I'm in the midst of this very thing as we speak. I'm in the midst of taking the body off the botched chassis tonight and putting it back on the stock frame that KB Cookout brought me yesterday. It's a shame. Somebody screwed up a good car with a bad clip. It's too wide, the suspension geometry is all wrong, etc... I looked at Fatman front ends and they seem great but the new frame was the ticket for me. Now I can fuck it up all by myself.
I got 56 Chevy 2 door sedan that was a friend's car--he did lots of Camaro swaps around here.This car rides BITCHIN--but tires rub just a little on tight turns--thinking about the Fatman a-arms--are they worth $900.00??? The car sits right--looks right--steers and stops great--is it worth going any further--or just put up with a little rubbing?
On my first car - a 1941 Ford Super Deluxe Coupe - we put a Nova clip under the front of it for several reasons. It is super easy to walk into a parts store and pick up parts for a Nova front end, and it was also easier to set the smallblock chevy into it as well. We found out the hard way that a tape measure isn't just the only tool to properly place the clip into the old frame. When we put the clip into the frame with the clip's rails parallel with the old frame rails and welded it all into place, then added the fenders and engine/trans combo, we found out that the tires were right up against the top of the fenders. Of course, this was AFTER the clip was welded completely into the frame! Dad wound up cutting it back out and dropping the front of the rails down before re-welding it all into place. However, after all of this effort, the ride height wasn't just exactly right, and the cutting of the Nova springs didn't fix it. We tried heavier Impala springs, and they didn't work right and stiffened up the ride considerably. We wound up going with a set of 6 cylinder springs out of a small Buick and they did the trick. The car rode smooth as glass, and was extremely comfortable to drive.
...if it don't scrape, it aint low enuf ! ...if it only scrapes on tight turns, I wouldn't worry about it, just don't turn so short.
it's a bit too wide for a 50 chevy. I have seen them running s-10 4x4 wheels (super deep offset) and caps to get them to tuck, but those wheels can be a bitch to find. better going with Mustang II, or mabey Volare (I strongly suggest the MII) as far as dumping the rear axle in, we have a 53 here right now with a mid 70's Camaro rear end on the original leaf springs...it appears to fit pretty well. the axle perches will need to be re-drilled, but aside from that...it's back there, and it has some wiggle room.
hey guys, just a quick tech tip. use 5/8" or 3/4" all thread in place of the shocks and crank it down to ride height. you don't have to pull springs that way. notice i didn't say 1/2" or smaller..... if you gotta ask why, don't EVEN attempt subframe jobs....
the deal on camaro clips has more to do with the lack of experience by the installer than bad mouthing camaro clips. i doubt if the guy that screwed up a camaro clip would do any better with a must 11, jag ,volarie or what ever. the front wheel location problem comes from sticking to the orginal wheel base # instead of setting the ride height,installing the right tires and fenders, than stand back 20 ft and eye ball the location. this problem is not unique to a camaro clip i see this all the time especially on the 56 f100.s
..I've installed early Camaro (67-9) front subs and 68-74 Nova (and clones) front subs into 49-52 Chevs with great results, but I only use drum brake fronts which are a tad narrower than disc fronts. These cars handle and ride great. The rearends from these same cars work well also in the 49-52 Chevs, using the orig. leafs.
do wheels move FWD or BACK in an arc when suspension completely compressed? (regarding the arc made when front suspension moves up/down on IFS). i have a 2nd gen clip. i have the springs removed on clip, truck at ride-height with wheels centered (visually) in the wheelwell and my wheelbase is still stock length. can i expect a slight "drift" BACK or FWD with wheels once suspension added? great thread.
Some suspensions have the A arms at a true 90Deg from the caster. So the whole assembly is tilted back by the amount of the Caster. ( which can be as much as 10Deg ) Compressing a suspension like that will move the Wheel back. And sometimes suspensions have Anti Dive built in, so those dont move up and down in a straight vertical line either. To eliminate those variables, it makes sense to me to take the extra time to get the Sub to the Rideheight it will be, once the job is done. Also, the shape of the fender might make the position of the wheel look good at a, say, 10" rideheight, and look terrible at 5" with the same wheelbase. So I like to get the wheel exactly where it is going to be, before the first tackweld is made.... Edit. Added pic of my Truck...
I agree with using 3/4 allthread through the shock mount holes to compress the springs and get the a-arms parallel to the floor. Also to help get the wheelbase correct, attach 2x4's to the floor in front and back of each wheel and use the same wheels on the clip. Can't help but get the right wb if it was right to begin with. A lot of diagonal measurements is also recommendedto be sure the clip is centered. Bob
really its not reading a tape measure that,s the problem it,s that the stock wheel base usually does not center the tire in the wheel well when you really lower the vehicle. the deal is to hang a fender on the car and eyeball the fit no matter what front end you are going to install.
i installed a '79 camaro clip onto my '64 f100.....i took measurements for about 2 days. this was my first "clip" (other than circumcision).....i'm thinking about shit-canning my whole frame and building my own frame from scratch equipped with a MII. the only problem i think i'll have with the camaro frame is width.....i moved the front up about an 1.5".....wheels are now centered in the wheel-well. I used tons of reference points and levels.....i wish i would have used more of the camaro frame.....i ran 2 passes of 6010 and 2 passes of 7018...if i choose to keep the clip, i'll remove the bottom piece of the stock ford frame so the clip "flows" with the rest of the frame.
I used a 73 Apollo clip on a 41 Ford business coupe years ago. I wound up narrowing it 3" by sectioning the clip cross member and rebending the sway bar, lots of work. It turned out great. I also used the Apollo rear end , brakes, etc. I went with a Volare setup on my F-1 project though.
I can tell you why I instal clips and preferably Camaro clips 1970 through 74. I do it for several reasons. One the 2nd gen camaro clip was extreemly successful in the road race circuits both here in the USA and in Europe due to General Motors r&d labs and their sponsor ship to the Mc Laron race teams. Next the camaro clip is already set up motor mount wise for several of the winningest engines ever built, bbc & smb Chevrolets. Next, General Motors had the forsight to manufacture more than one steering ratio poweresteering box for the camaros along with several readily avaliable sway bar sets from either the camaro or the firebirds. And finally, the second gen camaro stub only requires a few minor alterations and it can either go drag racing or road racing, plus it works really well on the street. The front cross member can be lowerd to within 3.5 inches of the pavement and the original suspenson can still be used with very minor alterations. ie; the rear lower control arm mount needs to have a clearance cut to make room for the control arms upward movement when the car goes into dive under heavy braking. All in all after researching other avaliable front stubs back in the 1970`s the second gen camaro stub won out hands down over all other stubs when you figured in all the above and the avaliability and price. If I was going to stub a truck today, and depending on the trucks original track width, I would probably still use these second gen camaro stubs.
What could of happened a 1952 chevy car if you center the rear and move it backwards about 2 inches then use the wheel base you come up short,or they cut to much off and weiled it. A new frame is one way,or cut back were flat and lenghten it 2 inches,then fix all other problems.Fatman maybe could sell you a stub like shoes boxs.
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