Ok if i go and shoot primer and than a semi gloss black or flatened black paint on my Tudor. Will i have to remove it when i finally decide on a color? I want to get my body work done and put something on the steel to keep it from rusting. I havent decided on a color, i have a few ideas, but i will be just fine with it being a semi gloss black for a while. and i dont want to drive it around up here in michigan with just primer on it, with primer being so porous. any suggestions
You could do like a black basecoat if you decide to paint the car black later on. Paintin it something over the primer can really limit the color you choose to paint it. Like if you do the semi gloss then decide to paint the car white. then youd have to reprimer it white/gray so the black wont bleed through and give it a gray look.
I have a bright red truck that I want to paint grey. What do I have to do to the red paint before throwing a coat of grey on top? Neil
sounds like you're gonna have to sand off a lot or much of the "intermediate" color before you do the final base . Then you should seal that with sealer. Thats why they call it sealer. Recommend doing final in basecoat -clearcoat, BUT your first stuff has to be compatible with the last. Hey painters ...check in with your thoughts here
von rig. what kind of black are you going to put over the primer.. enamel-base coat-rattle can-lacquer??? and spooky dad what kind of red is your truck.. base clear? whats the condition of the paint too?
I don't want to hijack this thread. Should I start a new topic? Pictures of my truck are here: http://716heer.org/html/the_ebay_auction.html Neil
did you buy it or .. thinking on buying it .... looks like they just wet it down to make it look nice.
This is just a suggestion. Do your body work but not to the stage of blocking out the high build primer. After you do prime it with a couple of good coats, give it a couple of coats of black basecoat. Done. Then this will become the guide coat when you are ready to do the final blocking. It'll sand fairly easy and you will end up removing most of it but you had to block it anyway. Reprime if needed, seal it and paint it.
von rigg i agree with 38 ply. just bail the primer on . do a buncha coats then get black tint prime then you can seal and paint. primer should shit out that fast specially if you have a couple good coats on it spooky dad . sand it down with like 180-220 and prime it.
Hey, I'd finish your metalwork and prime over such with an epoxy primer. The PPG DPLF-90 is available in black. Shoot two wet over your job, allow the primer to cure, resand with 360 400 and reshoot a final coat of DPLF 90 that has been sightly over thinned. This will act as a sealer, give a semi- gloss sheen, and probably provide better protection than a clear coat in the short term. Swankey Devils C.C. "Meanwhile, back aboard The Tainted Pork"
Thanks guys, The colored paint world has so much to offer its difficult to choose. I dont know how people make that choice It may happen as i get it worked out, but at this time I cant settle on my colors. I will probably be using PPG products, ( because they are close to me) unless some one else has a better idea. I will also take your advise to body work it, prime it and most likely base coat it. maybe at that time when i chose the base coatings, I will have an idea where to go with my colors and will be able to base coat in those colors and keep moving on to clear coat them and be done.
I'd like to know why a lot of people here seem to think that basecoat paint is a good final coat? Yeah it's got the trendy satin look, in differetn colors, but Von Rigg wanted something that would hold up to the weather. Basecoat won't! It's nearly as porous as primer! Unless you live in the desert, it doesn't afford any protection from water intrusion, eventually leading to rust. Here in the Northeast, it's a real concern. I've finally talked guys who wanted flat black into either using Dupont's Hot Hues "Hot Rod BLack" which is a real paint, flattened urethane. Or flattening another single atage color. Or even using a black primer, putting 2 coats of black lacquer or single stage over that, and then a final coat of black primer again, just to protect what's underneath.
thanks chopolds..Im learning. and i was concerned about that issue with the base coat. I did have a painter once tell me "It will not hold up" to moisture or UV rays..over time with out the clear it breaks down. I have heard good things about the "Hot Rod Black" coating. would I be ok to eventually rough it up and paint over that once i get my mind made up?
So sayeth the GOSPEL--from chopolds. Paint is the BEST primer for protection from the elements, especially a good 2-part or catalized (with hardner) urethane, which is on top of a good 2 part primer, which is on top of properly prepared metal. Then when you pick out which color or way you want to go--later--just clean and sand the paint properly and you are ready for the new topcoat/color---it's that simple. MAKE SURE TO PUT PAINT ON TOP THAT IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE OLD PAINT UNDERNEATH. A little info on the DP epoxies--1 coat is about .5 mils dry film--which isn't very much protection--even 2 coats isn't enough. There are lots of higher solids epoxy primers, urethane primers, and polyester primers which apply at from 1.5 mils to over 5.0 mils per coat dry film, giving much better film build protection. When you read the tech sheet on primers and paint, always read it thoroughly and see what film build there is per coat (wet and dry) and LBS. per gallon of solids. This is how you find the BANG per BUCK of your primers. Oh yeah--take a test panel with 2 coats of DP epoxy that has dried for 1 day and pour a little water on it and let it stand for a while. It will show discoloring as it soaks up the water. It's not meant to be used as a topcoat for the elements. Also a rag with lacquer thinner will wipe some of it off for quite a while after drying. overspray
when ur ready for paint black probably wont be the best color u want for a ground coat, for some of the older colors that is, so u will need a tinted sealer. y put a primer over single stage or laq? just have the single stage as ur flat color. u can get it mixed like that or buy pre flattened. ya dp is a great product but at the same time its, a little finiky. if u want flat paint try http://www.tcpglobal.com/kustomshop/ksflatz.aspx
When you go to put the last phase of color to it, remember to put it over top of a uniform substrate. In other words make sure what your covering is the same all the way around, and if its black, and your wanting to make it a light color, you might want to paint it white to start with to give it a chance to "not be too dark"
I hope so..because ive got so many color ideas rolling around in my brain that i cant decide..i would really rather paint it and get it over with so i wouldnt have to take the body back apart to paint it right..it will be at the right point just before i go back to assembleing it..im leaning toward Black fenders, red body with black accents, and cream firewall or Black fenders and that dodge burnt orange (bronze) metalflake paint thats on the chargers..with the black as accents and cream firewall..those are 2 ideas floating around in my skull
Not to high-jack, But i have a question regarding this topic as well; Has anyone here used the POR 15 primer? Not sure If I should have used it at this stage of the game, but, the flash rusting part was driving me nuts. As you can tell, I still have a lot of body work to do on the old girl . I must say, She looks better and better every day.
why not go with white? Then when you decide a color later, sand the white to prep it and it will act as the primer for whatever you do later, and it wont effect the color. If its gonna be a while, have a local striper put some sexiness on the white - easy to sand off when it comes time for the final job. Cheers
+1 on the epoxy primer,that stuff will hold up for years.if you spray it right it will lay down with a nice semi gloss sheen.
y put a primer over single stage or laq? just have the single stage as ur flat color. u can get it mixed like that or buy pre flattened. I am not 100% sure on this subject, maybe another painter can verify this for me. When you flatten a color, and I have done this many times, the main ingredient is flattener is probably talc (porous!). Am I right on this? If so......then you are theoretically comprimising the waterproofing quality of the paint. And the more talc, the flatter the paint, the less likely it will hold off water intrusion. The weaker the film strength will be. When the factory put the flattened stripes on the muscle cars, they always seemed to put it over the base color paint. so it wasn't an issue in those cases...and perhaps they did that so the base paint would protect the car body, as the flat paint didn't. Again...correct me if I'm wrong on this!
todays flat paints dont effect anything. back then as u say it wasnt base those went over. they went over lacquer.
To Grits, don't use Por 15 on the body. Not because it isn't a good product but one day you'll be painting the ol' girl and Por 15 doesn't make any colored topcoats. You're going to want to use something that is in the same product line as the paint you will eventually be spraying. I highly recommend PPG's DPLF line of epoxy primers. They are great over bare metal and if you know the color you'll eventually paint her, you can get a color you can use as the epoxy and a groundcoat sealer for the paint. One gallon will take care of both of those operations. Hope that helps.
Everybody that uses DPLF needs to read and understand the "TDS" technical data sheet. Read everything, especially the metal prep required before applying and the film thickness of the dry film. DP products are not bad at all. They are not magic. https://buyat.ppg.com/refinishProdu...?BrandID=5d7b4ed7-f83a-4469-b68c-04551702a5df DPLF---"LF" stands for "Lead Free" not "Looks Fine". When you take the lead out of a coating it is safer, not necessarily better. The old DP had lead. There are other primers that will do a much better job for bare metal protection. Compare product data sheets and see what else is available to protect the metal. Always read the data sheets to help you get the best "Bang for the Buck". overspray
Yes, yes, yes. Speak english. Today's flatteners are made with talc. Ever let a can of flattening agent sit for a few weeks? Kind of resembles watery chalk. What is chalk made of? Talc. What is talc? Pourous. The stripes went over lacquer which protected the entire job. Therefoire making the flatteners not an issue in overall durability. The entire point to putting primer over a base is to achieve the look you all so desire while still maintaining the protection we all need. Its not that hard.
My .02. Spray it however you want to, but keep this in mind. Whataver you put on there is either going to be part of your entire job, or sanded off. If you leave it on, make sure its something decent. A chain is only as strong as its weakest link? I vote for epoxy primer. Unless you leave it out for years, youll be fine. When youre ready, sand it, reapply the DP90 (which is great stuff for the price) as a sealer (slightly overreduced) and you're ready to paint it however you want to.
The Jalopy Journal
