What would you have done?

you NEED to post that entire exchange on your site. Seriously.

 

As a fellow builder/supplier...(A) You handled it well (B) I don`t think I would have started a thread about it.

 

I had a PM from a guy named Scott asking me about Chris' apology email. I've had two more emials from Chris since posting the original string here on the Hamb. I didn't post either of them because I didn't want this to become a soap opera. I got my answer and I think in the end it all worked out ok. However, to satisfy those with enquiring minds I did get an email from Chris with the word apology in it, here it is:

Well Charlie, I owe ya an apology or three, please accept I am sorry. I was gonna write ya a note yesterday, but thought I'd better just drop it. I've never been known for having much patience anyway, but my disposition has been total shit for a couple weeks now, because starting tomorrow at 8 AM, I'll be sitting in a courtroom in Columbus watching and testifying at a trial for a guy who shot and killed my brother last October over a $35 hydraulic hose for our Oliver tractor. It was so stupid. I've been dreading this week for a long time now, but it'll finally be over with and justice will get served. You ever lose a brother at someone else's hand? I hope not, it sucks.

It's not a great excuse, but it's the truth, and I've not been feeling like my ol' self lately. I suspect you wouldn't be either. Last week you caught the worst of me, and I do apologize. I've been trying to work on my car a lot so that I can think about that, rather than what I've gotta deal with this week, and I really needed them brakes to go smoothly and they didn't.

Copy and paste this in your browser, you'll see what I mean: http://billingsgazette.com/news/sta...cle_2df0b5e0-d2de-11de-9b11-001cc4c002e0.html

I'm sure you feel pretty good about yourself and have gotten a good chuckle outta the responses you got off your HAMB thread. You're very clever, good job!! All in all, your kit finally did work out good, I just wish you would have given better instructions about what to expect as far as problems that might come up. It would have been as simple as saying something about how some spindles might be different diameters, and that some shimming might be necessary. Basically that's what my whole problem was, the damn spindle was too small. Your brass bushings worked well for the hoses and I almost had everything done yesterday and put back together but I had to head home to get ready to go play for a wedding last night, so I couldn't finish it. I'll try and sneak over today to get it wrapped up and checked out, but I think it'll work like a charm.

I thank you for your help and for your kit, and please accept my apologies, and realize I'm not as big of a dumbass as you and all your hamb buddies think I am. Also, I was famous way before you plastered me all over HAMB like that, so all the ridicule in the world won't bother me any. But either way, thanks, I feel grrrrrreat! So long Charlie.

I sent one more email where I offered to buy back the kit as many of you here suggested, but Chris declined the offer. So, that's it folks. I appreciate all your interest and input and no hard feelings with anybody from my end. I think we can put this one to bed.

 

Well that was a class move for apologizing and admitting that the problem was due to the spindles being too small(which you told him many times in the course of your E-mail correspondence with him.)

 

Ahhhh...I'm having a hard time with this part.
How does one do this and end up with a reliable and safe vehicle?

My gut feeling is that the flat material shim(s) will eventually work their way into the space between the inner and outer bearings and thus stop 'shimming" the bearings. If the guy doesn't notice or ignores the resulting looseness he could lose a wheel, kill a child or whatever and YOUR at fault!
Trust me on that one.
YOU will be at fault...or lose your life savings in Court to prove otherwise.

I would:
Demand the kit back and refund his money...or do whatever it takes to get him a PROPER spacer/shim setup with 360* support of the bearing race.
One that YOU can back with 100% confidence.

If he refuses to allow either, I would again demand the kit back/refund cost with the additional threat to report him to his local Dept of Transport to have the car checked out for unsafe construction...noting to them that the kit you offer has been modified in an unsafe way...and making sure the entire reporting process is well documented.
That way...you remain off the hook for HIS mistakes.

Wrapping some starter shims around the spindle...what next!?!?

 

You guys are nuthin but a bunch of know-it-all pricks! Tell me what to use as a damn shim there Bill, and I'll sure go get the right stuff and tear it apart to put the right material in there!! I don't WANT something that's unsafe, that's the part you guys are failing to realize.

Seriously, you guys don't have the foggiest idea who I am and you'll never meet me, so make fun of me all you want, I really couldn't give a rat's ass! It's funny how tough you guys can be on the other end of your computer screens.

All's I wanted was disc brakes, not to get thrown under the bus for a few weeks on the hamb. You pussies have the balls to yack yack yack about me behind my back, but does a single fuckin' one of ya offer any help?? Nope.

I used to think hamb was pretty cool, now I can't figure out how to erase my profile on here and never come back.

 

well i would call myself more of a know nothing prick
i am very sorry to hear about your brother and i hope the fucker who shot him
gets what he deserves
you are right i don t know you and i certainly won t judge you
but i would like to think that people on the hamb would have been forth coming with help if you had posted and asked for it
we just got one side of the story
so that said i wish you luck
vince

 

I'm not being "tough"...not in the least!
I think what your doing is very likely unsafe and you and others might get hurt as a result. Thats it. Nothing more.

If your as worried about being safe as you say, send it all back and get the spacer done correctly like the man offered.

Your using a piece or pieces of flat shim stock to space out the race of a rotating bearing thats holding your wheel/brake system!
Thats not the place to experiment with stuff and hope it works.

 

hmmm

 

http://billingsgazette.com/news/sta...cle_b6491180-b609-11df-a803-001cc4c002e0.html


If the worst thing I ever do is tell somebody their disc brake kit sucks, I'm ok with that. I know that what goes around, comes around. And I hold most of you A-holes in the same graces as I hold this Hardman character!

So, don't ask me for any more parts for YOUR cars, you'll have to find 'em on ebay like everyone else now, and I'm done perusin' the "parts wanted" threads to help get you guys the parts you've been lookin' for for all these years!

I suggest you guys re-read the original email exchange between Charlie and I. It really wasn't THAT bad, seems like you guys have a tendency to like drama, so you saw what you wanted to see. When he said he referred me to his website to verify what kind of spindle I had, I admit that I didn't read THE WEBSITE thorough enough to see the spindle SIZES. I saw a picture with 2 obviously different spindles and knew which one I had, so I figured Charlie would have the rest figured out, and I just told him to get it comin', and a week and a half later it showed up!

Now I'll be the first to admit I'm not a great mechanic. I've never put disc brakes on anything till now. It would have been a piece of cake, IF the stuff was sized to fit MY spindle, OR if the instructions in the kit would have identified the possibility of varying spindle sizes. So I got the oddball one, big whoop. I've never had anybody tell me to "peen" anything, so I didn't know what it meant, but I looked it up and I don't think peening my spindle would have made up the difference in the size of the spacer or the bearing. It would have helped, but I don't think it would have made them close to snug.

I was pretty clear with old Charlie in my explanation and he did a good job of explaining things back, but if you look closer, HE GOT SMART WITH ME FIRST.

"I am not all surprised that you are disappointed at this point, but I have no control over your ability or skill level. Your email #1 above indicates you just started on the conversion today, this afternoon, but #5 says you’ve been at it a week, which one is correct? I do not have control over how long you take to do a project. I can do this in under three hours, but I’ve done a lot of them, and I am a very capable mechanic."

Tell me what the hell my spindle size has to do with my mechanical capabilities??

And #5 did not say I'd been at it a week, it pretty much said I DIDN'T WANNA BE AT IT A WEEK.....

"I'm fairly disappointed in this outfit so far, to be honest. Plus, I didn't think this was gonna be a week long project."

Anyway, this is pointless. Like I said before, none of you know me and I don't really wanna know any of you anymore, so think what you will. Most of your comments remind me of something my father-in-law would pipe up and say, and I KNOW he's as worthless as tits on a tomcat, so say all ya want! I've come to the conclusion it's a generational thing. One of you fella's hit it right on the head when you basically said I'm a younger guy and my generation doesn't seem to have the patience. Sorry, but I had better things to do that day than sit around waiting for old man Charlie to get back to his computer and email me back! I wanted it fixed NOW, and it was frustrating sitting there at my shop for hours with a problem, and really really wanting to overcome it, feeling a little out of my realm but still comfortable doing the work, and Charlie took his sweet ass time in getting back to me. I don't necessarily agree with his timeline, but it's his story, he gets to say it however he wants.

It sure seems to me like there's a TON of you old guys who like to sit around your computers reading stuff like this, and then feel big when you get to throw your two cents in there! You guys remind me of a bunch of old ladies who like to sit around and peck like old hens, and talk about other people behind their backs! At least I have the balls to talk to people right to their face. As a rule, I don't say anything about anybody that I wouldn't say directly to their face or in their presence. Some of you old Red Hat Society girls should take note on that little gem there!

 

you should have sent it all back to him, gotten a refund and moved on

 

Oooooh yeah, now that I've drilled all the holes in my steering linkages out to the sizes he needed them to be for this fabulous disc brake kit! Great idea!! You just want me to weld all the original shit back together? Cuz the original bolts sure's hell won't fit now.....

Tell you what, like I said, now that you guys have decided I've fubar'd my original front end, why don't one of you geniuses just send me a whole new front end that already has disc brakes and I'll send you my old one.........I'd like a dropped axle while you're at it, all chromed up and drilled out! With coilovers of course.

 

knock the chip off your shoulder and get over it. It is what it is. Time to move on, sir

 

I just read this and all I can say is "WOW". You just don't get it do you. YOU are angry/disgusted/annoyed because a kit that is NOT designed for your spindles doesn't fit. YOU are the one that didn't read the website and YOU are the one that didn't measure your spindles before buying the kit. How can you possibly be upset with anyone here? As for the people on this site ... we saw both sides of the conversation and you are the one that looks like a fool. Based on your "copper pipe fix" it is safe for anyone reading this to assume that you are not capable of fixing this on your own and are stupid enough not to accept FREE help for the original designer. YOU are the problem here, not the designer and not the people on this site.


I don't even like your "apology". You gave a reason for your "short fuse" but you still don't appear to accept the fact that you made a mistake.

Let me guess, your next project is going to be installing some 426 Hemi heads on a 340 ... good luck with that.

 

I agree ... I don't know you and you don't know me ... so what. Put your tail between your legs and beg the original designer to design a spacer that will correct your problems. He has already offered to do this. Although I must say, based on your continueing "bad" attitude I wouldn't be a bit surprised if that offer has expired.


Keep this is mind ... YOU drilled those holes trying to install a kit designed for something else. Again ... the only one here that has made any mistake has been you. Accept that, grow up (learn to shut up and listen rather than bitch) and get on with it.


Oh, one more thing ... learn to READ THE INSTRUCTIONS.

 

borntolozer----go to your Red Hat luncheon and leave me the hell alone!

451 posts on here since May?! You must be another one of the geniuses! Get a life! LOL

 

I wonder if that goose has the words "LEFT" and "RIGHT" painted on his shoes. If he has, the words are probably on the wrong feet.
You sir, have the patience of a Saint.
File him in your memory bank under "Dickhead" and keep being the standup guy that you seem to be.

 

To cut through all the BS, fingerpointing and drama I'll get straight to the point.

1. He offered to correct the issue. You do not want to send him you spindles.

Fair enough, don't hold him responsible from this point forward, he offered you refused.

2. I do understand not wanting to tear your frontend apart even further to ship the spindles. It seems you understand you have limitations in your skills. I also understand your frustrations not being able to go back to original.

3. It seems that there would be an easy fix also! Your spindles are 1.193 His spacer is 1.250 giving a .057 difference. You need an adapter sleeve with a .0285 wall thickness. I used to be a machinist and I could do this on a lathe in a few minutes with some mild steel, I'd use 4140 but I tend to overkill stuff, no brass, no copper etc. An alternative is he also has a spacer with a 1.375 ID (Internal diameter). Personally I'd purchase just this spacer and still make my own internal sleeve but now the wall thickness would need to be .091.

I'd say find yourself a local machinist. Either get the larger ID spacers or use your original smaller ones, take them to a machinist. Have them make up a sleeve that will press fit (Interference fit) into the spacers and then have them finish bore the ID to match you spindles. I would leave a couple of thousands to slide them on your spindles, just as he did originally in the kit for the 1.25/1.375 spindles. Any shop will have the material needed probably laying around and maybe about an hours worth of machine time. (Another alternative would be to open up your smaller 1.250 spacers on the lathe).

Just remember this: When you modify ANY kit you are taking away any and ALL liability from the original manufacturer.

Hope this helps you out without the added drama. I know how it is to lose a brother at the hand of another....hopefully you'll get through this. Lots of displaced anger and frustration.....I know.

 

i'd lose no sleep over him. i've seen enough positive comments on here from people usin your kits that if i were goin disc instead of drum, i'd buy em.. and feel confident of a decent install. you did all ya could.

wow! i just finished readin a few responses from this sweetheart... you're callin people who TRIED to help you "knowitall pricks"?! you may wanna have a look in the mirror there chrissie... what a dick!

 

See, now THAT'S productive HELP. I don't know where everybody is scared I'm gonna try and sue Charlie. If you'll notice, the solution you just said was my FIRST idea when I saw that the spacer was too loose on my spindle. Next question, how long of a sleeve do I need? The outer bearing fits good, should I make it long enough to cover my spindle all the way out to where the inside of the outer bearing sits? THANK YOU

 

So, exactly WHERE in all this thread have you seen anybody try to help me??!! Except for the last fella......All I see is a bunch of old ninnies sitting around with nothing better to do than lambaste somebody in the internet! See, you're another one of 'em who hears what you wanna hear, not what's actually bein' said. "Chrissie"?? Come on......is that the best you got?