What @F-ONE said. STOP right now and get literature that will help you understand what a flathead is all about! There is a vast amount of knowledge available and freely given here on the H.A.M.B., but arm yourself with your own understanding of what you have. Also search videos by @Mart to get tips on disassembly, evaluation and reassembly. Advice given here as well as in Mart's videos assume (and we all know what that means) that you know what a flathead is all about. Learn as much as you can before you proceed! FWIW that car deserves a quality (not over the top) rebuild with reliability as a top priority. Do it right, do it once. Go cautiously Grasshopper...
Way off topic but we have a 1919 Oakland this was the exact case on. WP was froze completely solid once I took that out of the equation I was able to turn it over with the hand crank just fine. Bitchin' coupe btw @Busmania.
Let me correct the math in my former post. To get to to stock bore pistons for a 239 would require removing the sleeves plus an additional .045" overbore. This may be helpful as you may be able to use some used pistons from the 42-48 engine... with new rings.
Are you saying the cylinders have been sleeved and are not stock? Again I have yet to measure anything so I have no idea. And to those concerned (haha). I have books on order, already read one front to back and will do plenty of homework on measurements, shops, books etc before I really take my next move. I understand the Flathead is it’s own beast…much like the other engines of other brands I’ve built successfully (and maybe some unsuccessfully) in the past. I will treat it with love, care and patience. Should be done by tomorrow evening.
Cylinders were sleeved from new for a couple years in that era. Often the floating bearings are in good shape and can be reused if you keep track of exactly where they all came from. Nice car !
Do you mean these bearings? I was going to ask if they were “floating”. these are the only ones I’ve removed so far. I labeled them. There is a gash in the surface but it almost looks like it was that way from factory (I find this hard to believe)? But there is not weird galling or damage on the crank in this same area.
I don't think I'd run those rod bearings but I'm picky about stuff like that. Also be aware that both surface of the rod throws and the ID of the rods have to be considered when running full floaters.
I really love this tread, reminds me so much of my own history when also going from VW’s and British motorcycles to American steel. Harley Panhead first, then ‘40 Deluxe coupe. And learning Flatheads. Same stuff, just different! A pleasure to follow you!
Thanks. Yeah the bearings don't look all that great! The ID of the rods so far look almost new...again without measuring yet. not a single scratch or mark or galling or anything. Joel, what is the pencil test?
You have an awesome story I've chills what a feeling to get and have your own and that's some great patina half original paint you should set sand it so as to polish harden the patina or it will get to eating it thin in no time . Dig on the radiator hoses and a flattie all ready and saying " Please drive me " Happy for you man ! Enjoy Busmania
Thanks for the kind words thus far everyone! I got the bottom end finished. Sorry to bore y’all with this stuff but I’m documenting some of it for my own future reference. I’m waiting on the valve pry bar tool and then I’ll get the cam and valves out. So far the only thing that may be concerning (and I don’t even know if it’s concerning?) is the dark spots on the cam. Other than that, everything “looks” good! Advice time. I’ll be buying measuring tools (dial calipers etc). I should have done it a long time ago. Anyway, if this was yours and budget is somewhat of a consideration though not too important cause I want to do it right, would you put this back together and run it? Budget is only concerning because my spreadsheet of other parts is about $20k long! I obviously know there are some risks involved with putting it back together after a thorough cleaning. But again, so far it all looks great upon visual inspection. If it checks out measuring wise what would you do? Is it a pipe dream that it actually measures out in spec?
Looks good. The pencil test is to determine if its a pre war, or post war motor. Pre war block has a pretty much vertical front over the timing cover, with a slight ledge the correct size for a pencil to lay on. The post war, 59a blocks have a slope in the front, out to the timing cover, no shelf for the pencil to rest on
That cam doesn't look bad, but you'll want to check the lifters out carefully. I'd do a quick check of the existing valve lash before pulling the valves, that will tell you a little about the over-all condition of the valve train. That block is a '40, pre-war, it passes the pencil test.
Good call on the valve lash. I will make sure I do that before taking it apart further. I have every reason to believe the engine may be original. Any way to prove it?
Hmmm, does this tell if it’s pre or post war? Welsh plugs in the pan rails suggest it is a pre-war block.
per warbird it’s pre war which to me is just another piece of evidence it’s original. And I just went down a rabbit hole about welsh plugs. What they are>history>uses etc.
Nice '40! I’m a bus guy too, I saw your post about the coupe on the other site as well. Looking forward to the progress.
I don't know how to determine if it's original, but I'm sure someone here or on The Ford Barn can answer you... I know earlier Fords were stamped with matching engine and chassis serial numbers, not sure about a '40.
Your front main is excellent and that is the one that usually shows signs of vibration with small hammered divets in the bearing faces . Get another cam or have this one reground . A little heavier duration will do the engine good but spoil the perfect silent idle a little bit still idle smooth and your freeway entrances will be improved
The plugs in the pan rail makes it a 39-41-ish block. There are no serial numbers stamped on it to guarantee its the original to that car. Another indicator of a 40 era block is the tin sleeves, which I can see the fold at the deck, but I can't see through the grunge at the crankcase. Can you feel the tin sleeves with your fingernail down there?
The "lip" on the front of the block immediately above the cam gear cover is more pronounced on the 40. If you lay a pencil on that lip and it doesn't roll off, it's a 40 block. I've never had one to test this personally.
I can feel a very slight edge. Also looks like I can maybe see where the sleeve ends and the cast iron starts. Question, if it is sleeved, is the benefit that if you remove sleeves, it makes it have more displacement and thus more power? How much power are we talking? This might be the death nail which leads to a rebuild. Placing a straight edge along the top of the block on the 5-8 side, there is a slight rocking motion of the flat edge. The other side is perfectly flat. The warped side measures .021" of gap. Is that too much to get away with without machining the head surface? The heads both have no gap when checking with a straight edge.
I don't think your method is accurate enough. The deck would be spotless clean, and a real machinists straight edge would be in use. Many folks say to not cut the deck if you can avoid it with flatheads as they are thin to start with.
Thanks rusty. I figured it wasn’t the best method but it’s all I had on hand. Not to mention it’s just a harbor freight metal yard stick. But it was all I have on hand so figured it was better than nothing!
If the sleeves are removed and you give it a slight clean up bore, I think it adds about 300 horsepower. Not really. But I wasn't sure you are reading my posts, because you don't seem to believe the info I have given you further up the thread.
That thing is screaming for a Cadillac 331 mated to a Ford 3.03 (keeping the column shift) into a round back 9". All with F100 front brakes. GREAT looking car .......
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