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Adding 220 volts, how hard is it?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Rick O'Shea, Jul 12, 2008.

  1. Rick O'Shea
    Joined: Jun 20, 2008
    Posts: 78

    Rick O'Shea
    BANNED

    I want to add 220 to my garage. Should I call a pro, or can I do it myself without burring down the house?

    Anyone have a "how to" for the electrically challenged?
    and yes, I did a search but found nothing....
     
  2. 220 --221 whatever it takes you know!!! Quote Mr.Mom. A wire here and a wire there nothing to it. Google 220 volt wiring and see what happens>>>>.
     
  3. Rick O'Shea
    Joined: Jun 20, 2008
    Posts: 78

    Rick O'Shea
    BANNED

    the H.A.M.B is the new google.....:D
     
  4. KJSR
    Joined: Mar 7, 2008
    Posts: 2,494

    KJSR
    Member
    from Utah
    1. Utah HAMBers

     

  5. KJSR
    Joined: Mar 7, 2008
    Posts: 2,494

    KJSR
    Member
    from Utah
    1. Utah HAMBers

    and if you want PM me for my # and I can give you more info.....
     
  6. krooser
    Joined: Jul 25, 2004
    Posts: 4,584

    krooser
    Member

    Go to your local big box home store and buy a book that ciovers the basics of wiring.

    It's pretty simple stuff... but you don't want to break the rules...

    I had only a minimal understanding of this stuff when I needed to rewire my kitchen and bath in 1990. Bought the book and nothing has burned down.

    I've since wired my shop from start to finish and it's pretty straightforward.
     
  7. Wiring is easy, just dont let teh blue smoke out of the wire!
     
  8. Von Rigg Fink
    Joined: Jun 11, 2007
    Posts: 13,418

    Von Rigg Fink
    Member
    from Garage

    Im sure you know this..but just in case you dont. Your house has 220 coming into it from the main feed..(your area may differ in amps)
    all they are doing to power all your "normal" plugs and appliances , is they "split" the 220, thus making 110V.

    you can go into your Breaker panel and see where the 220 feed comes into the box and Tie into that (with the power shut off to that feed)..run those lines over to another smaller box and add your chosen size of breakers in that box. Than run your 220 lines (correct guage wire) out to your receptical in your garage.
    now this is laymens terms, there are technical wire guages that you need to follow, breaker sizes you need to follow and code restrictions you need to know and follow , but this is the gist of it.
    you really need to read and understand , also look at diagrams as to how this is safely done. If you do not understand electricity or have a very good grasp of the engineering of an electrical system, you probably shouldnt fuck with it..electricians are not that expensive..when you conciter how much it will cost to replace all your stuff after your house burns down ,,because you didnt understand what you were doing.
    I can take pictures of my system for you..I have a 220-60 amp feed going out to my pole barn, and a generator back up system installed to run either my shop or my house or both in the event of a power loss.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2008
  9. bluestang67
    Joined: Feb 7, 2007
    Posts: 589

    bluestang67
    Member

    Get a book its simple but don't short cut codes do it safe. Is your main allready in the garage or in a basement level hopefully close to where the garage is . When you go to your local supply tell them what and where you planning the 220 install they will direct you on needed materials and code . Good plus is a electrictian offered his expertise.
     
  10. My Dad used to say, work a couple more hours doing what you know, and pay somebody to do something you don't know. I don't mess around much in that big electrical box.
     
  11. 38plymouth
    Joined: Apr 11, 2008
    Posts: 419

    38plymouth
    Member

    You'll probably want around 50 amp. Most houses are approx 100 amp service. Too many variables to factor in here so get an electrician to look it over for you. You may be able to run the wire etc and just have him hook it up.
    Most small welders & compressors will run off 20 amps each. Then you got a circuit for plugs and lights as well.
    You could get by with 30 amp if you put a welder plug on the compressor and use either or at the same time. It'll do in a pinch, especially if the house won't handle another 50 amp.
     
  12. 220V requires a minimum of 3 wires , although many circuits use 4 . Colored wires ,red and black , will be hot leads of 110v each . White is neutral and green ground . Neutral and ground are essentially the same thing which is why many circuits use just the white with no green . You'll need two linked breakers in your panel . Two breakers sitting side by side will be on different circuits thereby giving you 220V . Be sure to use the correct gauge wire to suit your needs . Internet research will give you that . When routing wire make sure the wire will not be vulnerable to damage from weather , impact , etc . Metal conduit is preferred if you need to run it in where it can be damaged . You can use a type of Romex in heavy gauge (at least 12 , 10 is better) if everything will be inside such as running it through the attic . On your outlets a brass terminal is hot , silver is neutral and of course green is ground , if you are using that . And as a side note , don't stick your fork in the toaster .
     
  13. MN Falcon
    Joined: May 21, 2007
    Posts: 566

    MN Falcon
    Member

    Wiring is not that hard. I do all of my own. I tend to be a little over cautious though when I do the work. When I upgraded my panel in the house to 200 amp and buried the wire I had to change the meter socket also, so I had the electric company pull back the old wires for a couple of days so that I could do the job safely. While I don't like pulling permits when I do major work with electrical and natural gas I do. The insurance companies will void you policy if it even looks like the problem was caused by work not properly inspected. The local electrical inspector he is a pretty cool guy also, he has let me get by with single inspections instead of rough-in and final.

    The book I always reference is called "Wiring Simplified" Richter et al. It gives a lot of the basic code info that you will need.
     
  14. Here's my $0.02 worth of advice:
    Lets say you study up on how to do it,then armed with all this newfound knowledge you complete the project...lets say it seems to work OK...you didn't fry yourself,no large flashes occurred,everything seems fine.....THEN some small problem causes a fire ,which causes the loss of your car,tools,building etc.....THEN...you find out you needed city/county electrical permit(and all the related hoopla) and a licensed electrical contractor to do all the work...then an inspection by the local electrical gendarmes..AND...because you didn't follow all the rules ,now your insurance company wont pay a dime for any loss...!!!!
    Believe me, it's worth the effort to look into all the legal stuff before you start

    Don't even think of asking how I know !!!

    Stan
     
  15. LUX BLUE
    Joined: May 23, 2005
    Posts: 4,407

    LUX BLUE
    Alliance Vendor
    from AUSTIN,TX

    That's all well and good, but You neglected to tell them Your toaster oven could be used to melt platinum. :D
     
  16. Rick O'Shea
    Joined: Jun 20, 2008
    Posts: 78

    Rick O'Shea
    BANNED

    very good advice..... it's the "what if's" that will get you. sorry for your loss
     
  17. Check your local codes. Here in South Dakota you can wire your own place if you are outside of any city jurisdictions. We have a local inspector that does a rough-in inspection before you close up the walls and then a final. I paid $75 for my permit and had the inspections done. He said I did a very nice job, gave a couple pointers etc.

    I also bought several books to compliment the ones I had and bent the ear of a pal of mine that teaches electricians at our local Technical School. My place has prob more electrical in it than many because EVERYTHING is electric including the cove heat. I ran hundreds of feat of wire!

    Ask around you may even find an electrician that wants to barter, thats What crazyD did up here when he built his shop.
     
  18. Ebbsspeed
    Joined: Nov 11, 2005
    Posts: 6,250

    Ebbsspeed
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Here's my "how-to" for the electrically challenged, which is what your question was. If you feel the least bit uncomfortable doing it yourself, DON'T!

    I do all my own, with the proper permits, inspections, etc.

    I've got a friend who "re-wired" his garage, which included some two-way switches for lights, and I couldn't believe some of the switch combinations he had to use in order to make things work. The switch in the hallway needed to be "up", and the switch in the garage needed to be "down" in order for the garage door opener to work, but the one in the garage had to be "up" for the outlets in the garage to work. Pretty scary, and I think lucky that he never had any damage done from his handiwork.....
     
  19. 49ratfink
    Joined: Feb 8, 2004
    Posts: 18,829

    49ratfink
    Member
    from California

    funny that a site where people cut up cars and weld them back together would suggest to someone to hire out something as simple as electrical.

    buy some books. go online. do it yourself. I figure if you are a car guy who can't figure out how to ad 220 to your shop you shouldn't be using anything powered by 220 anyway.
     
  20. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    220 wiring (or in some cases 208) is really pretty easy, but can be dangerous if not done correctly. The first and most important thing is to SHUT OFF THE POWER TO THE PANEL when working in the existing panel.

    Home Depot sells a really easy to understand wiring "how to" book that has each page laminated and has lots of pics. This is what I would start out with. It sells for about $15 and is well worth it.

    As far as what would be the way I would wire up the garage is how VON RIGG FINK suggested, using a double 60 amp breaker at the existing box and a sub box in the garage, which has the various double and single breaker for 110/220 outlets. Wiring between them should be #4 wire (for the two hots and neutral), along with the ground being green and no smaller than the next gauge used for the others, IE: 3x #4's and one green #6. Put the wires in conduit and make sure the conduit is big enough according to the book.

    Get the permits and make sure that you follow the book. Have the inspector come in before doing the button ups.

    Any questions PM me.
     
  21. bought a house many years ago that "was updated" in the electrical area by what i thought was a licenced electrical contractor and after the house had burned down found out the sticker on the panel box was off a different house that was owned by the guy i purchased the house from. the insurance company told me to "fuck off" as they had no record of the work done. was going to sue but the asshole had died 3 week prior. lost everything.
     
  22. art.resi
    Joined: Oct 15, 2006
    Posts: 214

    art.resi
    Member

    Get a permit and keep your insurance valid. Run a sub panel
    circuit to the garage and have power for all of your tools. You
    can do the work yourself and once the inspecter signs it off
    your'e safe and covered.
     
  23. 28chevrat
    Joined: Oct 11, 2005
    Posts: 322

    28chevrat
    Member

    Since were on the subject, where would we get the permit? Does anybody know what division of the city we need to contact??
    What does a California permit cost, anybody know?
     
  24. 392_hemi
    Joined: Jun 16, 2004
    Posts: 1,736

    392_hemi
    Member

    First off, if you're tapping into the main box for your house and it's only 100 amp service, there's not gonna be a lot left to work with. Second, as Turbo outlined above, should something happen, even for unrelated reasons, you're likely to be screwed by the insurnace co. if you did it w/o permits and not according to code. I updated my garage 2 years ago and added a separate 200 amp service and had it done by a licensed electrician with permits, inspection etc. Probably coulda done it myself with help from friends, but it's just not worth it to save a few bucks.
     
  25. 383 240z
    Joined: Oct 28, 2007
    Posts: 429

    383 240z
    Member

    Check out this site for ANYTHING garage related www.garagejournal.com they are a bunch of car junkies who have turned simple carports into garagemajals. Keith
     
  26. d2_willys
    Joined: Sep 8, 2007
    Posts: 4,285

    d2_willys
    Member
    from Kansas

    Most houses now days have a 200 amp service, with some having 400 amp service. Have your electric company determine what service you indeed have.:cool:
     
  27. 23 bucket-t
    Joined: Aug 27, 2005
    Posts: 1,366

    23 bucket-t
    Member

    no way, do it yourself, 220 volts going thru your vanes is a good thing, isn't it.... :rolleyes:
     
  28. 52HardTop
    Joined: Jun 21, 2007
    Posts: 1,078

    52HardTop
    Member

    IF you looking for a 220 line to the garage for a particular device, then maybe you can handle it. If you are looking for a sub panel to your garage to carry what loads you may have I suggest you don't do it. After reading all the posts and the range of opinions and "expert advice" I think it's better you find a car guy/ licensed electrician to do it for you. There are too many code issues to be aware of when adding a sub panel to a garage or detached garage if that is your situation. It ain't worth it if something were to go wrong. The insurance company only needs a reason to not cover your loss. You will give them plenty if you do this yourself.
    Dom
     
  29. rstanberry
    Joined: Dec 22, 2007
    Posts: 202

    rstanberry
    Member
    from terrell tx

    The fact that you asked is indication you should hire an electrician ! Too easy to mess up if you dont have the expertise. Much more fun to sit back, sip a cool one and watch. Then you'll know how next time.
     
  30. oilslinger53
    Joined: Apr 17, 2007
    Posts: 2,500

    oilslinger53
    Member
    from covina CA

    do you just want a 220 plug or or a sub-panel? its really easy, you can do it...let me know if you need a hand though. im not far (covina)
     

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