What transmission would a guy have ran behind a hopped up FE in a Model A hot rod built in say 60-63? Early Ford 3 speed? Car 3 speed adapter to floor shift? Slushbox? Just in the planning stage and was wondering. I've seen hemi powered cars built around the same time period with early Ford 3 speeds....
Whatever it is, something compact, especially if you have a channeled body. Three pedals is a lot to fit if there is a pronounced tunnel.
Anything but a slushbox.... Would have to be a T85 as that is pretty much what everyone was using up to 1964. If you want a better transmission it would be a toploader but as you know they weren't introduced until 1964.
I don’t remember seeing many FE’s in model A’s back then. They’re big, A’s are small and they were fairly new. Three speeds or A T-10 we’re probably most likely.
Ford offered a four speed as a factory option starting in 1962, according to the factory brochures. The T-10 was around in 1961 and earlier in GM cars, although I don't know if anyone was adapting them to the FE block. Also, those early cast iron T-10s weren't known for durability, so a three speed was probably a better choice anyway.
FE 406 with a 4 speed with tri-power came factory in Galaxie's. I have a friend with this set-up in a 30 roadster. he has not driven it in several years, been trying to buy it from him but he is not ready to sell. I am 71, and he is a bit older than me. he may outlast me.
I'd imagine you could run whatever you want really. Aside from what has already been mentioned, you could get an adapter to a Chevy manual, Ford T5 or Chevy automatic. So that opens up a world of possibilities outside of the factory equipment.
As already mentioned, the T10 was a available in the Galaxie starting in '62. Personally, I agree with @57JoeFoMoPar - run whatever you want .. (as long as it's a manual ).
The T10 was actually offered in the late 61 full sized ford. It was shipped in the trunk, and the dealer cut a hole in the tunnel and installed it. That’ info from the FE message board. The T10 was factory installed in the 62s. The fully synchronized 3.03 top loader was introduced in 63.
The T10 4-speed was available at Ford as a dealer-installed option in mid-year '61. If ordered, it was delivered in the trunk. Not many were sold as few buyers were aware of it. It was a RPO '62 /63 until '64 when Ford switched to their new toploader behind the FE as the T10 wasn't up to the task for the HiPos. Some did end up behind the lower-powered FEs as Ford was having difficulty building the toploader fast enough. The majority of small blocks got the T10 until about '67 because of this shortage. GM basically designed the T10 but didn't want to spend the money for tooling up to build it, so handed the design to BW for final development/production but limited BW from selling it to anyone else until calendar year '61.
My Buddy has a 63 1/2 R code untouched car . It has a BW cast iron T10 . I think the Top Loader was a 65 start . But not 100 % sure .But your $$$ into new stuff a Tremec 5 speed is my choice .
The toploader came out in '64, but it still retained the early '49-64 narrow-trans bolt pattern. Ford changed that in '65 to the now-common wide pattern. As the narrow-pattern trans won't fit any Ford V8 motor built from '65-up except for the FE (and there you need a '58-64 FE bell), there isn't much call for them these days.
Since there's not much call for the narrow pattern 4 speeds, if you happen to have a couple laying around collecting dust and getting in your way, I'd be happy to pay you slightly more than scrap iron price for them. Just to keep you from having to make the trip to the scrap yard, of course.
I actually have an old adapter for FE to early ford 3 speed. The problem with the other 3 and 4 speeds are the shifter would be so far back it would be in the seat. A 3 speed or 4 speed with a jeep top would work but wouldn't hit the time period. Early 3 speed with the torque tube and banjo would definitely work.
I am buying a 61 Starliner that has a 352+with 3 spd on column. I want to change to 4 speed on floor. It sounds like I need to stay with the early bolt pattern and smaller # tooth spline. I’m wanting to know if a 64 top loader will be a direct fit or if I will have to go with T10?
If you get the right one, yes, it's a direct fit. There's a couple of tailshaft lengths, the full-size cars used the long one. The Falcon/Comet toploaders were the short tailshaft and used a weird trans mount but aren't all that common, the Fairlane used an intermediate length. The tailshaft will have the shifter mounts on it, with different locations depending on OEM install. The 'big' input shaft didn't appear until later (late '65/66), the early ones will be the same as your 3-speed. Check here for more info... David Kee Toploader Transmissions, Inc. (4speedtoploaders.com) If you're trying to do a 'correct' restore, a '61 would have had the T10 which should live behind a 352; it was the larger motors it couldn't handle. Do check the length of the input pilot shaft; the FE used a shorter one (about 7/8"), the small blocks were 1 3/8" long and may bottom out in the crank. Cutting about 1/4" off the end of the pilot will fix this. At this late date finding one with 'mixed' parts isn't uncommon.
I don't remember the model number, but Ford had a fully synchronized 3 speed in the mid 60's. No problem getting it in low gear coming up to a stop light.
"NO SLUSH BOX! 3 PEDALS! 5 SPEED!" Bullshit. You know who used autos? Smart guys who knew packaging and longevity were premium concerns. Some of those old guys would say "You can't outthink an automatic" and enjoyed less time fixing driveline and more time driving. Of course you do you, but sometimes rational choices get blurry in the wake of, well, see the above quotes again. Last thought, unless you plan to be judged on serial numbers, date codes, production specs and more, when is the last time anyone crawled on the ground to look at a trans unless it was for a repair? Yeah, that's what I thought...
The problem here is a very limited choice in bolt-in automatics for the FE. Ford only offered them with two autos; the cast-iron Cruisomatic from '58 to about '66, and the C6 after that. Ford wouldn't install the Cruisomatic behind the HiPos because it couldn't take the power, and the C6 while nearly bulletproof is a mileage-killer. Ford built a handful of automatic-equipped '64 thunderbolts, but those used reworked Lincoln units, not Ford trans.
The top loader was also made from Expensium too. Even back then. Rodders avoided "slush boxes" in the early '60s. You could buy a Galaxie with 3 on the column or you could get an adapter to run the early box. I was not building in that era but I was busy learning from the old guys. The 3 speed from a bigger truck (late 40s) was desirable if you were going to use an early tranny. They were made from cardboard instead of paper.
With money from my first full time job after HS, 1965, Bought a 62 Ford 2 door 390 4 speed...Didn't take me long to break the trans and a short time later to tear up the rear axle spider gears..After the repairs it held up ok..
I had the chance to buy 3 BW T89 transmissions from a member here (Thanks Jeff!). They are said to have come out of early sixties Ford pickups and all three have the R11 overdrive. My research tells me they are essentially the same as T85's. According to an article in Hemmings "The major difference between the two transmissions is the mainshaft; the T-85 uses a helically cut first and reverse mainshaft, whereas the T-89 has a straight-cut mainshaft." They both have the curved bottom side cover. I plan on using these behind a 303 Olds and 331 hemi I have. I was initially planning on running a '50 Ford overdrive tranmission behind these engines and have the proper adapters for both. However. a little checking revealed that these transmissions are quite weak and not really up to handling the increased torque of even an older OHV engine. I have done some preliminary measuring, and while the bolt pattern for bothe early and late transmissions are the same, the register hole on the back of each adapter will have to be opened up .200" to accommodate the later transmission. The pilots are .002 larger and I expect they could be bored out to work. The length of the input shaft is the same, so minimum machine work will be required. Anyway, one of these should be a natural choice behind an FE, and they should not be that hard to find. Also, in the final analysis, I prefer a properly operating overdrive preferable to a four speed in a street driven vehicle,.
Those R11s are quite valuable. I wanted to put one behind my close ratio Toploader in my Galaxie and that all seem to be $1000+. That's why I ended up going with the Granada 3+OD.
So after hearing all the input and btw….thanks to all, what would it take to just keep my 3 spd and transfer it to the floor? I know I need a bench seat shifter, but what shifter/box/linkage would work best?
Yes, yes, and yes. Still, with all the adapter options available today there's possible options. AOD, even a glide or built C4 for room concerns. I know Ford had power issues with autos early on, but this sounds like a street car vs Gas Ronda chasing a championship.
The Ford 303 with the Jeep tower mount would be a good option. It is a strong transmission. GM had it as their base transmission in the GTO.
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