Folks Of Interest Vintage speed equipment better than aftermarket?

I know I'm aging myself here but my attraction to vintage is universal.
Give me Rachel Welch and an early fuely engine any day of the week!

 

Old stuff has REAL meaning to the buyer for his car. A sense of pride and accomplishment. But hard to fathom somebody dragging a buddy across the venue just to look at it

 

My memory is pretty good but unfortunately, I think yours is slipping. I believe you meant Raquel Welch, didn't you ? Fuelly engine optional.

 

We drive these old cars for the nostalgia. Almost any new car can outperform many of these, except maybe the ones with the ultimate build. We love the looks, feel and smell of what was. New parts are missing most of that. Of course, if a new part has a vintage vibe but just looks too clean and new, rub some dirty oil all over it and run it on your car until some of it bakes into the metal. Wipe it off and now it's starting to look old. Keep driving it. It'll get to looking vintage before you know it. As for me, I'd just buy the vintage stuff and dream about all it's seen and everywhere it's been.

 

My bad, I know better, my high school pals' moms' name is spelled Rachel, she's 92 and like Raquel, she's still a knockout.

 

While original tooling is cool stuff, only true if it's been maintained. Years ago (09) I ordered pn 5595 from Offenhauser, they told me that might be the last run of them they cast due to deterioration of the molds and reduced demand. A well known brand that shall remain nameless herein, that offers a similar product line, has declined in this regard in their quality.
I bought a Nailhead finned valley cover from them in unpolished finish, cheaply thinking " I can make it shiny"
After hours of draw filing and sanding, the porosity won't go away. Their email response was "We're really sorry about that." nothing more. Priority shift to making Rat Fink key fobs and decals.
After a discussion with Matt & Russ Martin in re: other Buick engine info, they advised me not to install it as all of them were warped and will damage the gasket and leak. Sure enough, when I "Eyes" balled it with a straight edge, there is distinct curvature along the mounting surface. Hopeful it can be straightened.

 

Give me the old stuff! For those that don't want it there's plenty like me that'll use it..

 

Well....

The idea of a hex socket screw drive was probably conceived as early as the 1860s to the 1890s, but such screws were probably not manufactured until around 1910.

In 1909–1910, William G. Allen also patented a method of cold-forming screw heads around a hexagonal die (U.S. Patent 960,244). Published advertisements for the "Allen safety set screw" by the Allen Manufacturing Company of Hartford, Connecticut, exist from 1910.

So at least Allen head screws would be more than period correct.

 

Of course! A new one that wants someone my vintage has a few screws loose that I can't fix. Now, if I take one my own vintage, she has the same nicks, dings, lumps and bumps as me and we can be as mellow and comfortable or as raucous as we want, at the same speed.

 

U got 'er!!

 

Yeah, I basically knew most of that, but they look like shit on vintage stuff.
Exceptions being LSR cars, IMHO.
Thanks for the background. I know "Allen" isn't the proper name, but everyone knows what I mean.
Thanks, Fish.

 

I like vintage parts sometimes just for the recycling. Plus it was many hundreds cheaper than buying new ones.
Bought these M/T Olds covers off our classifieds a couple weeks ago. Thanks @chopt31

And gave them a polish and some matching engine paint, better than new.

I buy new stuff and make it look old and buy old stuff and make it look new.

 

I finally get to pick up my intake from the polisher this weekend. Pretty stoked. I'll post pics soon.

 

Yup!

$50.

 

I had very limited $ as a kid in the late 1950s { Even later on},so my speed stuff was learning things ,an using the knowledge to make more power and building my own speed parts.
Things like;,,Retarding a cam for more power at a little higher RPM with a bit stronger springs too. Cut fly wheel lbs. off, Good tuning.
Did some home made intakes for more carbs. A lot of home made headers over time.
Here's a home made Log Intake 4x2 { I had done one for 6x2 back in the later 60s] ,I did them from a cut up drive shaft. The design I think is better then most after market cast alum jobs=My own design has separated runners between log an head vs most cast alum speed part intakes are open between each pair of ports. Work alone took about 30 hours,how much is that in cost ? My time of learning and doing the work,but the most fun part is when it works !!

 

For me, it's all about the cool factor of having the older pieces rather than similar but new from the manufacture pieces.
When ever I get a car together with my flathead in it it will probably never make a pass down a drag strip unless it is just to get a time slip at the Street rod drags that go along with the local Vintiques NW nationals. The "yea it did" slip and done. It's a lot more about guys in the know looking it over and understanding that the parts were built back when rather than being new.

 

I think @Moriarity hit the nail on the head it's about the history.

I want my vintage stock car build to look and perform as close to an early/mid sixties style car as possible, everything is vintage period correct or hand built in my garage. I did make some concessions for the rules, safety, and modern tires I am running vintage steel wheels without bead locks.

 

I think it depends on what you want your car to do, want every horse you can ring out of it and be a stop light terror then new is the only way to go.

The horses they can make from a sbc now with aluminum heads and a streetable roller cam are more than most race cars were making in 1965 and on pump gas.

Or do you want to look cool just cruising? In that case that's where the old stuff comes in. 4 carb intakes, dual point distributors, fuel logs etc.

It just depends on your expectations and the end product your after.....

I build accordingly.

.

 

Speed and power are some what relative, when am driving on the interstate at 65 in my modern truck it doesn't seem that fast.

However, when I was about 16, I got to ride around the 1/2 mile cinder on the Cobleskill fairgrounds (Cobleskill NY), with Bill Romain in his roof 16 valve T speedster (owner at that time)

We were probably going about 45 or 50 but it felt supersonic in that car.

The following video is at Fonda speedway-

These are the there fastest cars in the vintage antique class all three use all vintage parts including drum brakes and there are disc brake car in this class, the number 2 coupe is a modern build by Jimmy Fugle and is as he says a 98% correct clone of the car he built after he returned from the army, , last year he even built a 327 with pink rods because it drove him nuts to have 350 in the car! He still wins!

The blue number 2 sedan is the first car Jimmy built at 18!

Now these cars are no where near as fast as the modern D.I.R.T modifieds in the video these three cars lap Fonda in 25 seconds the current Fonda Speedway lap record is 17.740 seconds set by Stewart Friesen. Put us on the track at the same time the speed difference would be drastic! However, running by ourselves, you never notice the speed difference.

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1013559645899208

 

My expendable cash has always been limited, so I’ve always sought out the cheaper alternatives. I have no problems buying someone else’s cast off parts as long as they are still useable. I always would spring for new stuff inside, bearings, gaskets, etc, but have ran more than one used cam or crank. I’ve not looked for the latest fraction of a horsepower from an intake manifold since my limited racing days, almost any old aluminum intake is better than a heavy stock cast iron one. I prefer valve covers with no names on them, with the exception of the engine manufacturer. Why give some parts company free advertising?

I’m running an early Edelbrock 289 Performer on my 302, only because I found it at the right price when I was looking for an intake. It could have just as well been a F4b ( I think that’s the right number) if I had found one in my price range ( read cheap).

I love seeing old stuff used.

 

So well put.

 

I asked because I picked this nailhead stuff that has been sitting since the late 50s early 60s supposedly

 

You just have to ask yourself, "What would Jay Leno do?"

I dabble in buying and selling a few pieces of traditional, vintage, chrome accessories in my swapmeet booth. So I always keep my eyes open for some old-school "Made In Japan" lights, mirrors, etc.

 

I am with ya. I got a TM1 on the shelf (probably not for long LOL). Does it perform the same as a modern open plenum? Nope, but it is cool.

Here is my take on Vintage speed parts. For us they are better because they reach out and touch our target. As for real world performance, better or worse it is questionable in most instances. Castings are often made from different alloys and if you are spending the cash on quality parts they will be a cleaner casting. Hopefully you will never need to make a repair but given my options if I had to weld an original offy or a modern one I would much ruther weld the modern one.

 

When you spend a large portion of your personal and professional life revolving around restoration cleaning up the old seems normal. But this actually brings up a question. If the goal majority is performance then you'd have to go new for the ultimate output. If it's an even mix of aesthetic/performance it doesn't matter. Maybe you get 10 more HP out of a newer head vs an old one. Who cares? Especially if the new one can be seen as new at 1st blush. I'd take a 55-84 SBC all day vs a Vortec or LS. But that's me, I like old. I restore old shit. I wish I had a C note for everyone who told me to ditch the tri-power 389 in my GTO and put an LS in it. Same answer, fuck off.

 

People say that?

I mean, they must because you've told us, but jeez, I'm shaking my head.

 

As a high school graduate in 77, I gravitate to that age of auto. I just have to build power for them. I am currently LS swapping a 95 firebird for a later thrill and challenge. The T and A I’m building are for the challenge also but in the challenge of sourcing good materials as well. I find some of the rules and attitudes here sometimes too restrictive. I do appreciate the knowledge and history though. It’s probably a function of my personal age and experiences. I do prefer age appropriate parts where visible and source easy to find parts where hidden. Performance wise, the older stuff is over stressed trying to perform where later designs excel.

 

If you dislike the current/new generation engine offerings, you really won't like the future
"current" motors they want to stuff down our throats.

 

If you are speaking performance only, and the engines for which both vintage and current design manifolds are available (SBC, SBF, etc.), then it's modern manifolds hands down. All you have to do is watch a few episodes of "Engine Masters" on Motor Trend, for it to become apparent. On this forum, it's the exact opposite.

Me? I think SBC's are too modern, Thus I have no dog in this fight.