I ran across some older cans of STP at a sale this weekend...cardboard can with a pull top. Almost everything I own has a flat tappet cam, so my question is; Does the older STP contain enough Zinc, etc... to make up for what the new motor oil lacks, or should I just go with the newer zinc additives. I can also get a few cans of the Red STP (formulated for extreme duty in 4 cyl engines), but cant remember if it has more or less zinc than the blue can.
The new STP blue plastic bottles have zinc in them. E-mail STP and ask how much zinc they contain. Let us know what they say. At Farm and Fleet a bottle costs $2.19 and I have been told it is enough to bring "new oil" up to "old oil" zinc standards!
Whether or not that stuff had enough zinc probably doesn't matter much now as most engineers will tell you that using old oils (or additives) is a bad idea as the molecular makeup with have changed and or separated over the years and not be what was originally concocted. Especially in those cardboard "cans" as they breathe. I wouldn't use it - just put it on a shelf to look at with other old junk.
Any brand of 15W40 meant for a diesel has over 1200 PPM zinc. Anything over 1000 is good for our older engines. I use Shell Rotella T because it is available where I drive in any truck stop.
Get some Valvoline part #VV-850 oil. NAPA can get it. Its 10w-30. Says not street legal on it because it still has all the good shit in it. Your flat tappet cam will thank you as will the rest of your engine.
I work at an O'reilly auto parts. we stock an oil made by Comp Cams meant for flat tappet motors. Theres also another brand we stock there meant for the flat tappet, but the name escapes me.
1962 the new 327 Chev was offered over the counter. My bud got one, a short block, and the counter man handed him a can of STP syrup, as a 'break in additive'. 50 miles and it spun a con rod bearing. Back to Courtesy Chevrolet. Short block was replaced in good faith, along with another can of STP syrup. Again with the spun con rod brg. This time the parts man had to involve the Parts Mgr and Service Mgr...after a long conference, they again warrantied the short block, but the Service Mgr. held back the STP... he said "Just break it in on 30 wt., no additive." Can't help thinking there was a Service Bulletin. (that's a lot of warranty!)
I was wondering if this stuff would break down over time...never thought of the cardboard breathing...thanks! I read somewhere that the older Rotella and Dello oils had the needed amounts of zinc, but the newer formulas do not...supposedly it was taken out because it clogged the particulate filters...anyone have any more info on this?
I don't know what STP is selling today. I know the old stuff promoted oil oxidation. The problem got so bad in the late '70s that Ford would not warranty an engine that failed from oil oxidation if analysis showed there was STP in the oil. I know that in spite of the old TV commercial demonstrations showing what a good lube STP was, it actually reduced the lubricating ability of ordinary oil. The reason for that is oil has a molecule chain made of balls, STP had easier to shear fibers. STP can thicken the oil(could just use thicker oil), and it can deposit a gooey coating that helps pervent rust. Beyond those two things there is no good reason to use it. Some use STP or an STP/oil mix as an engine assy lube. Surprise.... regular, boring, not trick, motor oil is better. I know people get away with using STP, but that doesn't make it better. Consider this..... Big-time professional engine shops could use anything they want as assembly lube and you won't find any of them using STP as an assy lube, or as an oil additive. Per the other posts here, just use a good zinc containing oil, or use a "regular" oil along with a proven zinc additive.
I checked our supplier and was suprised that they did indeed stock it and also I did not know of the Valvoline #850 as stated earlier in post #5. Says right on the bottle in big letters, not for street use as well, had a different blue label. However the MSDS does not tell about the Zinc but the Valvoline book just says "extra zinc". Back to your normal broadcast.......
I wouldn't use any of the "not streat use" oils in a street car. They don't just put it there to make it look neat on the shelf. These types of oils break down quickly and are not meant to last 3000k between oil changes.
"I wouldn't use any of the "not streat use" oils in a street car. They don't just put it there to make it look neat on the shelf. These types of oils break down quickly and are not meant to last 3000k between oil changes. " I think this is BS as I have been doing it for at least 20 years and I have had not problems so far!!!
"I wouldn't use any of the "not street use" oils in a street car. They don't just put it there to make it look neat on the shelf. These types of oils break down quickly and are not meant to last 3000k between oil changes. " Not meant for street use is due to emissions, it has nothing to do with breaking down. Just the same as aftermarket intakes or cams in newer cars. Race engines are hard on oil , why would you want crap oil if it won't last? Joe
I've read Valvoline VR-1 oil although high in zinc it does not have detergent additives to prevent sludge. I use Brad Penn 10w-30 $4.99 a quart. It cam manufacturers recommend it thats good enough for me.
OK then you don't think it makes good assembly lube. So I must assume that you don't believe my post. I guess it is safe to say that we don't believe each other. I don't use it as an engine additive I was advised by a rather rotund business man that he didn't use it and suggested that I shouldn't either once. I assumed he should know and never used it. So we do agree that it isn't a good engine oil additive.
Lots of good info here...Thanks for all the comments! Looks like Ive either got a nice conversation piece for the garage shelf, or the makings of some assembly lube...the local speedshop once suggested a mixture of STP and white grease...messy, but it worked!
ive read and heard about all this zinc stuff for a while now over in the turbo buick community. We run an additive called ZDDP and it does the job. Alot of people were wiping cams when they cut back on the zinc in oils. The diesel oil stuff was good for a bit, but the last time a checked it got cut back due to emission stuff around the same time the ultra low sulfer crap came out. Now if im wrong dont blast me, but ive been seeing this stuff with the buick stuff for a bit. I use ZDDP and regular old dino oil, call me old fashion but it works.
No reason to blast you we've been through the blasting ages ago. I actually have heard that the ZDDP stuff is a quality product from folks whos opinion I trust. I still haven't used it myself. GM makes a very good quality breakin additive I haven't used it in any of my engines yet because I'm stubborn but I have used it in engines that I have screwed together for other people. If I wipe a cam in my own engine its, "well I guess I shouldn't have done tha, but if I screw an engine together for someone I like enough for me to do that its an entirely different story. I don't want them to have to have the headache. So for the cost it isn't worth the risk. I still use straight castrol, there are two grades of it. The higher rated castrol still has plenty of zinc or so I have been told. Best bet for anyone is to do what makes you comfortable.
I'll spare you the details, but grease is also not a good engine assy lube. There is more than one white grease. For reasons unknown many feel there is something special about white grease. For general lubrication, the common kind traditionally used on door latches is not as good as "regular" chassis grease.
Exactly. Gee al we agree on two things. I'm going home no fun to argue with you. My experience is that all mechanics have quirks, no two mechanics do anything exactly the same, for some it is a concoction of assembly lube, for others it is the order in which they run the mic on the crank journals. Hell I knew a guy that touched the head of his majic hoola doll before he ever touched a wrench in the morning. When in doubt buy assembly lube. Its cheap or as cheap as any other lubricating product out there.
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