One thing to remember is that if you put a rollbar in and it is not up to NHRA specs they may not let you run even if your car is too slow to even need one in the first place. Incorrect installation is more dangerous that no rollbar according to them. Their playground, their rules. That is why drivers walk away from crashes
Good point, a guy on an OT forum I get on got killed in an accident driving his "track car" to the track when a guy turned into him and all indicators were blunt force trama from his head hitting the roll bar. Properly retained in the car and no other life threatening injuries. Just a hard wack on the back of his head. On the other hand I have seen a number of street/strip or street/track cars that had roll bars or cages that were set up or padded so that if you were properly restrained you bean wasn't going to get smashed on the bars.
Driving a roll bar or caged equipped car on the street is not really a wise thing to do....but that doesn't seem to stop most of us. Shit happens, there are risks to driving old fast cars. Maybe it's not worth it to you. Maybe it is. That's up to you.
I put a lot of miles on a tubbed/caged car with no issues. That being said, sitting in a car seat, putting on a seatbelt then rolling your head from side-to-side and front-to-back (clearance testing) is NOT the same as the forces encountered when you're knocked out (limp) and the car is rolling or T-boned. You may "think" that bar is plenty far from your head when in reality, given the correct conditions, your body is or may be flexible enough that contact IS possible. I ain't saying "don't do it" but I can tell you, there are quite a few pictures in this thread that show bars that I personally believe are well within striking distance of the driver/passengers melon. BTW, roll cage or roll bar "door" bars can cause broken bones too, it's not just your head at risk although a broken wrist/arm/leg generally ain't gonna kill ya. A cousin of mine used to race in an event called Targa Newfoundland and a participant broke a bone after contacting the door bar in their racer, during the event while fully harnessed in and helmeted.
Same here. But I've never been in a wreck in one, either on the street or strip. Such events are rare, but they can be deadly if you're only using part of the safety equipment that the sanctioning body requires.
My old Touring was a high 13/low 14 second car. When GV bought it, Carl at Mokan made him add a rollbar.
In the big scheme of things, I'd say that someone with a roll bar/roll cage set up will be safer a larger percentage of the time if an accident occurs. We can say that some people would not have died if they had not hit their head on a roll bar.....but we have no idea how many people did not die or become seriously injured because they did have a roll bar. I think the percentages for survival/lesser injury are definitely on the side of a roll bar equipped vehicle. I'm not trying to discount the danger presented by a head to roll bar contact, but we don't know how many other deaths or injuries would have occurred in the absence of a roll bar............and for some reason, I always thought a roll bar just made a cruzer look more like a bruiser.
I believe it was USAC, maybe NDRA, but the rule was the cage had to be padded anywhere you could touch it with you hand while seated in the car. Still a good idea 40 plus years later.
How fast your car goes wont be the determining factor as far as how the rollbar or cage is built. If your car is a 12 sec. 1/4 mile car and you go through tech at an NHRA track the majority of inspectors are going to want it to pass tech. So it needs to be able to pass tech regardless of how slow it is normally. I had issues with my old 4 point rollbar in my Austin gasser at our local NHRA 1/8th mile track. The tech told me it wouldn't pass tech as they don't approve 4 point bars. I told him it wasn't fast enough since it runs right at 8.0 sec. pretty regularly. But his issue was if it got passed, and later the owner upgraded his engine to run faster it would have already been passed. They allowed me to run this one night, but said if I came back it needed either no cage, or a cage that passed tech. So I never went back, and instead drive 80 miles to a private track that has common sense.
Stuff like this or similar is probably what I’d want on with a cage on the street. I don’t mind the harness with a regularly driven ride. But the helmet is probably a no. Not period but I’m ok with it.
Only if you want to live. And, while you're at it, reinforce the body-to-frame mounting points. My next roadster will have a relatively short roll bar with kickers to the front and rear. I don't want the car to fold up or come apart in a roll-over wreck.
I wish the nhra would make bolt-in roll bars legal. Something you could piece together with sleeves, have it installed in an hour or so. I’d be all over it. My car runs deep 11’s and have been thinking of putting one in, but the drawbacks are as big as the positives. Been undecided for a couple years now.
My bus failed tech at a parking lot event due to not having a coolant catch tank. the tech for some parking lot shenanigans is a roll bar (no specs just a bar attached to the ride) a coolant tank, a seat belt and a helmet.
I'm putting one in the current build Model A more for a solid attachment point for the shoulder harness than rollover protection. I'm replacing all but three pieces of wooden body frame with steel, so will already have quite a bit of a cage surrounding me. The roll bar is just a couple inches forward of the rear of the cabin, and there's quite a bit of open space between the bars should my head have to occupy some of that due to unforeseen forward acceleration from being tagged in the rear end. The bar will be padded and the seats may also have head rests. Bar needs to be finish welded, and braces to the rear are not yet tacked in.
If referring to the parking lot stuff, not fast. Cones in a parking lot road race style stuff but racing against a clock. Ive seen a front wheel come off the ground pulling out of curves so there is a good bit of momentum but not a lot of speed. We were putting together a round track beater. The class it was in specified a 3/16 plate across the drivers door area and a support between the floor and roof with a cross brace. So a couple old drive shafts bolted between the roof and floor with another drive shaft welded between em. And the rules for that changed as the classes got faster.
Don’t think so. They do em at Goodguys events. There are some local car clubs that do parking lot events. I’m kinda setting my OT build to attend those. A friend of mine does em. Bolt in roll bar with an up to date harness and helmet is the bulk of the requirements
^^^^ I've been little over 200 in 1/4 Purpose built car, A/Fc chassis, My self I want / plain to do a Double chassis (with 32 rails ) like Racer X ,a F/c Pro/M, Jungle gym design in one of 32s. DD & drag , even that I plane Not going faster then 5:70 in 1/8 or More then 170 1/4. In most Vehicles you can get Banged up pretty good @ 50mph , There is No guarantees , I try not to think about the what if , Because I do not have Bars @ All , A part as small as penny on track can cause Tragedy, Growing up & affiliated with drag strip One of most things that ""Really Pees me Off "" Local home town tracks, Is when a driver makes a pass , & in shut down bottom end Does not let No one know they might've left something on the track, Oil , Coolant ,parts ext. We that work the track can not see /catch every thing
This in my opinion this being blown some what out of proportion. If properly done, yes roll bar or cage. In the days we live in you are more likely to be shoot then bang your head on a roll bar-cage and die. If you want one , go for it, you could be banged up in a daily driver because it sees the road more often then most Hot Rods. Just my 2 cents and I'm sticking to it! Damn!!
My first roll bar, in my own rod, turned out to be a bad idea. At the time 1959,I was thinking it would look racey n be a bit safe too in my 28A roadster. I removed it nearly a year+ later,after too many fat foot take offs,and banging my head on it! << Ya,takes a teen time n bumps on head too addmit he had a bad idea,,, The plus side of removing the bar;was I could remount my seat back extra 3inchs. The last pic,before bar was gone forever;;
I raced cars but not in a class requiring a bar or cage...I did race bikes at faster speeds and with a bike you wear the protection and get the fuck away from the bike in a wreck.... I do see the concern for cages in a street car.....New vehicles have hidden roll cages but lots of air bags and padding to protect you..
My Stude is licensed and has a full cage. I've got SFI padding on the bars near my head, and I think it'll do if needed. Certainly has saved me a few times getting in and out.
This ways around 1954 ish @ first track on East , I wounded @ the time what the thought was going to prevent if bar was needed , more then missing teeth
It can be far worse. The contact area of a 1-5/8" or 1-3/4" tube is far smaller than that of most b-pillars, which in many cases, even as far back as the 1950's, were designed knowing that someone might bounce off of one.
If you need the roll bar, put it in. If you think you need the roll bar, put it in. If you want to put in the roll bar because you think it looks cool, think really hard about it! When I built my coupe, I thought a car that looks like an old race car should have a roll cage. I was building the car with the cage in it, but in one day, I hit my head on that roll cage 3 times getting in or out of the car. I had a headache all the rest of that day. The cage came out of the car. We ran dirt track cars. The roll bar padding is designed and intended to keep from cracking a helmet if it contacts the bar that is padded. That was years ago, but I'll bet the modern stuff is still based on helmet contact, not human head contact. That helmet will take a much bigger impact then your head will. The "B" pillar will bend and give a lot easier then roll bar tubing, and is nearly always flat on the inner surfaces, to spread out the impact over a larger surface on both the pillar, and someone's head that may make contact with it. Bottom line, a roll bar or cage in a car where the 5 point belts and helmet are not also employed by everyone in the car, every time the car moves, is less safe then the same car without the roll bar/cage, when driven on the street. That is my opinion, you have the right for your own. When it comes to a car crash, there is a lot more involved then what "safety equipment" the car may or may not have as far as surviving the crash goes. We have all seen crashes where no one should have survived but everyone did, and we have all seen crashes where no one should have gotten killed but someone did. We all do what we think (or the sanctioning body at the track they own and let us play at thinks) is best and we take our chances, but in the end, no one gets out of here alive. Taking measured risks is what adds to the fun in life, and for the most part, we get to choose the risk level we want.
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