

  9. gsport
    Joined: Jul 16, 2009
    Posts: 677

    gsport
    Member

    and either CO2 or Argon-mixed gas. Includes .025-.030"
    it says Argon-mixed gas, you don't want straight Argon... most common is 75/25 mix
     
  10. CRYOMAN
    Joined: Feb 27, 2008
    Posts: 43

    CRYOMAN
    Member
    from so cal

    straight argon is for aluminum. Go trade your bottle back to the guy you got it from for a steel mix (mixes vary by supplier) or straight co2. You get more gas from a c02 tank as it contains liquid c02 versus just gas in the mix and a slightly hotter weld but, it makes a little more spatter than the mix.
    Straight c02 is cheaper than the mix as well.
     
  11. Straight argon welds funny.
    Double check the polarity,

    Just to check your welder, switch back to flux core with proper polarity and make sure it welds as before.
     
  12. honkey84
    Joined: May 31, 2010
    Posts: 13

    honkey84
    Member
    from IL

     
  13. capten icon
    Joined: Oct 28, 2010
    Posts: 54

    capten icon
    Member
    from Lodi

    We did change the wire. Had a good ground. Metal was clean. Must be what you guys are saying, needs to be mixed Argon. I do appreciate everyone's help. I can lay a decent bead with basic MIG, but I don't know all the fine details to this new setup. Appreciate it.

    -Pete
     
  14. G. Anderson
    Joined: Oct 7, 2010
    Posts: 41

    G. Anderson
    Member
    from MN.usa

    "CO2 or Argon-MIXED gas" 75% CO2/25% Argon. (I think)
    Pure Argon is the worst gas for your setup
    Pure Argon for TIG welding.
    The guy from California Welders Supply, have him double check!!!

    For most of the stuff you will be doing (up to3/8") use the smaller wire .023-.025.
    That works really well on sheet metal.
    You want the sound of sizzeling bacon...........hhmmmmm....I'm hungry...BACON!!!

    Your Pal, Gary
     
  15. hartmen
    Joined: Feb 6, 2011
    Posts: 142

    hartmen
    BANNED

    from my experience its not the gas. its the wire speed. back the wire feed off a little.

    as far as the gas is concern at my work we use argon for steel. works fine. we also use the mixed gas also. its just the welders preference on which one we use. some use the co2 also.
     
  16. X2
    from your description I would also suspect wire feed (my $0.02 )
     
  17. does the wire feed wheel have a smaller notch for the wire to run in? mine has to be flipped when you change wire size otherwise it slips.
     
  18. JonF
    Joined: Mar 6, 2010
    Posts: 169

    JonF
    Member

    [/QUOTE] as far as the gas is concern at my work we use argon for steel. works fine. we also use the mixed gas also. its just the welders preference on which one we use. some use the co2 also.[/QUOTE]

    I don't want to piss in your soup about this, but I really really doubt your shop is mig welding steel with straight argon. Most light metal fab shops use a mix of argon and CO2 like the guy said 75/25. Heavy fab with mig and .045 solid wire might use 92% argon with 8% CO2, but you will still see some CO2 most of the time.
     
  19. winner, also as said before, make sure you are not trying to cram a lot of wire into the weld
     
  20. Dreddybear
    Joined: Mar 31, 2007
    Posts: 6,084

    Dreddybear
    Member

    I agree with these dudes. mixed gas is what you need. If your beads look like lava rock..like termites ate it..aka Holey and crappy...the gas is your problem. Also check with your finger and ear that gas is coming out the tip.
     
  21. gas mixture is basically a cost issue, unless you are welding some strange metals, personally I have welded with a number of gases, most recently pure helium because thats what I had. poor gas coverage will leave you with porous welds. doesnt sound like your problem to me.. if your feed drive wheels are for solid wire, then I would suspect wire feed speed and your weld speed.. post up some pics
     
  22. shinysideup
    Joined: Sep 1, 2008
    Posts: 1,627

    shinysideup
    BANNED
    from ruskin, fl

    :confused: Not true.
     
  23. 61bone
    Joined: Feb 12, 2005
    Posts: 890

    61bone
    Member

    Also check with your finger and ear that gas is coming out the tip.

    Ignore that advice! I personally stuck a wire through my finger doing that and I know a man who stuck the wire through his eardrum. Use a cup of water.
     
  24. F8TL
    Joined: Feb 19, 2011
    Posts: 50

    F8TL
    Member

    also check the tip... change it out and see if you don't have some crap in it... i use 95/5 at work for steel, but i don't have to buy it either...
     
  25. tig master
    Joined: Apr 9, 2009
    Posts: 416

    tig master
    Member
    from up north

    You need argon/co2 mix 75/25 80/20 for steel with mig. Straight argon with mig is for aluminum only.Never mind all the wannabe welders. Go back to lws and get the correct gas its just that simple.

    Tig.
     
  26. I can't comment regarding the use of straight argon for MIG ... I have only ever used (ever been sold) the mix for MIG, but I have heard of people getting a bad tank of gas though.

    Holy Crap ... "ran a MIG wire through his eardrum" ... WTF.

    I would also like to add that I would never EVER pull the trigger on an electic welder while dipping the tip into a cup of water ... water and electric welding is NOT a good combination.


    I am going to assume that "cup of water" comment was a joke ...
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2011
  27. krackerjack88
    Joined: Apr 6, 2008
    Posts: 1,247

    krackerjack88
    Member
    from Fresno,Ca

    Straight argon is mostly for TIG welding. I'd get a mix.
     
  28. Darwin Awards nominees.
    Hold the tip next to your ear, not pointing in!!!
     
  29. I dont recall YOU saying it was pure argon. even if, mild steel can be welded with 100% argon, penetration isn,t as good- 25 % oxygen helps with wetting and arc stabilizing is all..but, if you did get 100% argon try a mixed gas like the manuf. recommended. if its still crappy u can hold a piece of tissue paper in front of the nozzle and check for gas flow. but I would assume you r getting that or your welds would be porous as hell and would curl up on the end like on of those old 4th of july snakes.
     
  30. capten icon
    Joined: Oct 28, 2010
    Posts: 54

    capten icon
    Member
    from Lodi

    I want to thank all of the responses from you guys. It really helped. After the responses I got yesterday, double checked the gas today, it was straight Argon. Called the welders supply where we got it from, guy said we needed the mixed Argon. Said we could return the bottle and get the right one, no charge. So we did. Tried it when we got back, runs like a dream. Thanks for all your help HAMBers. We really do appreciate it.

    -Pete
     

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