I'm a pretty good mechanic but Have very little body working experience. I've been banging on the fenders for my 64 f100 and I'm pretty happy with the out come so far. I've got one spot giving me trouble though. At the front of the fender it wraps back about 6"-8" on itself and and it only leaves me about 3" of space between the inner part and the outer surface. I've got a pretty nasty crease here and can't get a hammer on it. So whats the trick to working dents out in tight spots? I hope My explanation is clear. If it's not I can get pics tomorrow and post them. Thanks, MIke
use a stud welder. the tool that welds little studs on the metal then you pull them out with a slide hammer and cut the studs off when you are done. another option is to cut the back side out so you can access the dent and then weld it back in. then you could also cut the crease out from the front and weld in a new peice then there is always the prying method... get a piece of thick flat stock and see if you can pry it out from inside. also you can use this same piece of flat stock as a dolly and hit it from the front side. many times you need to make a dolly in order to reach an odd spot.
I like to weld several studs along the line of the crease and clamp them in a block so I can pull them all at once. You might make more work than you are facing now to cut anything out.
...oh yeah... just cuz it's a dent from the outside going in, that doesn't necessarily mean you have to hit it from the backside to straighten it back up.
A stud welder can be expensive if you dont use it a lot. The one I have was $300, but I use it everyday. If you use one and you dont want to pull holes in the metal, dont over pull on the stud then cut it off with side cutters and grind the rest off. If you do pull a hole and dont have a welder, put another stud over it then cut and grind it. Try not to use too much heat because it could shrink. Also if you are worried about rust make sure that you spray some etch primer on the back side. If you have a welder you could also use the old way and get a cheap screw style slide hammer. Either way when you are pulling the lows use a hammer to tap down the high areas around it. If it was my vehicle I would use a pry bar and push out on the crease while hammering around it. This will help to pull out the crease by releaving the tension in the metal. You might need to have a block of wood handy depending on where you are prying against. Then with a slapping file lightly tap down any highs and then go over it with a regular file, this with keep the bondo down to a skim coat. Any way that you use take your time a learn it right.
When you use a hammer and dolly, depending on how and where you place the hits, the dolly usually does most of the work. If you place a dolly with the correct shape behind the dent, and hit 'around' the dent with a good body hammer, the dent will come out. The hammer sets up vibrations that "loosen" the metal's structure, and the dolly uses it's heavier force to push out the low spot. Just don't hit directly on the dolly, or the metal will stretch, and it'll take a different contour. Hope that explains it in laymen's terms!
The methods already posted for removal of the dent are options.If the difficulty that your having is getting the metal to move back to its original position. Make sure of what caused the damage and what conditions exist in the damaged metal before starting the repair . An example is , The front edge of the fender was driven back and caused a secondary buckle in the panel just forward of the w/o. It would be a mistake to repair the buckle in the fender without pulling the fender back to its dimensional form first. Scotty's recommendation would be the best in this situation. Are there any sections of the damaged area that are streched? Bringing the metal back out to its shape is only part of the repair process . Any streched metal will need to be shrunk to properly restore the panel. Dont mistake streched metal for displaced metal. Displaced metal occurs as if the example buckle was driven out of the panel before the dimension of the fender was restored . The buckle would then at that time oil can(pop in and out ) .Most of the time streched metal can be visually identified before the repair is started. Deep gouges are usally the most common identifiers. You shouldnt have to use excessive force to restore metal back to its original shape. If you are stop and reassess the conditions and causes of the damage in the panel. Pics are always helpful when trying to answer questions of this nature. The repair suggestion of cutting out the damaged area straightening and welding back in place is a repair option of last resort . If damage was that severe replacement of the fender may be a better option. Larry
Ok, I tried some of the techniques posted here and got a little farther along but now I'm at a point where the metal doesn't want to get back in shape for me. So got some pics. I tried holding the dolly on the inside and taping around the damage on the out side. I had very little success with this method. I tried using a pry bar to put pressure on the crease from the inside and hamering around the damage on the outside with no luck. I can weld so I think I'm going to see if I can find a screw in puller tomorrow and give that a try. This is what I'm working with. The crease went all the way back to where the paint is. It worked out pretty nicely until I got to the part where you see the surface rust. Thats about where it gets hard to reach from the back side. here is a better view of the trouble area. here is what it looks like from the back side. And from the front
Y'all go ahead and laugh at me, but if it was mine I'd take a cutoff wheel and slice it right along the crease and try to pry/shape(front to back) that mess back to resembling a fender....... Anybody seen my Channel-locks and spoon? On second thought....if it was mine, I'd be looking for a better fender(eek!)
Harbor Freight has stud welder for less than $100..and it comes with the puller. It pays for itself the first time you use it! http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=8878 Dave
I did not know how limited your resouces were, but by the looks of it the fender is located in a shop. If you could get a morgan knocker and a straight Moclamp(used on frame racks) you could take a piece of 1/2 inch or so straight steel and tac it along the crease, then attach the clamp and use the slide hammer to pull it out.
cut it and scab it dont get into straighting what u have sometimes its better to start over with better material.
Hey Mike, That f 100 fender doesn't look to shabby....... Ya didn't say what hammers or dollys ( the metal ones, not the "hey buy me a car, a house and a washing machine" type ) , but ya should be able to move a good portion of that stretched metal with a 3 pound bfh and a block of wood. My guess is that it will take many hot shrinks to return that metal in the stretched area to normal conture, not a biggie, jus takes time. As you are hitting the fender from behind with the block of wood, lay the fender on a piece of plywood so ya don't knock any more dents into it. Since you can weld you're in good shape, as you may wind up cutting darts into the metal to rid extra metal that was stretched and would take a great deal of time work out. Looks like your off to a good start, Swankey Devils C.C.
Slick64, I just got a copy of "The Key to Metal Bumping" from Eastwood ($13 or so). I've only read part of it, but what the other guys said make some sense to me already. I don't know if I could do what they're saying or not, but at least I'm not totally lost! Check it out. Pike
I had a hunch it was something like that. That fender's not an easy one to fix but a couple of things can make it less difficult. This fender should not just be beat back in to shape or cut and welded back into shape. If correctly done it wont need much filler. Bolt this panel back on the truck and make sure that its also attached to the core support. Scotty,s approach is going to be the correct one for a repair of this type . Several studs or a small tab should be welded to the crease at the front of the fender just slightly behind the verticle body line . Your going to need a method of pulling on the tab that keeps tension on the panel throughout the pull. This step is necessary because the line of the front of the fender to the grille is distorted. Take the time to check the fit of the grille during the pull as this is an important part of this repair step. As the pull is underway you will feel the tension resist the pull. Slowly apply the pressure. As you get closer to the release point you dont want excessive pressure to start to tear anything loose. The metal should now be easy to pick or dolly out .Work as much of the dent out as you can with the tension applied to the fender . Dont be afraid to push the metal out as far as possible. Its badly streched in the creased area and when working metal this badly streched having it pushed out is preferable . Once the fender is back out to its correct dimensioning . Remove the tab without cutting through the metal if possible. The next step is to start to shrink the streched area. You'll need a torch ,water, a sponge or wet rag, hammer and dolly. Identifing the starting point for shrinking is a little trial and error . You will need to heat a area about the size if a nickle to a dull red for the more sever areas and just hot enough to discolor the paint in less affected zones. Watch the metal closely when applying the heat . You want it to come out . If it starts to go inward remove the heat and move over to the next closest area that will move outward. Working quickly remove the heat. Grab the hammer and dolly and lightly tap the heated area down while supporting the back side of the panel with the dolly . Dont hammer directly on the dolly . Once the area is smoothed with the tools quench the area with a water soaked rag or sponge. Repeat till the panel is straight and sound. You will probably need to weld the very front tip of the crease . It may tear in that area during the pull. If your unfamiliar with how heat will move metal . Try a couple of spots on a test panel. Keep us posted on your progress. I like hearing mechanics tell me how easy bodywork is. Happy Hammering Larry
ok, you need to hit that lip out of the way(where it wraps around). then hammer and dolly the crease from the back to the front(not so bad to worse part) dont worry about the front lip, yet. just get hte metal straight. after its straight then work the curve back over. if the metal bows out even though its straight you will need to heat shrink it. take your torch set and get a spot red hot but not melting. then take a rag soaking in a bucket of water next to you- wipe/drench the red hot spot a few times till its cool to the touch. repeat this uuntil the metal is flat and tight and doesnt "tin can"
You could push it from behind, i'd stuff a crowbar in there, and hit the bar with a hammer as close to the end as possible. Better yet i'd follow Earl's suggestion, i'd cut it at the crease, push it out, and weld it back. You'll probably have to put heat on it, it's a safe bet it's hardened as hell right now.
that is a nasty crease you got there. that bugger is stretched pretty good. I'd have just cut it along the crease and welded it back together. one more thing.. you should start a repair in the reverse of the damage. many times when you fix the start of a dent, the remainder falls into place on it's own more or less.
Wow, that's a lot more damage than I thought. The other guys have good suggestions, you're going to have to do major surgery to get it done. Cutting, and heat will straighten it out pretty well. It's not impossible.
Lots of great Info Thanks so much. sounds like i have a lot to do. I'll post my results. Unfortunantly it's not possable to bolt the fender back on at this point because the whole clip is removed. I'm in the middle of installing an aerostar front clip and new engine and trans. I'll do what I can until it goes back together and finish it up on the truck. I still have a couple of other small dents to work out and the other fender needs a little work too. Thanks for all the great advice. I will post an update when I get it done. Mike
Mike The entire front section can be had new aftermarket. Or there is a entire new fender being reproduced by the old obsolete ford in Oklohoma for the 61 to 66. The ammount of work to get the dual compound curves to look good and match the lip edge of the 64 grill is bear to get right with out serious mud use. That ones spare parts for the rear of the fender. Garbz
i read a book on a budget trick used to pull dents w/o a slide hammer. if i recall correctly a guy brazed a penny to the tip of a welding rod, and brazed the penny to the bare metal in the middle of the dent. and using a large vise grip and a 2x4 for leverage, would pull the dent out. makes it sound easy but given the thick-ass sheetmetal on old cars, i don't think it will be so easy. hondas, maybe.
Mike Dont try to fix the fender off the truck. Wait till the clip is back on . If not look at the option of replacement. Been in the body trade for more years than willing to admit. Everytime I have seen someone start a repair of this type without the initial pull , the problems never seemed to stop. The fender needs to be finessed back into shape not bullied . Everyone will have their idea of what to do based on their expierience but the fact remains that if this fenders dimensional form isnt restored first all the hammering ,shrinking and filling will be wasted . Theres nothing worse than installing the repaired and refinished part only to find out that the grille doesnt fit and the hood wont line up . Larry
Thanks guys, I've seen the aftermarket fenders but at $275 a pop i figured I'd try to fix this one first. Then all I've lost is time if it doesn't work. I thought about the patch panels too. They are only about $45 I may go ahead and go this route. I gave up on trying to find a good used one. They are either junk or someone wants to sell me a whole truck. I think I can fix the other one. This is deffantly the worst one. But I figure at least I'm learning something I didn't know before. Thanks again for all the help. Mike
I would first remove all the paint, then cut away the inner part that is in the way of getting access to the backside. So that after the bodywork, the weld will be easy to do and the shrink caused by the weld will be easy to stretch back out with a hammer and dolly. To repair the dent, either back up the outside with a flat dolly, or set it on a steel workbench or piece of plate, and hammer from the inside. If a spot is tough to move, use a tiny bit of heat (no color change) to make the work easier. There is no good reason to heat sheet metal to orange or red hot. It is not necessary in order to work the metal or shrink it, and will distort the panel and make it harder to smooth. You really do need to check the fender on the car as you work as mentioned before. Here is an article that help: http://metalshapers.org/101/jkelly/index.html John www.ghiaspecialties.com
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