40 sedan w/351w sbf, stock,edelbrock 600 carb,hei ignition. batteries (2 optima) in the trunk.Batteries are about 3 yrs old. 2/0 cable to the starter thru 2 ford trunk mounted solenoids. Runs fine, doesn't overheat. Sometimes doesn't want to start after stopping for a few minutes.Cools off, its ok. I've replaced the starter which seemed to help a bunch but its still kinda iffy. While its cranking I get about 2 volts drop at the batteries and about 2.5 volts drop at the starter. Voltage at the batteries is about 12.5 normally. no voltage drop across the solenoids. Voltage at the dist. is about 9.8 while cranking. Is this much voltage drop normal ? The batteries seem ok otherwise. Any suggestions ?
How is the ground lead run? I would be checking each and every connection on the ground setup. If it is grounded to the frame at the back and then from the frame to the engine block are all of the connections clean and tight and is all of the cable in good shape? Is the cable from the battery free of corrosion at the ends of the wire it's self? Same with the ground cables. <input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">
How close is the exhaust to the starter? I have a ford van with a 460 that I pull my race car with. Once it runs for a while, it won't start until the starter cools off. I would like to find a solution to this problem myself.
Both batteries are grounded to the frame at the rear. Block to frame at the front.Connections look ok tho I haven't actually removed/cleaned the grounds.Good thought, I will check that. The header on the starter side does pass close (maybe 1/2-3/4 inch). I did wrap that side with header tape when I replaced the starter. It has acted up once since. I have to confess I did a pretty sloppy job of it though. How long does that stuff continue to smoke?
i'd try running the ground from the batteries right to the engine block , in my opinion that will give you better starting over running the ground to the frame
I fought the same problem for over a year. Stop for a coffee at the 7-11 and it wouldn't start until it cooled down from the normal operating temperatures. Not over heated just normal stopped engine run up. I welded a stud on the frame for a good? ground when I built it. Trying to eliminate bad connections. I won't bore you with all the changes that were tried to fix the problem except to tell you that I tried them all and by moving the ground cable from the frame to the trans tail housing the problem was eliminated completely. People will say that with enough jumper ground cables it will be fine but I will never build a car with the battery ground going anyplace but the engine block or trans. case. Fighting a problem for a year can do that to a person. I forget who convinced me to try moving the cable but I was sure glad that I did. I did it reluctantly as I was convinced that the frame is a good place for a ground. It sure wasn't for me.
I had the same probelem on my Model A / SBC and tried the exhaust wrap first. When I checked it with the infrared temp gun the wrap was actually hotter than the rest of the pipe before the muffler. I contacted the wrap manufacturer and they said that would be the case unless I wrapped the entire exhaust system. WTF? I suggest that you try removing all the exhaust wrap and buy or fab a heat shield for your starter, make sure your timing isn't too advanced or get a new gear reduction starter (that's what I did). The gear-reduction starter will allow a bit more advance, will use less amperage and tolerate more exhaust heat than an OEM one. You didn't day what kind of starter you're running, but a rebuilt OEM starter won't last any time, as the heat-soak kills it real fast.
Clean the hell outta you battery cables, put them back on.....and do yourself a favor......put a big honkin' assed groundwire on those batterys andground that frame good......then groundfrom frame to engine.......(A weak point on Fords)........... build you a shield with twin thicknesses as a heat shield on the starter, and all shall be good.....yep....its a pain in the ass to do.......but you'll think its worth it after its all over with!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have just added a 1/0 ground from the batteries to one of the starter bolts. Each battery grounded to the frame at the rear. Battery (-)'s strapped together. Block grounded to the frame at the front. Just went for a test drive and letting it cook till I try to start it again. Doc The solenoids are in the trunk, then a 2/0 cable to the starter. I still get about a 2 volt drop at the battery terminals while cranking. i.e 12.5 v at the battery with no load, 10.5 v while cranking. I'm beginning to think heat is the main problem. Its just a rebuilt starter from AZ as was the last one.
If you roll under any modern car in the pick-a-part yard you'll find any number of fine heat shields of many sizes and shapes. You may even find a factory starter shield on something like police cars and taxicabs. These can be bought usually for pennies, you'll probably be the first to ever buy one! The good thing is they are quality material, often ribbed and edged and with standoff bracketry.
I would expect some drop due to the large amount of current even a standard starter draws. The ads for some of the gear reduction starters say they will draw 85-90 amps. The drop is temporary in that the battery voltage goes back to normal (12.5 v) when cranking stops. Normal ? Don't know.
Starts ok when cold. Timing is about 15 deg btc initial. I tried retarding it once when it was screwing up. Didn't seem to help so I don't think this is an issue.
It took me 4 lifetime warranty starters to finally get a good one from the Zone. This was for an O/T six cylinder AMC. Shouldn't you have battery voltage at the coil for crank-up? Thats' what the "S" terminal on the Ford solenoid is for. The "I" is for ignition,correct?
Last thing I did was add the new ground cable direct to the starter bolt. No problems yet but I haven't driven it much either. My have to wait till next summer as we're in a cool spell here now, only getting to the mid 90's now. I also cleaned all connections at the same time. I still read about the same as far as voltage drops are concerned. I'd still like to know if a two volt drop at the battery is normal or not. Specs on the Optima says it has 1000 amps cold cranking. So with two batteries I should be able to crank a freight train I would think.
So would you expect to see any drop at all ? Has to be some due to resistance in the cables, solenoids, connections. How much, I dont know.How would you determine this ?
had the same problem with my 460,started ok when cold but once it was hot i had to to wait at least 20 min to cool down..then it would start again. first i put proper heat shield around starter motor and battery cable,no better. replaced all battery cable(+ and -) with heavy duty 50mm.still using the same battery which gives 750 cca.start all the time every time.Old battery cable was getting heat soak,plenty of amps at rear but not much at the starter when hot. always go for the best battery cable available.
If you had a BBC, a remote solenoid would be the solution...may apply in your case too. http://www.oldengine.org/unfaq/solenoid.htm
The Jalopy Journal
