Big three bail out

This is yet another post about this and will be deleted im sure.

Its BS ,,they have (as all other car makers ) had plenty of time to readjust
to the needs and choose to ignore. GM withe Hummer after Hummer series
all the Yuppies buying the big look at me cars etc etc.. Other companies saw the light and built the cars for todays economy.. This also will not mark THE END as they will still need to make parts for all the cars on the road now.

Jobs lost ,,yes. but that is in all sectors now.and if you save the Auto workers
Then who's next ?? and if you don't save others someones gonna cry FOUL

They are huge Corps. who chose not to adapt,,let that be there undoing

 

I watched my stock in qwest communications go from $60 to$1. Why no bailout for a company that served 13 western states? The only way I could be for any kind of help is if the top 4 tiers of management were publicly flogged. I'm sick of hearing that the unions are the problem. Their contract is a bargained for thing, and the company knows what the cost of labor will be for the next three years. If they didn't think they could handle it, why did they sign.

 

Let's look at it that way, if my small business fails because of poor planing and management, I cant just ask the government for more money, why should they get it.

 

Its a double edged sword, we are screwed either way! The UAW is what has driven the cost off the chart and they have said "They will give NO concessions"

 

yea I know....my friends at PPG Cleveland were hit , aint got nobody to mix paint for.
Being in Trucking industry I have tightened my belt, runnin re-caps, set vehicle speed parameters to 65, idle time to 5-min etc. Hope to weather this storm.

Herb is a Fatboy

 

Maybe, but it doesn´t offend me as much as them bailing the banks out, who caused all this in the first place. GM, like every other business are feeling the results of the banks greed.

 

No bailouts (loans) for anybody!!! Ask yourself this, who is going to come to your house and bail you out if times are hard? NOBODY! Why should we have to pay this crap and where is the money coming from with a 10 trillon dollar deficit? Just print it up. If this goes thorough the value of your dollar will equal the peso in world markets. It's all bullshit and if you steal all the money from your companies (ceos) and fly to congress on you private jets to ask congress for corporate welfare you need your ass kick all the way to the border. These guys make 28 to 30 million dollars a year and where is their sacrifice? Anyway, it won't happen cuz these guys aren't about to help out the work stiffs, just the keyboard peckers in NEw York City that sit on the asses and make millions a year doing nothing. It's all bullshit. Who bailout Studebaker? Edsel? Henry J, and all the others that went to the way side? I'm sick of this shit.

 

hahahaha Such Passion, I love you...... Do your cookies come in Oatmeal Raisin?

 

Not to Union bash but the UAW really put it to them in the 90's. If there is no work,you get to sit in a room and get 90% pay all day.At least some go out and do community projects.Their biggest problem are their legacy expenses.The health care ,retirement aspects.That is why they need the $$$ now. Healthcare issues add over $1,500 to the bottom line of each car.The Japanese (now Chinese and Korean too), take this difference and put more into the car eg leather etc.
None of the manufacturers want to have anything to do with building in the USA. A neighbor works for one of the big three building/setting up plants.He said they are now building Russia.How much of this money do you thing would go to Americans? They have plants everywhere but the last one I saw built in the States was Saturn.
How about States where VW,Toyota,Nissan etc have plants.Aren't those Americans too? They have feeder industries too.
GM I think has 8000 dealers in the US.Toyota has 1500.They both have the same market share! (NPR Radio). GM can't change this so they have this structure that is waistfull .If they went into Chapter 11 all of these contracts can be renegotiated IE.dealers ,labor etc.
They were loosing market share long before the economy went down the toliet.
Remember when Chrysler got "bailed" out? What came out next? The K car ( I use the term car loosely).
BTW,I have always used Ford trucks. I have a Ford Hot Rod too.
End of rant.

 

Because you don't employ half a million people. I guess size does matter.

I kinda vote bankruptcy, Chapter 11 will 86 the union contracts and put the government more in charge. If they are loaning the money, they would be a pretty interested party in the Big 3's future, with wanting to get repaid and all. I hate to think we have to, but, we may have to. If they go under, its going to make the 1930s seem like a party.

 

Its like saying; "hey I cant make the 2nd payment on my 32 roadster. Can you guys bail me out and pay for the rest of it."

 

They signed the union contracts under threats of strikes. UAW is very effective at that game.

 

Loan or not, if they dont change the way the company is run they will still get the same results. Throwing money at a bad business plan never fixed anything. They are just too out of touch with reality any more.

 

Bankruptcy doesn't mean that these companies go away. It means that they are forced into long overdue reorganization and streamlining. The bailout will just put a band-aid on the problem and postpone the eventual an inevitable bankruptcy. The longer that these companies continue operating the way that they are forced to by the unions and the government the bigger the problem gets.

 

Chapter 11 isnt closing doors. I worked for a retailer that was under Chapter 11 for 3 years, and we came out of it due to hard work and doing what was right. If the big 3 execs fly their personal jets to meet in washington....I want to know where my bail out is? Dont I get a houses for free? You cant have people on the payroll that produce nothing. (Lordstown Ohio for example) Personal knowledge.

Dont want to see people loose their jobs in any industry, but I dont want the government running anything more than it already has destroyed (freedie mae and fannie mac to speak of two)

They were building cars people wanted. Classic Gm though, come out with the Camaro 6 years to late.

 

no bailout! My business is way down and I am going to be forced to probably close one location and lay some people off...it kills me to do this...but it's inevitable at this point and...you do what you gotta do no matter how big or how small...as long as they have a safety net they will act foolishly and the UAW will still have the upper hand...my .02 before this thread gets closed

 

Do you seriously believe it's the same thing? Wow. Are 2 million workers and countless companies going to fold if you lose your '32 roadster?

This is a loan that would be paid back with interest. Try reading a little bit about this thing. Good lord, the ignorance is deafening.

 

Well said !

The Big 3 are playing with International competition. They are the only auto industry with unions and pensions attached.

The bailout will only be temporary because nobody at the top is going to cut their million dollar salaries and bonuses in half. The unions will want their pensions and the company will continue to suffer.

The only solution is to file Bankruptcy and re-organize the entire company with no unions.

The same thing is happening with the airlines (altough they don't always deal with international competition). Southwest and Jet Blue are doing well because they don't have unions at all, the other big airlines do, and they are suffering because of it.

NO BAIL OUT!

You made the mess you are in, you fix it!

It's not like these executives couldn't see this coming, they are runnign a 20th century oraganization in the 21st century...... it obviously doesn't work.

 

As one of my club brothers so perfectly put it...After the AIG bailout everyone is in line with their hand out!

China is lending us 100's of billions of dollars because they know if we "fold" they won't be able to peddle there shit products anywhere else in the world. The sick part is it's our steel being sent there and made into junk that we buy back from them, so they can LEND us "our" money back. WTF, This has to come to an end.....but I don't see it getting any better until we as Americans wake the fuck up from this propaganda nightmare!!!!!!

 

I have bought American cars for 40 years. The quality and value of those cars has faded for 40 years. The companies are poorly managed over regulated and victims of a corrupt union. They must reorganize and make major changes to be competitive. Loans bailouts what ever you call them will only delay the inevitable and increase the national debt. The last car we reluctantly bought is made in Japan, the quality is superb, the dealership is outstanding, and the engine is very fuel efficient and not loaded with power robbing pollution equipment. The GM solution to pollution standards is to add a massive air pump to inject fresh air to the exhaust to pass the emission % requirements. The final result is more fuel burned to power the pump so less efficient, higher cost, and more total pollution but that’s government regulation just plain stupid. No bail out for the automakers. Let the industry reorganize so we can once again buy American.

 

There is one good thing about bankruptcy, the courts can re-negotiate the union contracts, which would of course help the situation.

But economists still theorize an auto manufacturer couldn't pull itself out of bankruptcy because people won't spend that much money on a car with a questionable future or warranty. That's why so many people think the loan is the best option.

 

I dont like to hear "bail Out" either, but its our 'boat' thats needing it! sadly this country is not in step with the whats happening in the world. We used to have ourselves as the best customer, well we are still best customers but of others products. We,ve sold out our jobs and gave our customers to the world market, so now thats who we work for.

 

Just remember, we already gave AIG bail out money. And they've already been caught spending over $400,000 in one weekend in Scottsdale, AZ for some meeting..... nothing ever changes!!!

 

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