As some of you may have noticed I have been trying to glean paint information from the HAMB in order to make myself a better painter. I don't really have anyone to learn from by watching so I just kind of plug along and try to incorporate the knowledge of people who (unlike me ) actually know what they are talking about. Anyway, a guy on another forum stated that a good painter can paint and never leave orange peel while using any paint or any gun..... I know that I have some degree of orange peel most every time, enough that I decide to sand and buff before I spray the first ounce of paint. How many painters here never get orange peel, and/or what percentage of the time are you able to deliver a car without cutting and buffing?
Factory paint jobs have orange peel. Its just a matter of how anal the painter is and whats considered acceptable.
A little Orange Peel is much easier to cut & buff than sanding runs out. You're better off putting a little thicker consitency paint on to be safe.
You can't paint and get NO orange peel. It just doesn't work, the surface will always have some texture. Even a new car from the factory has some orange peel. Some are better than others but they all have it. I am able to spray clear and match that factory finnish of very little orange peel but I do work in a Body-Shop and paint every day.
the texture depends on the type of material used, among other factors. but as a a rule some texture is good. most modern paints will pop if ya slick it down too much on a large area. this leads to premature failure as well. back in the super max days (and still with some acrylics) you could really snot em down with no problems. i read many post about guys slickin lacquer down so well it dont need a rub, wich actually is all wrong. you wind up pourin on the paint , wich leads to all the associated problems, cracking, dull back, peeling etc. with lacquer , you wanna be eaesy on the application, with good thinner and let the paint do the work. modern urethanes can behave in a similar manor if over pushed. in short, you want your paint to lay down, and on small parts you can push your luck, but on large items, like a complete, take it easy as one guy already said, i'd rather sand off a little peel, than try to polish off runs. come to think of it, polishing a run out of a urethane job is probably one of the hardest paint operations that exists if i was gonna vote in the pole id say i can lay it down with no peel, but wouldnt make that my aim when painting, and regularly leave a bit of texture on everyday jobs. on high end stuff, we sand it out, being careful not to leave too much in the final coats as buffing can bring back some peel previously sanded out with urethane. hope all that made sense, lol good luck skull
What you said makes a lot of sense, I apreciate all of the time you took to answer. Lots of good info there and for sure a hell of a lot more than meets the eye. Thanks.
My biggest downfall any time painting was not having enough lighting. You really have to see what the paint is doing when it lays on the car. If you look across the surface as you paint, you can see if it is "laying down" as it hits the surface - or getting adaquate coverage. Watching the paint lay is your best tool. Mixing changes can be made if you can see what it's doing.
Just finished squirtin this an hour ago. May have to hit a few spots with 2000 and the buffer Lotsa body lines, hard to lay it out with out runs But it can B done
I agree on the lighting. If you can see every angle when you are shooting and have the proper reducer, you can lay on a pretty slick job. I always color sand and buff so I just shoot for as slick a job as I can. Saves sanding. Here is a F/C before sanding and rubbing. Yes, I get peel. Just depends on the shape of the body and how big the body. Odd shapes require more attention. The smaller the body the easier it is to get a slick job for me, but I'm getting old and tired.
Hey, "Orange Peel" is usually the result of several things- the type of finish you're spraying, lacquer, alkyd , acrylic enamel, epoxy and urethane all handle alittle differently. If not thinned or reduced correctly, the wrong temp. solvent used for the shop conditions, together with poor gun triggering and or the wrong spraytip or air pressure, that's at the gun, not the regulator any or all of these will result in an "orange peel '' finish. "Pratice makes the master"
I don't even bother to try anymore. Fact is, no matter how good of a painter your are, the job will always look better cut and buffed. Obviously the less peel, the less work you have to do sanding, but in the end it will come out the same if you take your time. I was told that with modern day regs on solvents, it is almost impossible to lay out a flawless paintjob. The solvents evao so quickly that the pain doesnt really have time to flow out perfectly. Usuallu the best thing to do is to make sure you get the paint on the car, thats job #1. Once its on there, overreduce the last coat and really try to lay it out. You won't be able to correct a whole lot of the peel from previous coats but it'll help. When your first starting out, just try not to leave dry spots. As long as theres enough paint on the car, you can figure the rest out later.
I painted for 25 years-got pretty good at it ,too...I NEVER was able to paint without orange peel, with one exception-when I used the little cans of spray paint-can't get enough out of the nozzle to create any peel. I think it's a physical impossibility to paint without orange peel, if you lay it on properly, it's a matter a gravity, I guess, but orange peel is a fact of life...death, taxes and orange peel...that's why they make buffing pads and 2000 grit...
Would it help to warm the paint before being shot???... I've read elsewhere that it does help with the way the paint flows and it almost eliminates orange peel.... Just wondering.
When painting a car, you should be worrying about the important things like coverage and an even coating along with mil thickness, zebra stripes, dry spray, spitting, etc. I don't think my main concern would be if I have to cut & buff the job afterward.
Hey, My old man use to tell of the days of heating paint over a hot plate and addin' a "jigger'' of thinner, then shoottin' like someone was holdin' a gun to your head- I've tried heating paint in the cup, but a didn't notice any great flow over standard mixing & triggering processes, that and visions of The Hindenberg goin boom over my head! " Humpty Dumpty was pushed "
ZEBRA STRIPES, now thats funny.....we named a color, zebra silver, after a painter here years ago.....bet you can guess why. you should have seen his "surface of the moonstone blue" it was quite a stopper as well
I have heard of the hot plate " trick". I think that was back in the days of DULUX enamel. I've never done it that way either. Does any body remember hotshot reducer and redicar hardener. That shit would really lay down and look like glass. Only problem was 6 mos to a year it was dull.
i cut and buff everything i can .some parts are 2 small .but the clear i shoot on my pumps is omnie 260 and it will move .you have to spray it with peel because after its on it flows took me a wile to get use to it .
You will get Orange peel don`t let that bother you.One trick I learned was if I wanted a nice flat finish I would hit a car with two coats of clear,let it dry,Block it with 800 and hit it again,You will see a big difference in the finish. As for runs, they are not call runs!! there called flow indicators!!
Back in the early 60's I worked in an old body shop run by an equally old Italian guy that was a master when it came to custom paint. He had an old 5 gallon paint pot with an electric heating element in the base and racks of heat lamps on rollers. When he sprayed enamel he would set up the lamps and heat the area to the same temp as the paint and it would flow so smooth you wouldn't believe it. Every few hours he would move the heat lamps back and the next day it would be dry to touch. As fussy as he was there would be some occaisional orange peel and with old enamels it took a month before you could polish it out.
Years ago a local body shop burnt down heating paint with a hot plate Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
With smaller parts you seem to have more control over how the paint lays down. By no means am I a pro but for instance painting everything at once a headlight bucket will turn out flawless & flat while the body shell will have a bit of orange peel. To me the planets have to be aligned ex.. Proper reducer, temperature, humidity, technique. Vary rarely do all intertwine perfectly.
I'm a hobby painter and never end up shooting the same paint twice, I'm most concerned with coverage and no runs. I have pretty good luck shooting with a workable amount of orange peel. If it's reduced properly with the right temp range, applied well with good film build and pattern overlap, the orange peel should flow out.
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