vintage 235 chevy speed equipment

6inarow here is what dad and me found. All we really found was an motor for sale with the intake on it so... Here is the link

http://www.tradingdock.org/1420

Says the following:

KBL Hercules Style Engine Out of a 1953 Chris-Craft Rocket. Triple (3) Down Draft Carborators, 131 HP, 236 Cubic Inch, High Performance Cam Shaft, Flat Head 6 Engine

^^^^^thats the description of the engine with that intake on it. I wish he would sell me the intake with carbs and air cleaners

My plans for the intake i have(the boats one) is to get it mounted on a 235. I wanna slant the bends back straightening out the carbs. I would then make the connection tubes and such. Fix the small cracks it has and see if i can get it chromed.

 

I would think the boat intakes are not that rare. Most boats back then ran 6's. Maybe just need to find an old boat source for some untapped potential???

 

SDRodder,

Once I realized I was indeed looking at a Hercules motor, I had to do some research.
Turns out, "Chris Craft KBL" = "Hercules QXLD".
I tried to look it up in my father's old Motors manual. Unfortunately, that only goes to "QXD", which means it was most likely manufactured after 1948 (date of the manual).
The "QX..." 6-cylinder engines listed in the manual showed displacements ranging from 190 cu.in. to 230 cu.in. and power ranges from 60-73 HP (Truck application).

More research turned up this pic...



That's a QXLD out of a 1957 17' Chris Craft runabout (possibly the same "Rocket" model as the one your manifold came from).
Notice the manifolds.
The intake seen here is stock Hercules.
It seems that 3-piece manifold of yours is probably a custom-built aftermarket item (Hercules engines weren't exactly popular with the hot rodders and engine builders).
May have been made by the boat's original owner, or may have been something specific to Chris Craft for the application, although that begs the question, why don't we see the same manifold on the engine in the above pic?

Seems like it was not that long ago that one could still get aftermarket louvered air cleaner housings at the local auto parts store, or at least through JC Whitney.
Is that no longer the case?



6narow

 

You might be on to something, but just like cars, the boat companies changed things from year to year. And their records on engines tend not to be as well documented. You hear stories about parts being specific for a set number of years, then some guy says he's the original owner of a boat the pre dates the known years by two years and the parts are original. A buddy of mine restores these old runabouts and I've heard similar stories all the time.

 

Good call. Didn't think about that one.
Could very well be the reason.

You still in Nagoya?
My brother was born there.



6narow

 

Thanks for the info u have given me on this intake. Dad and me pretty much dont know much about it just cause we bought it cause the price was right(60 bucks with 3 rebuildable carbs intake and linkage) and we only found the add i posted so its good to know alittle more. So u think this is an aftermarket intake? I can tell its not like homemade as it is a cast peice. Do u think it is a valued item under boaters or is it something that is kinda like a stock 235 chevy intake? My plans are to modifie it to fit a 235 which includes makeing new tubes fixing some cracks machineing the ports to 235 chevy size and getting the whole thing chromed if possible. At the moment its a really sweet wall ornament so i wont be touching this thing for a long time till i have saved enough money for a pretty sweet rod project so... I talked to my dads boss who knows alittle about boats and he said if u find out its a certain peice it could be worth alot(not really looking to sell it tho). Right now i am just tryign to find out as much as possible about it before i start moding it and then find out it was a big mistake.

As for the air cleaners. The air cleaners that are on that motor i posted a link too look to be vintage. Dad just brought home an old parts catalog from 1963 for cars from one of our parts stores(they are letting us borrow it) and one of the air cleaners for sale in there seems to match those 3. Yes i am a vintage speed and dress up fanatic lol

Thanks for all the info guys. Really helps me out.

 

Not sure, but I bet these guys would know:

http://www.chris-craft.org/discussion/viewforum.php?f=6

 

that helps out even more. Thanks a bunch i will check it out and see if someone can help me there on some more info on this one. Thanks again

 

A little off topic here but I was wondering if anyone knew what the spec or clearance should be on my lifter adjustment. I have a '50 with a 216. My lifters are clattering pretty good and I would like to adjust them. Also, is this done when the engine is hot or cold? Thanks.

 

ttt

 

From my ol' man's '48-'51 Chevy Truck Shop Manual:
.006" - .008" Intake
.013" - .015" Exhaust
Heavy Duty use - .010" In - .020" Ex.
All Hot

From my ol' man's '36-'48 Motors Manual (Truck)
.007" In - .014" Ex. - Hot

The Motors Manual also specs .006" for both, for timing (???).
I think you'll be fine setting them at .007" & .014".



6narow

 

I do think it is an aftermarket item ("aftermarket" as in, not Hercules), which was the reason for showing the picture.
Do I think its valuable? Depends. A collector might recognize it, despite the lack of markings, but personally, I think its most valuable to whoever wants to use it for whatever application they think they can make it work on.
...which leads us to, Do I think it'll work on a 235?
Maybe, maybe not.
I can't say for certain without seeing it in person. My advice, try mocking it up on a spare head.
Chevy manifolds clipped on until the '75 model year, when the inline six went with an intake manifold that was cast as part of the head (like a small Ford six). From then on, the exhaust manifold bolted on.
I think the "ears" on your 3-pot manifold have enough reach in them, but I wonder if they're thick enough.
Also, does the linkage allow the manifold to be placed on a 235 and have each elbow line up with an intake port?
If not, is it possible to modify the linkage to make everything fit and work correctly?
These are some of the questions I'd ask myself, if I were thinking about using it on an application it was never designed for.
So yeah, if you have a spare head laying around, try fitting the manifold to it and see if it'll work, or if you can modify it to work reliably.
Sounds like you may be able to locate the air cleaners. Good to hear,



6narow

 

Awesome! Thanks a million!! What's considered heavy duty use? That ol' girl can't take much heavy duty use.

 

"Heavy Duty work" usually entails any work in which the engine is pushed very hard, often.

In the case of a "Truck" application, it could be using the engine in a situation where the vehicle is very often loaded to max capacity, then pulls a trailer, also loaded to max. capacity.
If you rent the Alfred Hitchcock movie "Saboteur" (great movie, btw), there's a part in there where Bob Cummings character is picked up on the highway by a trucker.
The last scene we see of the trucker is him pulling away, as Cummings is dropped off at a ranch he is looking for.
Notice the truck has a trailer and doesn't pull away all that quickly, yet you hear many gear changes.
Although it seems (to me) to be riding just a little high, that truck could probably haul about 5-6 tons with that setup and that would be a pretty fair load to ask a 235 to pull.
Another example would be if the engine is placed in a vehicle who's weight capacity is so much that the engine barely satsify's the power needed to do the work, which is a little different from what I just explained.
I know, sounds a bit ludicrous, but it does happen, even today.
I used to work in the repair shop for a truck leasing outfit and we actually spec'd some of our straight trucks with 5.9L cummins engines.
At 42,000lbs., that was asking a lot of that little six and we often got complaints of no power on hills.
We eventually discovered it was the small engine being used and requested that the salesman inform renters/leasers that they may have to gear down on hills, more often than they may do normally.
I don't recall ever hearing complaints (or as many, anyway) when a similarly sized truck was outfitted with the 5.9's 8 litre big brother.
Lastly, "Heavy Duty" could also be defined as having the engine work in adverse weather conditions, such as extreme heat / cold or very dusty conditions (which is the actual reason for the existence of chrome piston rings).
Anyway, that would a few examples of a "heavy duty" application.

I'm sure you probably won't run across this scenario with your car.
I posted it more as a "max possible clearance", to give you some idea of the amount of "room" you have to work with.

Glad I could be of help.



6narow

 

Speedway has some cool 6cyl speed equip

 

we like the og stuff

 

that McGurk 5 carb came from me.

 

junior51,

Thanks for the tip, but I'm not familiar with "Speedway".
Is THIS the place you're talking about?


6narow

 

Just one more question and then I'll stop hijacking this thread. And this may sound like a stupid question but starting from the front of the engine, which valve is intake and which one is exhaust (first or second)? I hope I asked that right.

 

Speedway would be the last place I'd buy parts from.
Call http://www.patricksantiquecars.com/ and ask him why I'm not the only one who feels this way.

Patrick's in Arizona has personally helped countless of chevy 6 guys for many years and is as knowledgable and helpful as they come. Apart from the fenton headers and now intakes repops, he also introduced the 3.55 ring and pinion upgrade for the AD trucks.

Sillvertonguedevil, if you are confused about the intake and exhaust rockers, just look at the intake and exhaust manifold and line up the ports with the rockers...

 

bite your tongue. Patrick is the 6 cylinder man

Do a search here for Speedway and find out.........

 

From the front:

Exhaust
intake
intake
exhaust
exhaust
intake
intake
exhaust
exhaust
intake
intake
exhaust



Oh and Patrick is THE MAN! Don't deal with speedway. Patrick will get it right 1st time, quickly and at the right price. Ask me how i know!

Mark.

 

thanks

 

Thanks to all for the link to Patrick's.
Never heard of him, but I'll definately check it out.



6narow

 

Patricks & Stovebolt help me put this together with a 848 head w/ headwork, bumped up the cam, and some other goodies. Oh, and a 700R4 behind it

 

Haha

 

whent through patricks for mine, Denise is a great help. its a 54 model

bored .040
mild cam
split fentons
new lifter, pushrods

 

The manifold you have is the Chris Craft upgrade for the KBLengine. It is a QXLD Hercules internally. Have access to an Offenhauser manifold for 3 1bbl carbs. Would be interested in a tradefor your setup. If you could send me a picture of your manifold I would lkie to take a closer look at it. Have an old Gar Wood boat with that motor. Always looking for spare parts.

 

If it's the original motor it's a 216, check it out, maybe somebody has upgraded to a 235. Whatever the case, it would be a rare where a 216 still had babbitt rod bearings, unless it's been sitting around for 40 years, never been overhauled. Insert bearing rod conversions were on the market in the early 60s. I had one in '60, bought the conversion kit from Montgomery Wards. Unless you upgrade from the original distributor, the points distributor won't let it unwind, points will float, coil voltage recharge also breaks down, spark will diminish around 3000, the 216 will hold up to a lot of abuse anyhow. Get the fenton manifolds that have the larger ports to fit the 235, The dowel rings in the ports can either be left out or modified/stepped to adapt to both the 216 and 235. If it has good compression and oil pressure, wear it out first, no need to invest in another motor until that one shits the bed, then will be soon enough to put in a 235.

 

Good six info...