Up front - yes, I've already searched the HAMB tech articles and Scooter's Hemi tech... but I need some in depth knowledge and experience..so here goes the question - I'm building a Plymouth 260 Poly for my '49 Special Deluxe. (here's a look at the thread- http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=360864) I want to be able to cruise at highway speed when it's all done. As it is, I don't think my current 3spd trans isn't going to cut it. I have been looking everywhere for a mid-50's MOPAR overdrive tranny, but they just aren't plentiful. Heck, if Wildcat, with their 800+ MOPAR donor cars, doesn't have one, I'm beginning to lose faith. This brings me to my decision.... Either I put a 4 spd (floor shift) in there, or I get a Ford/Chevy 3spd o/d and adapt it. Each has their costs and downsides, but they get me better speed/mileage/driveability. I would like to keep my column shift (call me nostalgic), but if the preponderance of the evidence trends towards going with an A833 trans (or similar 4 spd), I guess I'll just start cutting holes in the floor. Right now, I have a line on both an A833 4 spd and a Ford 3spd o/d Toploader. Both can be had for +/- $200, and the adapter kits (Wilcap/HHH/etc..) are all about the same. When it is all factored out, will staying MOPAR (but cutting a hole in my floor), or going Ford work best? Are there other considerations that I'm missing? Has anyone run a combo like this before? I appreciate any and all experience/input/opinions.
Putting a 4 speed in it isn't going to make it run faster. You need something with an overdrive and also look into changing the rear end to a higher gear set. Something in the 3.30 to 3.08 range. I'm a big fan of the T-5. They are cheap, easy to rebuild and adapters are available for any motor.
Well, as you already discovered, the mounting pattern is the same for yours as any other Chrysler Hemi, so you're good there and this leaves the door open for a ton of transmission options. There are a bunch out there and it looks like you have a few in mind already. I think it all comes down to personal preference in the end. Prices will definitely depend on where you shop as well. Sometimes you can get lucky and just score what you need off of Craigslist because someone is just trying to dump parts. So price is going to be all relative. I would suggest just finding what you like in a manual transmission and go for it. T5's are indeed plentiful, as already mentioned, and adaptation is a snap. But as you've already found, there are others out there. Send 73RR a message (Gary). He's got something up his sleeve right now for a Mopar overdrive transmission adapted to a chrysler. Check with him to see how he's doing. Maybe he will have a solution for you or maybe he'll even chime in about it. Again though, I think in the end it's about personal preferance.
Hi Scott, yeah I'm still working out the flywheel details for the Dakota 5-spd. When I have a package I'll post the info. As you correctly note, trans adapters are all about personal preference and alot of folks jump to the t-5 because they are pretty cheap at the u-pull-it. That, of course, then requires one of the few available, short input shaft Mopar bells and a matching flywheel, or a call to Pat McGuire. Yes, the enterprising hotrodder can make his own adapter plate for a gm/ford bell but then a custom flywheel is still required for the bell/starter combo. In Pete's case, he really wants to keep the column shift so his options are limited to a 3-speed O/D. Good 'ol Mopar used a few 3-speed trans up into the 80's but few of those with O/D so, although it is possible to keep the adapters to a minimum by using a Mopar trans, finding the correct unit could be elusive. A gm or ford trans could be used if he has one of the short input shaft transmissions now. Brigrat has posted his t-5 conversion in another thread using the short Mopar bell, and a ford or gm 3-speed would follow the same process. Using the old Mopar bell, matching flywheel and starter saves a pile of money! The usual problem is in finding the 'short' bell. Maybe one of the guys over at www.p15-d24.com has a spare to sell. In general terms, an adapter, of some kind, is always going to be needed when putting a late trans behind an early Mopar engine, either v-8 or inline. In Pete's case, the 'adapter' could be as simple as the modifications required if he uses an early bell ala Brigrat. A late Mopar trans and bellhousing somewhat simplifies the process by allowing the use of a 426 Hemi flywheel (or an early modified flywheel) instead of a custom wheel but the block adapter is still required. The brand-x gm adapter assembly not only uses a block adapter but a special flywheel to match the bell/starter package. Happy to discuss this subject, just send a PM. Gary .
You might want to consider using a Mopar 833 OD 4 speed trans from a 75 through 80 Dodge Dart, Plymouth Volare, etc. No trick parts needed....it can be used with an adapter kit like the one I manufacture, or any of the other early hemi to Mopar std trans kits out there. They are plentiful, light weight, and will work well behind a moderate HP combination.
Well, when it rains, it pours... I found a 3spd o/d from a '76 Dodge p'up. Anyone know if the slant-6 bellhousing can be adapted to fit a V8 hemi-poly block?
OK...here's the imagery on the trans... Guy claims it's a 3spd o/d off a '76 Dodge truck, but it looks a heck of a lot like an A833 to me. Experts out there??? Anyone??
it is. if its a big block it has 23 splines on the input, thats doubtful though. i think sixes and small blocks had 18. mopar got the overdrive by flipping reverse for final drive. pretty good trans and cheap/easy to work.
hemi hp trans had 18 splines - others 23 has the option of a automatic from a late 50's early 60's mopar been thought of? early 60's aluminum 3 speeds are fairly easy to come by, pusbuttons are cool and the 63-64 vintage has a cable operated park brake that can be adapted to your dash with a stock lever tucked away underneath, Imperial services in MI has conversion cables and there are lots of good deals on pushbutton shifter mechanisms out there, just need to poke around. most shifter mechanisms are 10-20 bucks on any auction site. just a thought
833's were available as both direct and OD setups. The OD trans can be distinguished by the fact that the shift levers on the side cover are pointing opposite directions, one up and one down. The direct geared one have both pointing the same way. Third gear position on the OD is actually OD, which is why the lever points the other way. Otherwise, "high" would be toward the dash, with third (direct) being back toward the seat. They are a fairly good trans but there's a big jump between Second and Third, requiring a torquer engine to get past it. Ford did the same thing with their toploader.
Rats... So much for a 3spd o/d, that's a darned 4 speed... and it isn't going to work very well with my column shift. As for automatics...sorry, mbmopar.... not interested. I ditched the slushbox that was behind the Hyfire for a reason. I like my "three on the tree" Plymouth the way she is! Now, if I could just find a real 3spd o/d to hook up to her new/donor heart, we'd be rolling.
Also, all I've seen have an aluminum main case w/cast iron rear housing. Check the front bearing retainer. I think all OD versions of the A833 had a 5.125 diameter retainer and won't fit most clutch housings. But there are a few that work. I have one for my project that fits both the early A polys (not sure about the 260) and flathead 6. The trans mounting face has the right pilot hole for the retainer, but will need some welding to provide mounting bolt holes. It came from a 59-60 Dodge P/U. hydraulic clutch on the psgr side.
As far as overdrive three speeds; forget it. I say this because none of them were ever built with synchronized first gear, which I guess you could live with, but that era of transmissions were weaker, a lot weaker. You'd be better off getting a taller rear gear so you don't need the O/D, that way you could run an all synchro 3-speed on the column, the new motor will have the torque needed for everyday use. G.M. started using good tranny's in about '67, give or take.
Pete, the slant six bell will not work. As mentioned, there is one bell from the 59-60 era that has both flat-6 and early Hemi patterns and is suitable for the OD A-833. Maybe if you got creative with the linkage... But, back to the 'normal' 3-speed question and availability. This link might help in your search for the donor vehicle line. http://www.valiant.org/transmissions.html Or try this: http://www.drivetrain.com/parts_cat...r_dodge_3_4_5_6_speed_reference_material.html .
Gary - you're a font of knowledge. I have been trolling craigslist for mid-60's Valiants for months... glad to know I was in the right ballpark! I'm not dead in the water yet on a MOPAR 3 spd o/d, but should they really be this flippin' hard to source? I know one's going to fall from the sky one day (probably the day after I rebuild an A833 and cut a hole in Blue's floor to fit the linkage/shifter), but I've been looking since May - to no avail.
Pete, just trying to help out. I have had some problems with the second link posted above, some days it works and other days not...gggrrrrr Keep us posted on your search. Gary .
I went and bought myself a Dodge Dakota 5 speed... so this thread is about closed out. Gary's working out the last details on the 426 Hemi flywheel... so maybe this thing will be together after I finish up the motor this winter. Hey... a feller can dream...right?
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