The TPI gremlins have truck me again and I'm getting tired of trying to figure out whats wrong so I've about decided to simplify things and go back to a carb. I've used the Edelbrock Performer before and liked it pretty well but I've come across a freshly rebuilt Holley 600 for a good price that I'm comsidering purchasing. Anyone have any preferances between the two?
both are fine! I use Holleys cause thats what I am used to... Let me know if you want to sell off the TPI stuff....
I put a brand new Performer 500 on my Stude to replace a very messed up WCFB. If I don't start it every couple days the gas evaporates out of it and when the weather started getting warmer, as in the 60's, it started vapor locking like crazy. In cooler weather it ran fine but would still go dry if not started. In hot weather it did better with the WCFB! It is getting replaced soon with a Holley 390 4 bbl., I have a 600 Holley on my truck and other than being too big for it it does fine. I'll try the Performer on the '66 C10 I just picked up when I get the engine in it as it has a mile of hood clearance and may stay cooler under the hood. The Stude is REAL tight for hood clearance and that may have aggravated the situation.
I've run both at different times. The Holley generally ran well enough, but eventually, they all leaked. The AFB/Edelbrock also work well enough, but the gasket line is above the fuel level, so leaks are minimized.
I agree 100% these carbs are living off there rep from the past. The last three started with edelb to be pulled and R&R by street avenagers. bolt on and shut hood done
In my opinion, just about any carb is good, IF it's installed and tuned correctly. Amazing how many people have trouble, but if you ask them where the directions are, they'll say that's the first thing they tossed out. Choosing the right carb for an engine is also important. I wish I had a dollar for every idiot in highschool that tossed a 750 double pumper on a stock 350 SBC. Just to say... "Hey! It's got a 750 double pumper!". And don't forget to count the guys trying to run a dual quad tunnel ram setup on a stock engine. It's easy to blame problems on a company, rather than admit ignorance.
They both have their strengths. An Edelbrock needs to have the top pulled and a couple of adjustments made. I set the floats square at 11/32" and the drop at 1 1/4", regardless of what the book says. Blow all of the passeges out gently with air, many times machine debris is hung up in there. Clean everything really good. Put the top back on. I back the curb idle screw out until the blades are shut, counting the turns it took. Then I set the accelerator pump link in the middle hole and bend and tweak the link to where the plunger is 11/32" measured from the plastic tip tp the carb top. Then run the curb idle screw back in the number of turns it was originally. Look at the transfer slots on the primary side, they should not show more than .030 or so, you may need to idle it up running, but .050 is as much as you want or the mixture screws quit working. Set the the mixture screws at 1 1/2 out and most will likely run best at 1 1/4. If you have an electric choke, don't use an ignition source, go to the alternator. If a manual, which I prefer, just get it to where it closes and opens all the way. if you use rubber hose to connect it point it down while you are cutting it, and try to not leave any that can get in the carb. It should be fine for the next 10 years. On the Holley, the only complaint I have are the needle and seats. Grose Jet may still make them but they make a fine replacement needle and seat that doesn't hang up like a lot of stock ones do. Most Holleys really just need the needle and seat adjusted to where you can rock the car and a little fuel sloshes out the sight plug hole. What hurts most is overtightening on previous rebuilds. And the powervalve needs a kit to prevent blowing in case of backfire. Keep in mind that the screws in the bottom and an open plenum expose the screws to dropping into the intake while running. I put some High-Tack sealer on them and tighten them, they are less likely to back out. A little dab will do. Just some thoughts. I can make either work fine. The Edelbrocks and Carters have given me less trouble for everyday driving through the years though.
I know you aren't directly referring to me but carb "set up" has nothing to do with my problem, I even have a heat dissipator under the Performer. I've run the old Carter AFBs and Holleys of all types with no problem and have even resurrected carbs others gave up for junk. My absolute favorite is the Rochester QuadraJet. I do not like spreadbore to squarebore carb adapters otherwise the Stude would have had a Q-Jet on it a long time ago. I need to add that my kid had a 600 Performer on a 460 in a Ford 4 X 4 and that carb was rock solid reliable. I set the mixture on it when he first got the truck and we never touched it again. It was old then but worked flawlessly. That's part of the reason I bought my 500 and like I said I'm going to use it on something else but in the close confines of the Stude engine bay it just isn't cutting it.
Edelbrock for the street , put it on , fine tune and drive ! Holley is better for drag racing . If you use for the street you will need to fine tune and change things often . Grant is good but cost more . Stick with an Edelbrock ! You already know how good they are ! I will sell you a good rebuildable 600 Holley for $50 ! The only Holley I like and will use on the street is the 94 in multiples ! RetroJim
Yes they are the same. Ive owned edelbrock and have a carter now. Carter actually makes edelbock carbs for them. Atleast the 600 and 750 anyway. Put them side by side. They are exactly the same.
I like Holleys personally for the tunablity ,but Edelbrocks work fine as well for street use .I say go with a Holley or a Demon if your buying a new carb...
Absolutely correct. Although "it ain't rocket science"...it IS science and it's the exception rather than the rule that you can take either the Edlebrock or Holley out of the box, fine tune it, and it'll be fine (forever). Too many variables - every engine is different. Altitude, barometric pressure, ambient temperature, humidity, etc. all play into how any given carb reacts. Many of these carbs are race-bred that have found their way onto the street. Most come out of the box way too "fat" as a way to ensure the end-use doesn't run lean and burn a piston. I've run Holley double-pumpers, single pumpers, dual-fours on blowers, etc with success. However, they all need a tuneup for any given condition. If I would run from WV to OK or FL, I'd need to tweek a bit in OK or FL. Same applies Spring, Summer, Fall. I've tuned a bunch of carbs for friends w/ Edlebrocks too. The science/physics apply universally if you want your engine to perform optimally and live. Most folks want to run too much carb and end up fouling plugs, washing down the walls, and trashing rings. Typically (for the street) less is more - one of the reasons the Q-jet worked well - its primaries were small and jetted correctly (relatively) w/ vac secondaries...except most of us many years ago removed that and hence the term "quadra-bog." So, the short answer to your question: I like the older Holleys....whew!!
Most any carburetor will need tuning and adjusting on the actual engine it will be ran on. Some require less then others but at the cost of performance. Our carburetors are set up in series that include a group of specifications to try and get them closer but choosing the right size carburetor is the first important step in the process.
None taken at all Fred, like I said I know you didn't specifically mean me. BTW, I don't work for my old employer anymore so no more trips to Sealy. I guess I won't get that ride in the T now. Glenn, aka "Hippie"
Back when I didn't know any better and was too impatient to figure it out I swapped my holley on a 289 for an edelbrock: turn key and go. This time around I wound up with a Holley on a 289 again and was determined to figure it out. The online manuals were invaluable and now that I have everything dialed in the holley works great! I've heard holleys are better for fine tuning/ racing; edelbrocks are better for plug and play daily driving.
One more thing on an Edelbrock that helps alot with percolation and draindown is a regulator. I have an electric fuel pump and a regulator set to 5 psi. It works great in all weather, and under any throttle conditions. I wouldn't doubt that a Holley would like it too, but its almost mandatory on a Carterbrock.
If you want the best performance run the Holley, if you are less concerned with performance, and want a little better gas mileage get a Edelbrock.
Thats a good point. My favorite Holley is the 750 DP I have had forever with the downleg boosters. Its is without a doubt the best carb I have for performance. I am putting together a 12:1 401 ci FE with a PortoSonic single plane and a set of heads ported by a fellow who does a lot of Super Stock porting. That will be the carb for it. I have a 750 and an 800 Carterbrock as well tuned as I think you can get them, and there is no way either will stay with that 750 DP performance wise. But they do both get mileage that would amaze you. But if I had to choose between a VS 600 Holley 1850 and my Carterbrocks I would pass on the Holley, they both outperform one and get better way better mileage. I am not really sure the AFBs really flow what they say they do, because there is so much junk in the way, but the 750 or 800 I have I would say beats a 600 universal Holley in both regards. But that 1970 model 750 DP will blow either of them off the road. It is just one helluva carb. I like it better than an 850 DP, because its still crisp down low, but will blow about any motor to pieces on rpm ability. Unless you are feeding 500+ inches, that old 750 DP will get it done. And I wouldn't be surprised that measure for measure it would still get the job done. I had it on a real LS-6 454 Chevelle-4-speed and he blew it up with that carb because it revved like a small block.
Well it looks like it's a toss up between the two as long as its tuned properly. It was mentioned that the Eledbrock works best on a stock engine. I ran one on a stock 305 and it worked well. Although I don't know much about the internals of my 327 I know it's been warmed over. I don't plan on drag racing.............well at least not intentionally. I really wish I could figure out TPI. It made great power but For some reason cylinders 1 & 2 wouldn't fire. A noid light showed they were firing as they should and the injectors were new. The hot wire from the battery burned out and after replacing it, the thing hasn't fired since. I know it has to be something simple but the darned thing has me frustrated!!
take them apart side by side.....they are not the same. been there done that, exactly my point. would you like pictures?
OLD carters and NEW edelbrocks are different. But I havent seen a new carter for a couple years now. Ditto on the edelbrock "AFB" for the street...Holleys for the strip. P.S. big ole' haulin' rigs seem to work better with Holleys too. But I like the set 'em and forget 'em factor of the Edelbrock
Put a couple of Eldelbrocks on my blown 355 SBC because I already had one and got a super deal on another and have never looked back. Got their tunning kit for each one and played around with jets, needles and springs based on recommendations that came with the carbs till it ran just right. All the Big Boys said they wouldn't work cause the blower would screw up the vacuum signals and that I needed Holleys. BS! Besides I didn't want to spend my days cleaning fuel stains off the blower.
Some guys really need to learn to tune a carb. They are not ready to go out of the box. If you base how good a carb is on how it runs right out of the box then you are fooling yourself. Hell I won't put any carb straight on out of the box. They all get opened up for some float checking and cleaning. And the Edelbrocks are a very tunable. As tunable as the Holleys, it just different to do it. People just don't take the time to learn how to do it anymore.
I agree with crush1776. Holleys are good for racing and edelbrock for street use. Just be sure to use a carb the right size for the cubic inches of the engine. Most think bigger is better. Not so.. If sized correct either will do the job.
The Jalopy Journal
