Bonneville Tech question.

I'm stuck in Iraq repairing uncle sams trucks but am planning a trip to bonneville with a co-worker. He is building a t roadster with a 6-71 blown 302 ford engine. The car should way about 2000lbs with driver. He really wants to get into the 20mph club. Assuming the car is somewhat aerodynamic
How much horsepower will we need?
What gear ratio and tire size?
What max rpm should work the best?
Should he use a manual or auto trans?
Overdrive or not?
Is a dry sump oiling system a must have?
Considering destroked engine for higher rpm durability.
I know these are general questions but even if someone has some math formulas that would help they would be appreciated. Our experience is different but both drag racers. Any real help would be appreciated. Chad

 

By the way thats the 200mph club!!!!

 

Not to discourage your friend, but to enter to 200 mph club, you can't just run 200 mph, you must set a record in your class at over 200mph. For instance, the current record in D/BGMR (Engine class "D", blown gas powered modified roadster) is a bit over 259 mph. In D/BGR (D gas roadster, less modifications allowed) is 214+. The requirements for roll cage, fire systems, and safety equipment, including suit and helmet, are fairly stringent and therefore, often expensive. However, it is fun, and addictive. It would probably serve you best to "lurk" a bit at landracing.com where many LSR racers hang out on line and discuss many areas of the LSR experience. When you get back stateside, make that trip to the Salt and observe and ask questions of the racers before starting to prepare the car, so you don't wind up going down some deadend roads (rules-wise). You can purchase a rule book through scta-bni.org which will help to fill those idle off-duty hours. Thank you and your co-worker for your service to our country and I hope to see you on the Salt. vic

 

I have a friend who has a streamliner that went 236 mph, he is pushing 750hp plus. In a non streamlined car figure on 1000hp to break a record and get in to the 2 club.

 

Check out this web site for all your questions. www.landracing.com/forum/ These guy have all the answers concerning tech rules a.s.o. they will also have answers as to how much HP you will need and just about every thing else

 

Like was said above, he HAS to have a rulebook. The requirements are totally different than 'drag racing'. Bigger tubing, very close spec on roll cage, far more safety equipment required. Cars exceeding 200 need some high dollar tires, certain wheels, lug nuts, on and on. There is zero chance it will pass tech if its built without complete understanding of the rules.

Also, the suggestion to FIRST go look and ask questions is a VERY good suggestion.

 

http://www.wallaceracing.com/Calculators.htm
Here are some calculators to play with, there is one that deals with HP to Drag coefficient.
Stay Safe, Mike.

 

the way I read it, you don't have to break a record to be in the 2 Club...

Straight from the SCTA 2009 Rule book:

SECTION 18
BONNEVILLE 200 MPH CLUB

How does one qualify for membership in this famous club?

1. Fill out the official entry form froom a sanctioning body recognized by the Bonneville 200 mph club.

2. Prepare your vehicle to meet all rules and technical requirements of that sanctioning body.

3. Break an existing record or established minimum over 200 mph and you will have qualified for membership in the exclusive 200 MPH Club, joining some of the most distinguished names in auto racing.

 

F & S ... established minimums are for classes that do not have an existing record. The aforementioned minimums are established by SCTA. In those classes you must exceed the minimum which would in effect be setting a record. You still must set a record and be over 200 to get into the 200 MPH ... It won't be easy ...

 

Krusty is correct ... It will take years and lots of cash to build a car, pass tech, set a record, the back it up running the other direction and then pass tear down.

Joe.

 

Interesting... sounds like maybe some clarification may be in order. A red hat is a goal of mine as well, someday.

 

Thanks for all the info and the websites! We already have a rule book and a rolling chassis, I think he'll be happy if he passes tech and rolled clode to 200mph even if he wasn't inducted officially into the club. We'll lurk on those sites and dabble with those calculators thanks again. Chad

 

It also takes some time to get a competition license to be able to run over 200. Someone else can probably provide the stages of the various licenses. But they don't just let you go out and try for 200 on the first pass just because the car might be capable of it.

 

Its pretty clear.

Using a blown 302 in a T roadster, here's what you have to do:

Pick your class according to rules and run .001mph faster than.........

2 run average (both must exceed existing record)

BLOWN FUEL MODIFIED ROADSTER /BFMR
D Seth Hammond Kee Gustafson 261.292

BLOWN GAS MODIFIED ROADSTER /BGMR
D No Nitro Hammond Lee Gustafson 259.747

BLOWN FUEL ROADSTER /BFR
D Got'cha Greg Temple 241.848

BLOWN GAS ROADSTER /BGR
D OPEN MINIMUM 225.000

BLOWN STREET ROADSTER /BSTR
D Vintage Hot Rod Donny Cummins 208.800

306 cu in moves you up a class to "C" and it gets faster...............

And a couple of observations..... You have to imagine more than 200 in a T roadster, then just as you get used to that, do it on ice!!! That's about what driving on the salt is like at speed.

 

The most important thing, as has been said, is get a rule book and determine what class your car will run in. Then, equally as important, is building it to the rules. There have been a number of changes so get a current rule book. They are available now.

Go to www.bonneville200mph.org where you will find the class records and minimums for the 200 mph club. My favorite minimum is for bikes. unlimited streamliner/blown fuel. The minimum required by the 200mph club in that class is 370 mph!!! That means in order to get into the 200 mph club you have to exceed the motorcycle world record by 10 mph. LOL!!

You will also have to be licensed. Thats no big deal. First pass under 150 (I think) and a few more runs in incremental speeds and you have your license.

Please don't try and circumvent the rule or try to tell the inspectors its your head and you are willing to take the chance. Its their meet and you play by their rules. Build the car according to the rules and you will pass tech no problem. Bonneville is a long way to go to be told you can't run. The tech guys aren't there to try and stop you running. They want you to be as safe as possible and have a great SpeedWeek.

 

Actually the "Established Minimums" are set by the 200mph club and may be higher than the record in the class. For example if the record in C/BFMR was 199 and the record in E/BFMR was 254 you would have to run way over 200 in C to join the club. The 2 club has a web page and lists thier minimums I think. Also and T roadster will have to run as a Modified Roadster or a Street roadster. It may not run in gas or fuel roadster class.

 

The SCTA have minimums for El Mirage. Open records at Bonneville have no minimums. The 200mph club set their own minimums for membership.

 

I talked with a guy named Norris Anderson (I think?) that runs a Stude Modified Pick-up.
He bettered his own record and went 206 if I remember correctly, this was over his previous record that was under 200mph. I thought that he was in the 200 mph club and he told me the the club members said he would need to go over 218 to be in. That will be hard to do in a full bodied vintage pick-up.

 

i know seth and lee and that roadster had a very expensive small block and was very unstable did a couple of donuts at 200+ they have since sold that car and the new owner put a wing on it and it settled out

 

Being 2000 lbs may not be an advantage...as Ron Joliffe says (and he'd know haha)..its not IF you spin a roadster..its WHEN you spin a roadster..>Read the rule book carefully, its one of the most vague yet enforced rule books I've read...understandably so. I also learned to take everything you think you know about setting up a car and throw it out the window...Drag principles and land speed principles are not the same...I'm not an expert, having been there3 years, but I have crewed for 2 teams( both deuce roadsters), one of which I was a fabricator as well as one of the drivers...WELCOME TO THE ADDICTION KNOWN AS LAND SPEED RACING...DRAG RACING WILL SEEM BORING ONCE YOU MAKE A PASS DOWN THAT SALT..HAHA

 

To clarify things a little bit.

The "200 mph Club" and the "SCTA" are different organizations.

To set a record with SCTA, you need to exceed their published records, which are in the rule book.
To gain membership in the 200mph Club, you have to set a record that exceeds their number. It is not always the same number as SCTA. Go to www.bonneville200mph.org to see what their number is for each class.

 

MY advice, would be first ,try to build a safe car that will pass tech (no small chore) second go racing, third have fun....................then look at a record run

 

Lots of good advice, thanks one and all. I'm worried the car is too short but hey it is what it is!!! Later Chd

 

Get the rule book go to www.landracing.com/forum and ask questions. Check out Sumner's web site
http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/sumnerindex.html
He has the build up of our Studebaker and story of how we
made our licinse passes. There are a lot of info about Bonneville. He has detailed story of his Lakester. Lots of links. He has started a referance of car numbers and pictures. You will have a good time . It is addictived.


974 "Just Glad to be Here"
B/BGCC 249.945 Record
200 MPH club
Hooley

 

Just how short is the wheelbase? The minimum for class D is 105".

Your other questions have pretty well answered. The T cannot run in Fuel or Gas roadster class. Bonneville 200 MPH club minimums are ususally higher than the existing SCTA record, see 370 MPH minimum for motorcycles. We'll have to work on that one.

The list of questions you had in post #1 are pretty much personal preference. Use what you know and adapt to the salt, you will be fine. The suggestion to use the resources at www.landracing.com is a good one, take advantage there.

DW
SCTA-BNI Record Certification
Bonneville 200 MPH Club VP

 

I too want a red hat...Lucky

 

I don't know if it matters but its actually an A roadster! I guess its a late 27 or maybe an early 28. I think I assumed it was a T because the term is used so much. I really appreciate all the advice and input. Chad

 

I dont think it is too hard to get in the 20mph club

 

Thank you for your service to our great nation.

Now put on your thinking cap, what could be less aerodynamic than a t- roadster? It's not as easy as the movie makes it look. Check out the speeds for Roadsters, they aren't messing around! If it is just the number you are after, a slippery body is way easier to go fast.
http://www.scta-bni.org/SCTA-NewWeb/Bonneville/BNIrecs_cat_b.htm

 

I got into a lot of trouble with a 200 club member when I told him if I went 371 on a bike and someone came up and handed me a 200 red hat I'd tell him where to stick it! LOL!!