Hello: A buddy of mine wants to do a Altered wheelbase straight axle 65 Cyclone build. All the Uni Body project Cyclones he has come across have this ugly rear under trunk Frame Rail detioration similar to the attached pic. As we know the frame rails are vital and a load bearing structure however NO FIRM offers replacement sub frame rails for the Comet, Falcon family and they differ from the early MUSTANG. Is there hope for a rotted 65 Cyclone for a Alertered wheelbase build? If, can a man fab a full frame in lieu of patching up already weakened Uni Body? Thank you Kindly.
On my falcon I cut behind the rear shakel and moved the rear end forward 10 inches, I had a sheet metal shop bend up some metal to tie the rails to the back of the car, I cut them to length and welded them in, He could do the same thing, just cut out any bad metal and replace it.
With the right tools you can do anything !!!! I have a 64 Comet wagon that I made a complete rear frame for when I tubbed it and am now putting a straight axle from a 46 Chevy pickup under the front for that Gasser look. I would look at some of the kits that are sold for pro streeting a car and go from there . If the frame is that bad you may want to move it in some to gain more tire clearance .If I get a chance I will post some pictures of my car in progress. Jim in Pa. Also check Auto Weld they have rear rails bent for a Falcon that may only need to be lengthened a little in the rear for the Comet.Look at there site they have a complete build up of a 64 Fairlane with a new full frame installed. http://autoweldchassis.com/spec.ivnu http://autoweldchassis.com/FAIRLANE.ivnu
You're kidding, right? Just slap up a 3X2 rectangle set of rails that tie into the front frame horns and it's done. Make a template to hold up to the floor and cut out just that section and slide the rails up and weld away.
No reason why you couldn't back half it. Build yourself a rear subframe then take some square (rectangel?) tubeing and build a set of subframe connectors. Put the rear end where ever you want then move the wheel openings to accomodate.
all you need is 3M Men Money Machines Porknbeaner has the best solution. You could either build your own rear clip or buy a kit from some body like Art Morrison, Chassis Engineering, S&W, Alston, Chris Alston if you are worried about the engineering of the rear suspension. I have installed rear clips from all of the above suppliers over the years and was pleased with what I got for the money. However, if you really want to play the role of the mad scientist (aka rocket scientist), you will have to build all of it your self.
I'd back halve it...make enough room for the tire you wanna stuff and roll out. If my Comet wasn't so clean, I'd be cutting it more than I soon will be (i hope haha) You need to modify the floor and the rails anyways. Keep us posted
If repairing that rust is holding you up, you probably shouldnt try to build an altered wheelbase car.
Please please please don't tub it out. I would repair the frame with tubing as mentioned before. In fact, I have the same problem with my Comet, just not nearly as severe and I'm going to fix it with tubing when it gets to be an issue. Crites Restorations out of Ashville, Ohio has lots of stuff for those.
I agree with that, Murcury Kid. Those old '60's FX and early funnies were not tubbed. 10 inches was as big a tire as they ran. My brother was kind of annoyed at me when I bought 10 wide wheels for my '66 Dart funny, as our original car, and injected altered wheelbase '65 hemi, only ran 8" wide wheels, ten inch tires, and wasn't tubbed. My Dart came with mini tubs, so I left them, and 10" of tire is all I'll put under it. No tubs! No four bars or ladder bars!
No one said anything about tubbing!Back halving a car doesn't always involve a narrowed rear and steam roller rear tires.If he's going to alter the rear wheel base and the rails are trashed why not just build a rectangle tube rear section. He can still hang the rear on leaf springs if he wants to go that route.
Thanks a million to all you guys. I really appriciate all the input! Please stand by. I am going to scan a stunning article from a 1966 Popular Hot Rodding issue of which chronicles a 1966 Nova AFX build. I want you to notice of the major surgery the builder did on this Nova. Notice how he fabbed an entire frame for this car bumper to bumper! It appears NOTHING remains of the factory unibody! Remember at the time this article was published the car was not even a year old! I asked myself as to why he just didnt go early full frame car such as Corvette or Chevelle!
I was just saying he shouldn't tub it. I didn't say anybody told him to. I just really like altered cars that have as much factory stuff as possible. Stock (albeit rearranged) floor pans, fenderwells, frame rails, gas tanks and so forth. I think it really captures the look as opposed to the pre-fabbed interiors nowadays. Big Dad, you're really making me want to send the nose of my Comet sky high posting pics like those.
Hear is the rear set up on mine. Crites rear spring relocators with 1" mini tub 8" wide wheels mount enough slick to do 5,000 RPM launch with the wheels in the air.
Here are two pics. Both stunning examples of the 1965 Cyclone. I know its hard to tell but to the best of your abilities do both these machines have the rear wheelbase segment moved forward or are they in factory stock position. A third pic of factory 1965 Cyclone is attached for comparrisons.
Just a suggestion....get the Funny Car Farm DVD on altered wheelbase cars as a reference. The DVD goes into detail of what needs to be done to move the rear axle forward in unibody cars. After you cut the pan and move it forward, fixing some rust damage will just be a little more sheet metal/mig wire. On the 65 are ya'll going to elongate the wheel opening or move the whole arch? The elongated openings seem to be historically correct, but then you have a wheel arch opening patch instead of the rear quarter. I would like to hear about pros & cons. I see a really nice AWB Chevy II at the shows that has huge tubs (...and fake injectors). The huge rear tires just don't look right for a 60s vibe AWB. On the other hand, the stock wheel tub is small, so something like Judd did...leaf spring relocated & enlarge the stock tubs, is perfect IMO. I'm still piddling with straight axle install on my Comet, so I'm a couple months behind the rear axle relocation. I hope all the AWB Falcon and Comet guys stay in touch and share gotchas.
I followed the issue of hot rod where Mr. Rich THE PERFORMANCE KING altered a fairlane, If you could find that issue it would be a huge help, great step by step photos.
TPW35...Good point. That was a great article and is archived online at the Hotrod website, so you can download the many pics. Steve Maganate (sp?) wrote that article and is also the guy that did the Funnycar farm DVD I mentioned. The build process in both are the same, except in the DVD he is building a Dart and in the Hotrod article it is a fairlane. Another deal that is ongoing now is the TV series Musclecar is building a AWB Comet. Lots of know-how circulating out there...and they all look easier than real life!
I was the guy in the DVD along with Steve gettin my hair burned. The FunnyCar Farm is my shop out in Monrovia, Ca. We also ,among other things, did a gasser Comet in conjunction with The Kennedy Brothers in Pomona. I only grabbed one picture of it on the way out, but I'll dig up some more, as I know we documented the build. http://public.fotki.com/teddisnoke/bmw-2002/520.html This car came out badass. Early A front axle, moved slightly forward. The back end got severly mini-tubbed to make room for the narrowed nine inch and wheel/tire combo. I pray the owner of this car (I'm sure he's a member here!!) completes this car!! Lucky- you son-of-a-gun, throw a smallblock in there and lets get racing!!! Dale(the funnycar farmer) Hey- how come nobody ever says anything about that altered wheelbase Ford Fairmont Steve and I built in a few days????
probly because im the only guy in north america other than you two that doesn't think its wrong. i remember seeing pics of it in hrm after the 502much car. i really thought it was cool, out there but cool
For the musclecar tv show go to the itunesstore and then tv shows => spike => musclecar tv => episode 14 & 15. You can buy them for $1.99 each. Rik
Dale....Sorry for not giving ya the credit on the the Funny Car Farm DVD. To be an honest broker on this deal, Dale is the guy runnin the grinder, mig, stick welder,etc...while movie star Steve is narrating the build. The Fairmont is cool, but the six holer has to go!
On that Caliente gasser I did, we actually got those huge tires to tuck in without having to section the fenders. I moved the rear axle centerline back about 3/4", and that, along with the mini-tub allowed me to fit in a set of Mickey Thompson pie crusts. If the rear of the car sits pretty low, it'll hit, but if the car is raised up period correct, you can get away without having to section rear of the car. Best bet is to position the wheel/tire combo up in the wheelhouse, after you slice and dice for the mini-tub. Mark that new axle centerline, and compare it to your old one. At the least,maybe a small amount of trimmage on the rolled lip up front down where the front rocker panel meets the fender lip. Dale
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