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Hot Rods 32 ford brake ? what do i have?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by ocfab, May 6, 2010.

  1. ocfab
    Joined: Dec 26, 2007
    Posts: 678

    ocfab
    Member

    OK so it's time to do a dropped axle and hairpins. I started to pull my 4-door apart and this is what i have. It looks like a conversion to me. The wheel cylinders are barely bolted to the backing plates mostly held on with a washer and it looks like the backing plates were heated and hit with a hamer to make work This don't look safe to me. i can fix it but not sure if it is worth the time. So my question is what do i have?

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  2. titus
    Joined: Dec 6, 2003
    Posts: 5,145

    titus
    Member

    looks like stock 32 backing plates that someone added wheel cylinders to.
     
  3. ocfab
    Joined: Dec 26, 2007
    Posts: 678

    ocfab
    Member

    it stopped ok. it just don't look safe. should i fix what i have or do 40 ford?
     
  4. I would throw it all (the front brakes that is) away and start over. As a side note if you run solid wheels on those drums you will need a spacer.

    Charlie Stephens
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2010

  5. DD COOPMAN
    Joined: Jul 25, 2009
    Posts: 1,122

    DD COOPMAN
    Member

    That's some scary engineering there. Please do something different. DD
     
  6. budd
    Joined: Oct 31, 2006
    Posts: 3,478

    budd
    Member

    other then the sloppy fit of the cylinder they look as well set up as 30 chrysler brakes, i think a little work and they would be fine
     
  7. F&J
    Joined: Apr 5, 2007
    Posts: 13,222

    F&J
    Member

    The center hole for the wheel cylinder needs to be a tight fit. Right now you are relying on 2 small bolts. Not good or safe.

    2nd problem is that there is nothing to prevent the wheel cylinder pistons from retacting too far back into the bores. A 39-up Ford setup has adjusters halfway up the shoe to prevent that, as well as anchors on the bottom.

    Best old fix is 40 style brakes but they won't fit those early spindle 4 bolt pattern. So swap to 37-up spindles..but then you need the aftermarket upper steering arm to hook to your side steer draglink.

    I don't know if there is a disc brake kit to fit those early spindles.. that would have been the quickest way if you were not removing spindles.
     
  8. Get a set of instructions on how to put '39-'48 hydraulic brakes on a Model A. The idea is the same but a few of the parts are different (that is to say the spindles on a '32 are different from a Model A but in both cases they are "spindles"). You need a set of '40-'48 (you can use '39 backing plates but you need the '40-'48 drums to get the 5 on 5 1/2 bolt pattern) drums and backing plates. There is a kit sold by most vendors to center the backing plate on the spindle (this looks like a piston ring) and to space the bearing out to the correct location. You need to elongate the holes in the backing plates (with a file and hack saw) to match the hole locations in the spindles. I would strongly recommend this approach instead of going to the later spindles. Everything will bolt together in a logical manner. Remember if you are running the original wire wheels on the later drums you will need a spacer ring. You are close to one of the experts on this subject, Richard Lacy at [email protected], (626) 338-2282. While you are doing the brakes if your master cylinder mount needs an upgrade (after seeing the brakes I can imagine what the master cylinder mount looks like) talk to Richard Lacy about the adapter he makes to use the original pedals.

    Charlie Stephens
     
  9. Those are mech. brakes that were poorly converted. Charlie's right on the 39-48 backing plates plates fitting your spindles. I used Richards parts on my '36 and am very pleased with the results. My car is in Orange at my warehouse now, if you'd like to take a look, you can come here or I can swing by if I bring it home...I'm in East lake.
     
    Last edited: May 7, 2010
  10. ocfab
    Joined: Dec 26, 2007
    Posts: 678

    ocfab
    Member

    thanks for the help guys. someone just told me to use 56 ford truck because of the self energizers . there was a tech in hotrod a few years ago. anyone done this?

    mike i'm a block from east lake i may pm you
     
  11. I think there is a problem running early wire wheels with the '56 Ford truck brakes, talk to Richard Lacy at [email protected], (626) 338-2282. The early Lincoln brakes may be the answer. Again talk to...by this time you know who I mean. There is no question that the Bendix design is better for brakes, it is all about how much do you want to spend. I have always felt that the '39-'48 Ford brakes were good enough.

    Charlie Stephens
     
  12. CWPASADENA
    Joined: May 2, 2010
    Posts: 17

    CWPASADENA
    Member

    '65 Ford Truck brakes are not just a bolt on deal.

    Get in touch with Richard Lacy at the Early V-8 Garage (626) 338-2282 and he will be glad to give you a run down on the easiest and best way to go about a proper Hydraulic Brake Conversion. He offers Self Energizing Brakes as well as Ford Fixed Anchor Brakes for your car. The Early V-8 Garage is in West Covina, not too far from where you are.

    CWPASADENA
     
  13. ocfab
    Joined: Dec 26, 2007
    Posts: 678

    ocfab
    Member

    Thanks for the help guys. i just got off the phone with Richard and he is sending me some info.


    Adam
     
  14. troylee
    Joined: Jul 10, 2007
    Posts: 689

    troylee
    Member

    I put 53-56 truck brakes on my pickup. I had to with the wheels I am running. if not for the wheels i would have went with the lincoln style. and i am using the later spindles 47 car.
     

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  15. adam,
    looks like you are getting your brakes sorted, i do however have a question. why are you going to use hairpins instead of the stock wishbone.
    Al.
     
  16. ocfab
    Joined: Dec 26, 2007
    Posts: 678

    ocfab
    Member

    My wishbones have been cut and badly repaired. I build the hairpins for So-Cal So I built an extra pair of stainless and plain steel so the price was right
     
  17. Richard (EV8G)
    Joined: Jul 13, 2004
    Posts: 23

    Richard (EV8G)

    You had mentioned to me a dropped axle; I would have your original 32 heavy dropped and use the ORIGINAL spindles and leave the wishbone as it is. Hairpins look cool but the original (triangulated) wishbone WORKS better. I would also retain the 32 spindles, as the later spindles have no steering arm for the draglink and the aftermarket hairpin
    adaptors are all made incorrectly, as they are CENTERED over the axle at straight-ahead instead of being 3/4" forward on center, as the original arm is, causing the angle to the draglink to be accute instead of 90-degrees at straight-ahead. This also causes the draglink to be too long, which results in the car turning left when the steering gear is on high-center and therefore when the front wheels are going straight-ahead, the steering is not centered and instead is off-center and into the built-in play that permits to lash to be adjusted for wear. An adjustable draglink (made from a 32-34 tie rod) is a good idea to center the steering vs. front wheels, but will NOT cure the angle issue.

    Either 39-42, 46-48 Ford/Merc Lockheed brakes can be installed on the original spinidles. As mentioned, there is an adaptor kit available to install the larger-pattern brakes onto the smaller-pattern spindles AND to space the inner wheel bearing outward so the later 40-48 hubs/drums fit correctly on the spindle. The kit for $20 is indeed a piston ring and a valve seat. They are crappy, and the piston ring is too thick and is very brittle, so they often break during installation. I have had made a brake plate spacer with an integral flange for better support and positioning, and an actual, correct specs bearing spacer. This costs $50 but is well worth it. A desirable upgrade is to Bendix self-energizing brakes, which are available from F-1/F-100 pickups HOWEVER as mentioned already, wire wheels CANNOT be mounted (except by using a gawd-awful-uglier-than... spacer that also serves to severely screw up the front geometry.) A better choice is new 12" Bendix brakes, which can use 40-48 hubs/drums and on which wire wheels can be used along with Wire Wheel Support Rings to properly support the wheel on the inside of the lug circle. These new Bendix brakes are available in the same bolt pattern and center hole size as the original 32 spindles, so only a bearing spacer is required which saves $30 on parts. If using Ford/Merc Lockheed brakes, a 3/8" diameter file can be used to notch the plates just enough for the original bolts to pass through. This prevents the plate from rotating on the spindle, as it would if the holes are just cut straight through with a hacksaw...

    Another nice thing about the original 32 (32-34) spindles is that the arms are longer and easier to work with when reshaping for clearance with a dropped axle. There is also available a special kingpin-bearing set to eliminate the "socket" on the top of the original kingpins (which by the way should NOT be removed, as they support the vehicle - which is why the BEARING is under them!!! see Adam's posted photos above; been whacked) and relocates the load to the BOTTOM OF THE AXLE as with the later spindles. The 32-34 spindles also LOWER the front end 1/2" as compared to the later spindles...

    We have done the above operations MANY times and the results are always very good and the appearance is good also.

    Thanks to Charlie Stephens, Irish Mike and CW for the referals

    Richard
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2010
  18. adam,
    this is great advice from richard.
    Al.
     

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