well I had a thread I started a short time ago. I was kinda getting to the end of it... and everyone bailed on me.. Maybe they'll be back.. but I figured I'd ask some DIFFERENT questions on this thread. If you guys come in here.. check the thread we started before. I am learning about this motor I bought. It is a "350"... chasing down the block numbers it comes back to be a 305 block. 14010203 and 355909 (two separate motors) Now I for a number on the side of the block... It had numbers in three separate lines (not a string of numbers all in one long line) It also had one of those 'clocks' they say you sometimes see... Anyway.. the numbers were A25 DN K31 Had the clock face... arrow poiinting to 5 and outside dot at top. Highlander told me the DNK is a 79 305 from a Camaro/Firebird Can someone point me to where this info came from... Not that I doubt it. I am new to this, and I am just trying to learn for future reference. Several guys said to "build it". I'm not sure what they meant exactly... Build it back as a 305. Build it as a 350.. or what. SO this leads me to w whole new series of questions... Am I to understand that these same blocks were used to build both 305's and 350's..?? Is it possible to a 305 and a 350 from the same block... CAN I build it into a 350... or should I build it into something (for example .30 over) I know I had to buy a shorter waterpump to fit in the space I had, and I told them I needed a water pump for a 350, and it fit exact... Lastly.. what parts are interchangle on them...?? thanks for educating me OH.. with gas being $4/gallon.. I am aiming for gas mileage on this deal. It's going into a streetrod pickup. I plan on putting in a 700R4 transmission. (will that still fit)... what I am wondering will a 350 be better on gas... more HP.. but works easier to pull the weight than a smaller HP 305 that might work harder...?? Just trying to learn and gather knowledge from folks that know. Don't want to spend big dollars building a motor,.. then find out LATER I did the wrong thing. All input appreciated
thanks.. I was hoping for at least 20 mpg when we started...?? thats when we were thinking it was a 350
305....mileage of a v8 power of a v6. You cant safely bore it out to a 4.00" bore required for a 350. If its a solid motor I would throw a mild cam, decent intake and headers on it and call it a day. All the parts will swap over to a 350 in the future if one falls in your lap.
I just went and measure my bore and stroke... All I got is a tape measure... but closest I can tell is it;s bore is 3.75,.. and stroke is 3.5... keeps rolling back around to a 305.... hhuumm SO that ponders the question... would you leave it at 305... or bore it out bigger for more power.... Which one would get better mileage...?? Reason I ask is from past experience.. I used to have a small RV.. It had a 350. It strained it somewhat. If it would of had a 400 it would of been easier on the motor and got better gas mileage... I'm wondering same theroy here?? Also which one would cost more... I know my dad was saying he had a 36 ford motor rebuilt. It had to be bored out to 10/'1000 (seems) and the parts (I assume piston, etc) to go it in costed as much for ONE as it would of for the whole set if he could of left it original size
If a 305 isn't what you started out to build then you won't be happy when you start comparing it to the 350 you MEANT to build. It's a "You want it or you hate it" kinda deal... I think you should find the 350 block of your dreams and trashcan the 305...although its a "good enough" engine for a lot of cars and people. Don't talk yourself into doing something just because its the easy way out at the moment.. I'd build one as a street engine for a light car...
First, the SBC is a now traditional streetrod engine for which you can get any kind of parts for, new or used, upgrade or retrograde, hibuck or lobuck. You name it, you can do it. All it takes is money, albeit less than other engines require. You want good mileage in a streetrod? Go with a fuelie V6. You want cheap V8 power? Go with a 350. You want something different? Go with a flathead, a Cad an Olds or a Buick retro and adapt your 700r4 to it. Now, under what circumstances would you want to use a 305 block? When you want to do something very different with a V8 for absolutely dirt cheap. Consider: --305 block, free+rebuild cost of $600 --267 heads, rebuilt $100ea --400 crank, $200+turning of $150 --cheapo pistons, damn near free --Edelbrock SP2P intake manifold, $50 --Rochester Dualjet carburator (rebuilt, ready to go), $20 --'62 'vette fuelie 2-1/4" ramhorn outlet exhaust manifolds, $35 each Without going into all the details here, this assembly gives you a low-mid rpm range torque monster SBC with 22+mpg hwy gas mileage for dirt cheap. Basically, it's a Chevy Nailhead in that it has small valves, small intake ports, tiny carb venturiis and is designed for flow velocity rather than volume. Intake velocity and long stroke equals torque which is Buick Nailhead theory that we can cheaply apply to the SBC. And please no flames, all you SBC hotrodders. The man wants V8 rumble, high torque to move his heavy metal, good gas mileage and low cost. Don't start slinging barbs about what a dog it's going to be in the 1/4 mile... I already KNOW that. He's not going for that. If he wants that, he needs to forget the 305 entirely, IMHO.
I must respectfully disagree with your first line, I've had 4 of them over the years, they all ran good and not a one of them got under 20 MPG. They need a cam change and a little but of gear to wake them up but in a light car thay can be a lot of fun and still get decent mileage. A friend had a boneyard '78 305 of unknown mileage with a Quadra Jet on an iron intake, Summit 1102 cam, ram's horn manifolds, full duals with Fowmasters, a 200-4R and 3.08's in a '63 Bel Air 4 door. It needed lower gears, it was turning too slow at highway speeds for a car that heavy but he ran what he had. It could easily haul around 4 adults and consistantly got 20+ MPG. With a 3.55 gear it would have run a lot better and probably done a little better on fuel economy. The second part of your post I agree with 100%.
if it's a plain 305 I wouldn't bother with it BUT if it's a HO 305 it will make the 350 lovers eat crow. Cam, intake, headers and carb will wake it up big time. They don't put out the hp of the big brother but they'll keep up with them and get decent mpg too. Every body can have a 350 but as somebody here said recently "dare to be differant" and work the 305 alittle They really do a good job. I didn't believe it either til I did one. I used it cause it was the only engine I had and I'm glad I did. overall good performer, dependable, and decent power. I mean after all it's still a sbc
well I'm encouraged by many of the posts... ... and yes.. I'm not looking for anything "quick,.. or 1/4 mile performance. This'll be something to tool around town in,.. take to car shows,.. and run up and down the interstate in. Mileage IS important. Now when it's done I expect it to LOOK like a trailer queen,.. but I plan to drive it anyway... NOw.. just to clarify a few things... it may take away some of my enthusiam. SOmeone ask... It goes into a 1946 M series Studebaker pickup. It will have an extended cab. and go on a ton frame. Frame is boxed, and when I get done it won't be any 'light' kinda proposition. It has a MustangII front end under it with 2" dropped spindels. 9" Ford rear end. (BY the way will the 700R4 still work with a 305...??) Gotta rebuild the rear end gears,... so not sure what rear end gear I'll be running yet. ANyway.. The chassis is about 16' long,.. boxed frame, I can't say what it'll weigh. frame, suspension- front and rear - 25 gallon fuel cell, motor radiator, transmission, all the normal stuff... If anything I'd guess it's a little on the 'heavy' side. Gonna have oak wood bed... SO you tell me... 305 be big enough?? I like the smaller size.. Hell I got THREE motors sitting in the garage.. all just alike
seems i remember readin somewhere you can stroke those little guys and effectively create a poor mans 327.... correct me if i'm wrong here but the roundy pounders just love using the 305 in classes where they have a "claimer" rule...
How do you "know" if it's a HO305... or is that part of "built it"... make it into one. I mean any of these motors I have I plan on having totally redone and rebuilt... so if I need to tweak it a little, that no problem. Like I admitted before,.. I am dumb,.. so feel freee to assume I know nothing.
you can put a casting # in google and it will tell you everything you want in the first couple of searches, just put your # in the search and goto town
There were two different 305HO heads ending in either '609 I believe and '416 for sure. They have 58cc chambers and 1.84" intake valves but the ports are very similar to the old 462 Fuelie heads. The HO or L-69 also had a hotter hydraulic cam. The mid-80's Monte SS with a 305HO, 200-4R and 3.73 gears was a fun package. A mild cam, 4 Bbl. intake, free flowing exhaust and a set of 3.55 gears in a 3500 Lb. vehicle will really do wonders for even the lowly 2 Bbl. version. The 700R4 will work, GM used them behind the V-6 S-10's, but the 200-4R is a better choice because of it's more even gear spread and lighter weight unless you're going to tow anything more than a small pop up camper.
I bought up a lot of 305's in the past 20 years. I thought people would come around sooner or later for the mileage. I'm doing one in the engine shop as we speek. Build it like is was a 305 Monte Carlo SS or a IROC-Z28 those things haul ass and make decent mileage. All in all it's still a small block Chev V-8>>>>.
Towing.. I'm still kicking that issue around. It's something I have to decide now... I plan on having a roll pan on the truck... so to want to put a hitch on the truck later I'd have to chup up the rear and cut a hole in it, refinish, repaint, etc etc.. NOT sure I ever NEED to tow anything,... bit then again Dad has a little trailer,.. be better to put something in that and get it somewhere than mess up the bed of my truck. SO.. all you jump in and tell me more about the motor, etc etc... I am a sponge,.. I know nothing, and need all the info I can get
go to NastyZ28 website and run your block numbers. I'll tell ya if I put up a photo of mine I'd never hear the end of it. Mines a 1980 HO305 in a 55 chev 210. Super Comp headers, Crane 274 cam, running on 2 Edelbrock carbs sittin on a tunnelram backed by a M-22 Muncie with 3:73 Z-28 rears.Nobody knows what the hell it is so they ask and when I tell them, they are stumped and can't believe it handles that much carb. They are stronger than alot of people think and tweaked they are alot of fun. Mine runs full time on both carbs at around 2600 rpm's which is 55 mph gets about 15to16 mpg, so you should do much better with your combo
Yeah I went to that site... I guess thats part of why I got confused... On the BACK of the block I do have some numbers 14010203 (say thats one one motor) then on the side of the SAME motor it also says A25 DN K31 A25 is on the extreeme left on the next line the D is under the A... then a prety good space,... then the N.. then the casting clock Then on the next row there is nothing until way on the RIGHT under the casting clock is the K31 They really didn't make any sense to me they way they were all spread out like that... And Highlander said DNK31 meant something. I can't find anyplace where those three number or letters come together (I'm just trying to learn) The site you listed.. I can't find anything like that there either... so I'm still confused. Thanks for the help and being patience and teaching me. Still looking for those head numbers
Do yourself a favor and look in the tech-o-matic for Fat Hacks 305 build thread. If your not drag racing do the 305...
i just rebuilt my 305 and in a roadster/lighter hot rod, i don't think you'll ever really notice a power drop. the one thing is they dont breathe well stock, i think the 4bbl had like 160 HP and the fuel injection model had about 210 hp. there was a post earlier about the 305, and simply switching intakes with a edelbrock performer gained ET time and mileage. they look good though, my '80 305 looks like a late 50's block now. and i got it for 60 bucks...
by 1946 M series pickup i assume you mean a stude like this but maybe not so molested . here is my 47 m5 pickup . 350 SBC and yup it is fast . Shot with KODAK CX7330 ZOOM DIGITAL CAMERA at 2007-08-16 Shot with KODAK EASYSHARE Z710 ZOOM DIGITAL CAMERA at 2008-06-08 Shot with CYBERSHOT at 2007-11-23
hey.. love your little M5... I wouldn't say "not quite so molested"... just "molested different" Yeah I'm keeping the fenders on mine,.. but yeah (like you) I chopped the cab,.. but I ALSO extended my cab 18". Gonna cut vents in my hood, and put in an oak wood bed. Bucket seats... oak dash and console.
yep the 700 will bolt right up.....with its 3.08 first gear This would be my tranny of choice for this application Bingo right on the head. this goes right along with the intended application ummm no they were a POOCH in the monte SS my Buick 6 popper would blow there frickin doors off. and again this is NOT the best choice for the intended application. light hod rod, yes, heavy truck, not a chance. also again for the intended application go with the 700. I love the 200 but the 700 has better gears for you P.S. GM put the 700r4 behind 350's in 5000# full size trucks
Most bone stock 305s sound like any other small block chevy but are really enemic when it comes to power. After being raped to the tune 0f 4+ dollars a gallon at the pumps, I have decided that my next build WILL be a 305...with a GM T5 tranny behind it and a real "road friendly" high geared rear end. It'll sound good like any other Chevy V8 AND give me some billfold relief at the gas pump! I've NEVER needed 600+ horses for a engine;....I just thought I did! My 2 cents only.
The 305 heads of choice end with 601, but if it came out of a '79 it will have 416 or 624 heads. 601 heads are good heads, but if you want a vintage look and don't plan on running ac the power pac heads work well with flat top pistons. The 1.88 305 valves work very well in the power pack heads. Jeff
O/T but same deal. basically stock 305 and t5, good cruising combo for a rod. But if you're planning on towing, uh uh. it may not have what you want. i had the same thing happen to me btw, bought as a 350, only to find it was a 305..
Go to this site for your numbers http://www.mortec.com/castnum.htm Cubic Inch = Bore x Bore x stroke x .7854 that is 1/4 of pie x number of cylinders.
The Jalopy Journal
