What outside temperature => cracked engine?

What outside (cold) temperature do you start worrying about cracking an engine if it has just water (no antifreeze) for the coolant? Will draining the water take care of the potential problem completely, or is it likely that residual water would be enough to do harm? It's s'posed to be down to 11 degrees F.

Thanks,
Kurt

 

You always need some antifreeze to keep the rust down if for no other reason. If it was 11 degrees here I would be concerned.

 

It's suppposed to be -15 here on Tuesday, I just checked the antifreeze in the Dodge that's in my garage.

 

the time invested to post your question and follow up to see the answers is far greater than the time necessary to put some antifreeze in your car. Don't take a chance!

 

Blew the frost plugs out of my 302 in my garage a couple years ago and I didn't think it was below freezing. Go out there now!!!!

 

Add some AF even if it means pulling the T Stat to put straight in the block then open the pet cock or lower hose until it drains. & pour it back in the jug Nothing lost possibly a whole lot gained . PS straight AF will freeze! Mix 50%

 

At the price of batteries these days you don't want to leave a decent one that went dead out in that temp either. Beast to get them on a charger or in a warm place. OB

 

All of the above, and to add some insurance until morning, get mamas iron prop it up against the oil pan with something not flammable, put it on 'rayon', medium heat, and plug it in. Lay a blanket over the top of the motor, tomorrow morning it will still be warm.

 

It's tomorrow night that's supposed to be 11* F; tonight's forecast is 31* F. I'll drain some water/rust out tonight. I wanna flush it out before adding antifreeze, add heater hoses, and maybe even figure out if my system is set up properly because it overflows easier than I suspect it should.

Thanks,
Kurt

 

You the man, Planning a day ahead of time!

 

I lost a nice 389 to 28 degrees and I had ran it before I went to bed. In the morning there was ice sickles hanging from it.

 

If it's a Chevy or GMC 6, about 34 degrees ...

 

I have a lot of equipment with gas and diesel engines here and I make sure everything has 50/50 anti-freeze and water in it when it gets 32F or less. Busted blocks and heads are WAYYYYYYYYY to expensive. Anti freeze is cheaper

 

You havent a prayer. I cant understand why you are even discussing it. I have a friend who runs a machine shop and does mostly marine business. 90% of his work is replacing blocks cracked because the engines werent wnterized. He loves guys like you. Saving $15 to spend $3000. Some of his customers go through this every year.There is no wiggle room. When water freezes it expands and since it cant move it busts out. You could put a jar of water on your front step. When it breaks then you will know it was too cold that night for your block and can order a replacement. Your playing russian roulette with a bullet in every chamber.

 

Uncle is right, always have 50/50 mixture of coolant in rad. 53 csb

 

There are some questions that I just don't understand. 32 degrees is when water freezes. If you drain the water, you are half home to winterize the car. Replace the water you drained with 50% antifreeze, you are now finished and winterized.

 

Exactly my thoughts - water freezes at 32°F !

Just to expand a bit on hotrod1940's excellent response, when you drain a block by opening the radiator drain and block drain(s), it doesn't necessarily get rid of ALL the water. Low spots can still contain water which will freeze and could cause trouble. Spend a few bucks, drain the water, fill with a 50/50 mixture of GOOD antifreeze and run the engine, if possible, up to operating temperature to make sure the coolant is well mixed.

 

I call bullshit on this one!

I don't Know what there selling down there in Missouri but the chart on the bottle of cheap stuff I have says that 50% protects to -34f and 70% protects to -84f if ya were good at math that chart would proly prove ya wrong one this one.

Or at least wrong for all or most outdoor temps on this planet.

 

http://www.peakantifreeze.com/tech/tech_c.html

" Water is an excellent conductor of heat. Glycols are not as good of heat conductors as water. As the concentration of glycol increases, the heat transfer ability of the mixture decreases. This change in heat transfer is not a problem. During engine and cooling system design the heat transfer ability of the coolant is taken into effect. What is important is not using a fluid that is outside the cooling system design parameters. Modern engines are designed to run with a glycol - water blend between 40% and 60% glycol. Using a coolant outside these limits will cause the engine to run at the wrong temperature. This change sacrifices engine performance and leads to other problems.

The second function of an antifreeze is to protect the metals in a vehicle's cooling system from corrosion. Antifreeze is able to perform this function by the addition of inhibitors. Inhibitor types vary depending on the type of antifreeze. Inhibitors can be of many different forms including organic and inorganic chemicals. One thing that is common with all inhibitors is that they are designed to work in a water solution. The addition of water "activates" the inhibitors, allowing them to protect the metals. For this reason it is important to always mix antifreeze with water in a vehicle’s cooling system.

As the name implies the third main function of antifreeze is to protect the cooling system from freezing. The way to achieve maximum freeze protection differs between ethylene and propylene glycol. For ethylene glycol the maximum protection is at 67% ethylene glycol in water. A ethylene glycol solution of this concentration will freeze at -84° F (pure ethylene glycol freezes at 8° F). Propylene glycol does not freeze. It experiences a chemical phenomenon known as supercooling. For this reason there is no freezing point of pure PG. Due to the heat transfer and inhibitor activation reasons discussed above, PG antifreeze should also be maintained between 40% and 70% in water. Boil over protection with both glycols increases with glycol concentration."

 

Ha ha.

It's called "Just-In-Time". And, I added a gallon of antifreeze to my inventory last night.

 

What about the technical aspects?

Do freeze plugs not work?

If there's space for the water to expand, as in when the level is low, how is it going to crack?

Thanks,
Kurt

 

Just try it. Let us know how low water workes

 

Any temp below FREEZING wil crack a block! We have a 1939 Allis Chalmers tractor we use at my deer camp in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan. Evey year when we leave camp we drain the fuel and antifreeze. It's been there since 1962 and every year when we go back to camp we put in fuel, antifreeze, change the oil and install the battery. It'starts like it was running anhour ago. Preventitive maintenance is your friend. BTW, it was nine below zero (F) when we left camp this past Nov. 22

 

As a welder i would say don't use antifreeze

 

just checked all 4 cars were good!!

 

I recall a sad story from Feb 1962. I had just gotten back home (to central Oh) from Guam and my old Buick wasnt winterized. Over the previous many months it had lost coolant from over heating and the PX did not carry antifreeze (why bother) so the radiator was probably about 99.99% water. I was beat after 3 days of driving from Frisco so I decided to flag the maint till another day. I ate and hit the sack.

That first nite it got down to 20 deg. Didnt crack the block but did rupture the radiator ;-)

There are other things to be concerned about....

 

A $20 magnetic block heater does wonders. I keep one around for cars that do not have a block heater wired in. Going to use it on my garden tractor/plow tonight.

 

Among those other things to think about is the heater if the car is so equipt. Most will not drain completely and they make a big mess when the leak all over the insides. Use anti freeze whenever temps get to or below freezing. The 'freeze' plugs are not there to allow frozen water to blow them out - they are there to allow the sand used in casting to be removed from the block.

 

On chevies theres these little pipe plugs just about 1" above the oil pan rail, one on each side. If you take these out, you can replace them with brass petcocks. This way you can really get the block drained out.

Now, if a person is not action oriented enough to dump a gallon of anti-freeze in a radiator, he will probably not be motivated to do the petcock mod, so, no real help there.

If you just have water in there, don't worry, it will all drain out the cracks in the spring.

 

Where did I say I'm keeping water only in it?