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Technical 396 overhaul

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by squirrel, Dec 5, 2021.

  1. hemihotrod66
    Joined: May 5, 2019
    Posts: 968

    hemihotrod66
    Member

    When you use a gear drive without an idler gear the cam rotates in a reverse direction...This eliminated the time chain...It stabilizes the cam and ignition timing....No chain stretch..
     
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  2. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 56,040

    squirrel
    Member

    Engineering and accounting aren't all that different...I guess that's why I kept all those old papers. I was into photography quite a bit about the time I started high school, but got into cars pretty heavily later and didn't take any pictures of them. Fortunately my dad did get some. He went out to the drags one night, and got some pictures of the truck racing, too. Otherwise it would all be only (faint) memories.

    racing2.jpg
     
  3. Squirrel, this is a great thread. Very cool that you have saved all of the paperwork and parts over the years. I’ve never had a chance to have big blocks, they have always been hard to come by around here, but have had some of the same experiences as you with small blocks.
     
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  4. wicarnut
    Joined: Oct 29, 2009
    Posts: 9,068

    wicarnut
    Member

    Kool Thread !
     
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  5. 4tford
    Joined: Aug 27, 2005
    Posts: 1,824

    4tford
    Member

    Great story, I have the same addiction with engines except mine is with mopar engines. I currently have a complete drivetrain sitting in my barn for my car completely done since 2007. you never know when you will need a spare! I could use a 396 also for my chevelle.
     
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  6. banjeaux bob
    Joined: Aug 31, 2008
    Posts: 6,634

    banjeaux bob
    Member
    from alaska

    Jim, I'm more impressed with your fastidious record keeping.
     
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  7. SilverJimmy
    Joined: Dec 2, 2008
    Posts: 528

    SilverJimmy
    Member

    Wow Jim! We could have been classmates if only you had lived in Page! I also was Class of ‘79 and was eating and breathing everything Big Block Chevy. I too still have my How to Hot Rod BBC that I bought when I was 15 years old. Luckily for me when Navajo Generating Station got built in the early 70’s suddenly our School District had so much money our new High School had everything brand new, including a fully equipped Vocational Auto Shop with all the tooling to remanufacture any engine. We even had a caustic tank! That thing would dissolve anything that wasn’t cast iron or steel, can’t even fathom a school having one today, let alone machines with spinning cutters and grinders! By my Junior year I pretty much had free run of all the equipment so I only had to buy parts and then machine everything myself. I was in the VICA Club all four years and we got to go to the Winter Nationals at Beeline Dragway in February 1979 and watch Don Gartlis and Shirley Mulldowney race! Did you go to that race? Cool that you’re building your old 396 again, I just dropped off my set of 990 heads for the 454 going in my 63 Chevy II, should be a runner! I’m watching this thread for sure!
     
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  8. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 56,040

    squirrel
    Member

    The AHRA had their Winternationals at Tucson Dragway...which is where I saw Garlits and Muldowney racing in 1979
     
  9. BamaMav
    Joined: Jun 19, 2011
    Posts: 6,740

    BamaMav
    Member
    from Berry, AL

    Damn, I can’t keep up with receipts for stuff I’ve bought in the last week, and you have them from the 1970’s!

    I’m a piss poor record keeper......
     
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  10. vtx1800
    Joined: Oct 4, 2009
    Posts: 1,715

    vtx1800
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    great story, enjoyed every word:)
     
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  11. stanlow69
    Joined: Feb 21, 2010
    Posts: 7,348

    stanlow69
    Member Emeritus

    My first car at 16(1986) has a factory 427. Timing chain went out the first week. Changed valve cover gaskets. Now it has over 155 thousand miles on it. Burns a little oil. But gets me where I want to go.
     
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  12. lake_harley
    Joined: Jun 4, 2017
    Posts: 2,170

    lake_harley
    Member

    Great time line story. I especially liked the photos and description of using used pistons, as well as the photos of the honed, not-so-perfect cylinders with rust pits for good measure. Sometime I think good enough is good enough......but that's just not good enough for everybody!:cool:

    Lynn
     
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  13. The 396 in a Nova stock car was a slick move for us, since any engine that was offered in the car was legal. It was a claimer class at $800, but who had that sort of $$ back then? We would have made money on the deal. I have an excel sheet with all sorts of combinations when I get ready to build my next one up.
     
  14. slowmotion
    Joined: Nov 21, 2011
    Posts: 3,330

    slowmotion
    Member

    Squirrel threads are always an interesting read.. I'm in...
     
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  15. lippy
    Joined: Sep 27, 2006
    Posts: 6,825

    lippy
    Member
    from Ks

    Jim, Great story. I also bought a 65 396 out of a caprice in a junkyard in about 76 or so. Did your 396 have the grooved rear cam bearing. Mine did. I stuck regular bearings in it and had the rear cam journal grooved at the machine shop. Lippy
     
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  16. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 56,040

    squirrel
    Member

    Mine has the groove on the bearing, and it was getting oil to the valvetrain ok with an ungrooved cam. I was thinking about adding a groove to the cam that goes into it this time, just to make sure. I've been doing some reading on the subject...
     
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  17. bushwacker 57
    Joined: Oct 3, 2007
    Posts: 636

    bushwacker 57
    Member

    Great story in 1967 my Hi school buddy bought a crate alum head L88 closed chamber from Les Vogel chev in San Francisco 850.00 we installed with a Bill Thomas kit mounts and headers in his 55 150. we were 21 years old.
     
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  18. 51504bat
    Joined: May 22, 2010
    Posts: 4,784

    51504bat
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    While I was in the Army in 1972 I was stationed north of Reno, NV. I had a POS '63 Chevy 4x4 carryall with a 230 six and 3 on the tree. The old six wasn't cutting it on long drives on US 395. So for 50 bucks I bought a complete core 327 at the Mustang junk yard located just down the road from the Mustang Ranch. I rebuilt it in the hobby shop using a couple of tires for an engine stand. It served me well after I got out until I traded up to a '78 GMC one ton 4x4.
     
  19. Fogger
    Joined: Aug 18, 2007
    Posts: 1,809

    Fogger
    Member

    Great story Jim. In '68 a friend had a 396 bored to 427 and wanted to run it in my '55 Gasser. It had the factory gear drive, no idler gear, and a reverse ground Chet Herbert roller cam and distributor gear. That design always seemed logical to me eliminating the chain and being able to lock in a precise cam position. Car ran into the 10s with a 4-speed and I shifted it at 8,000. It was a great engine setup.
     
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  20. Moselli
    Joined: Feb 16, 2009
    Posts: 107

    Moselli
    Member

    Back in 1970 we experimented with the gear drive cam in a 427 big block chevy motor. This cam was a factory part and it seemed like it would be the shiznit even though the word shiznit was invented yet.

    The issue we ran into was the reverse drive gear for the distributor. As I recall, our motor builder recommended a bronze gear. We kept destroying this distributor gear. My memory is fuzzy but it seemed to have something to do with the reverse rotation pushing up on the distributor? As my friend Kenny said, "The motor don't like that." Kenny was the first genius I had known at that point in my life.

    In any case, we pulled out the reverse drive cam and gears and threw them down over the bank and installed the factory high performance chain drive cam and lived happily thereafter.

    Moselli

    “This ain’t my first rodeo.” – Me, at my second rodeo.


     
  21. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 56,040

    squirrel
    Member

    There's probably a lesson in there about Chevy using chains in everything after a few years. Although apparently the Marine engines kept the gears for quite a while?
     
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  22. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 56,040

    squirrel
    Member

    Anyways....I was pondering making a pin stop tool, for hanging the rods. The start of my copy of a tool I could just buy....

    tool start.jpg
     
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  23. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 13,231

    Budget36
    Member

    Do you just press them in cold or heat the rods with something first?
     
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  24. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 56,040

    squirrel
    Member

    I'll heat them with a torch...I'll try the propane torch first, it's easier to avoid hot spots with it. I did order some temp crayon, already.

    I've done it a few times at a machine shop using a heater, so I'm aware of some of the problems I'll face.
     
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  25. Truckedup
    Joined: Jul 25, 2006
    Posts: 4,660

    Truckedup
    Member

    Yunick mentioned the Chevy gear drive. He said it was better than the chains of his time but they eventually got worn for longer distance racing
    Chains, HyVo and roller can last a long time when using guides and a tension device...
     
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  26. lippy
    Joined: Sep 27, 2006
    Posts: 6,825

    lippy
    Member
    from Ks

    Plus a chain will retard the cam when it gets worn. Instant top end charge. :D
     
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  27. Cams used to be in abundance with the groove already there. I talked it over with my engine builder as I have a 1966 block myself. He says it is no big deal and waves his hand over at a monster clunker of an engine lathe.

    Which means he may dog the groove end (locate off the dowel holes on a plate or piece of round stock to nest it) and use the tailstock to support the other end. I can't see a cast cam whipping around in a spindle tube.
     
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  28. Even with a rod heater I usually manage to get one stuck halfway in every time I do a set.
     
  29. Would it help to chill the pins first? :confused:
     
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  30. Truckedup
    Joined: Jul 25, 2006
    Posts: 4,660

    Truckedup
    Member

    A 396 story, in 1971 I bought a 69 Chevelle 396/350 4 spd... Nice looking car.. I pussied it on the road test and when I got it home the engine bogged horrible when the throttle opened up...The Quadra jet was missing secondary metering rods...Then came oil fouled spark plus despite little smoke from the exhaust. Some so called big block experts said they all used oil and proper valve guide seals would fix it... So I pulled the heads and had the work done...It still fouled plugs... The bores looked ok but it must be rings...I had no where to pull an engine so I put in the anti foul spark plug extenders.... The worked a bit better but the engine lost power....I eventually sold the car...
     
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