Projects California- Complete Vehicle Definition

Hello All,

I had a very eventful time at the DMV today when I brought my my car down to get a VIN verification. I was informed they wouldn't verify it today because it was incomplete, when I asked what would be considered complete, the person would only say doors, steering wheel, and windshield. When Not needing them in the past for a vin verification, I left them at home. I told her I could easily run home and put them one. She said she would still refuse to do the verification.

Ill spare the details of the over 20 minute conversation where I tried to get her to give me a written list so that I can make sure an check all the boxes for the next attempt. In the end, she called the CHP and said I was causing a scene. As you would guess, I walked away with nothing.

I still have no idea what constitutes a complete vehicle. I am not trying to register it, just get a title. I understand I can pay for a service. I chose to do it myself as I live 5 minutes from a sleepy town DMV office, and have the flexibility in my schedule. Does anyone have a definition of the required parts needed to constitute a vehicle?

 

I was told it had to be a running driving car and that I would have to take it to Bakersfield and have it inspected by a CHP officer. I was also told there were no options other than the CHP. When I called the CHP in Bakersfield they told me I would have to bring it there and they didn't know anything about anyone else that could do a vin inspection. This was the model A in my avatar and I would have had to drive it there and then pull the apron and lift the body so they could see the original vin number even though it has a PA vin number of the firewall and on the title. The officer told me the car could have been stolen and they needed to check the original vin. I doubt this was true but I chose to simply leave the state as it looked to be a really uphill expensive fight.

 

Look at the one you drove to the DMV, that's what she wants to see.

 

I'd be tempted to go to a California Legislator and complain about the lack of service. Having been a state employee for over 30 years I've seen some of my peers look forward to being negative service providers, not many of them just a couple of ding dongs that I'd like to forget

 

about 30 years ago I had to do exactly that....unbolt the body and lift it up enough for the CHP to read the vin#on a 29 hiboy I built....funny though....it was a 32 frame but they registered it as a 29....go figure.

 

What does Webster’s say about complete? Been that way for years. I took a trailer I built over 25 years ago. I was refused because it wasn’t “complete”.

 

I had the same issue here in Nevada....Had to raise up the body on an A model that I had inherited...of course the doors wouldn't shut right till I shimmed the body....What a deal it as...

 

I’d venture grille, headlights, doors and windshield and you pass, unless they remember the “scene.”

 

I'm dreading my turn at this...

 

SEMA SAN - Titling guidelines

click on California to load up a .pdf or you can download it.

It may or may not have some useful bits.

This is the Cali DMV site / there are other links in there, poke around.

good luck.

 

I've had this happen to me twice and never again. Waited in line at the dmv in my truck with a '50 Olds on my trailer...complete but derelict looking car with the front bumper off and in the back of my truck. Lady came out and wouldn't do the verification because it was incomplete. I nearly lost my shit.

Years later when I forgot about the Olds incident..I took another car that didn't have an engine...again the lady said it was incomplete and wouldn't do the verification. I asked her what difference does it make you don't verify anything on the engine anyway. I demanded she show me in the DMV law/rules/code book where it says they can only do verifications on complete vehicles. She simply went inside and never came back out.

Lesson learned? STAY AWAY FROM THE DMV AT ALL COSTS!! I use a private vin verifier...have for years...haven't looked back. Some DMV employees lord what little power they have over you with extreme cruelty. They don't give a shit about you or your car...if you leave in a huff...they think...good! I can go back inside and be a lazy POS. Are all DMV employees bad? No..just more than average.

 

However you proceed, it sounds like you'd best be going to a different office next time.

 

It is not defined in the law. It is the inspector's discretion.

Download and print out form REG31.

Flag down a local cop, and ask them if they will do the verification.

 

That does not look like a complete vehicle to me. That is because it is a jalopy!



Sorry about your negative outcome at the DMV office on Friday. Maybe, going to the DMV on another day would have had a better outcome. I have found that Mondays are not good to get business done, every worker is overwhelmed with everyone's needs and problems, plus Monday things just always seem to go wrong for everyone. Tuesday to Thursday, work load is better, and these are the days to get someone to DO work for you. The problem is that on Tuesday thru Thursday, you are very busy doing work, and can't take time to get someone to take care of the work needing done for you. Then comes Fridays, the work staff is short handed, some took Friday off, or take off early in the day, and the one's left behind are not happy to be at work, while they are planning and dreaming about their own weekend plans. So, Friday's, is the wrong day to successfully get anything done for you, by someone else.

 

Thanks for all the replies. When I was explaining the problem to the CHP, his first 2 questions of me were, "Do you ever watch the show cops? Have you ever noticed what happens to the stick in the mud?" At that point I called him out for threatening me, and I knew instantly I was not going to be welcomed to the CHP office for verification either.

I have found that the DMV has rules stating that they cant verify a pile of parts, which is understandable. I just dont like putting work into a project until I have a title, and the car is legally mine. The last time I checked the cost of a private verification service was $400+ in my area if a person can be found. We all gotta eat, I get it, but that's a big chunk of change. Guess I'll venture to the next county CHP office after slapping parts together.

 

After reading all this shit, I guess I'll just keep my stamps and drawer full of 'historical documents'....

 

They want to see a car that resembles what left the factory,BUT worn out. Make it so. Part of the problem is two of you guys used the word SHE to describe the inspector.Since many ladies understand little about old cars.....and old car guys they fall back on what the book says,and wont budge an inch to cover their own back side.You cant blame them for that the state has no sense of humor if you cross them.In a perfect world you would find a car guy who works at DMV,but good luck there. Myself I would gladly pay a title service/ verifier service to make my life easier.Its going to cost thousands to get that car finished any way so bust out your wallet. I learned the hard way to walk away from unregistered cars long ago.My 32 PU looked just like yours the day I went to look at it,and I was turning to leave when the old lady who was selling it said the registration is current.I said as in you have this years sicker on the plate? Why she paid 20 years of registration is beyond me,but I bought the heap solely on that. When you go to state bean counters to get something done never blow them out of the water because they are in charge for the moment.Listen to what little clues they give you by accident,and then make your project resemble what they said. I once had a dmv verifier tell me the frame number was under the paint on the front left frame rail on a 32 Ford. I smiled,and thanked her for the information.......the second time I went to see her the rail was sanded off,and THERE was the number! you 32 guys know what happened in between. Good luck with the project.

 

This^^^. I had a 1950 Chevy pick up years ago. Same story. DMV old hag says "Its not complete". Hell I drove the damned thing there! Had a police officer friend of my mothers sign it off. Easy peasy.

 

Exactly.

I do wonder though.. The Vin Verification forms requires make, year, etc.. On a vehicle with no clear identification how do they know what it is, what year? Just by the owners say so? I've seen the CHP do some historical VIN number checks (on a motorcycle I had them do), but what about the DMV?

 

Glad we don't have that hard of time here. I've registered vehicles with a pencil written bos on a paper sack and nothing else before.
Although there was the one time I was trying to get the tag and title on the wife's Expy we had just bought, the power hungry woman wouldn't accept the title because the previous owner printed his name instead of signing it in cursive! Hell, they don't even teach cursive in school anymore, and the guy was a Mexican so he may not have even knew how. We had to go back to the seller and he scribbled something like a signature that was totally illegible, and the power hungry bitch accepted it! That just proved she was just being a bitch the first time. I now avoid her if I go in there, I'll wait on someone else.

 

$400 for a private registration service is a bargain in my opinion when I factor in my shop rate vs. time it takes to get all the paperwork in a row, inspections, etc. I've used multiple registration services and they've always been much easier to deal with than the DMV/CHP. The DMV worker has absolutely no motivation for you to leave their office pleased with their service. The registration service however, being a private business, knows their customer service reflects the potential success of said business and will be much more motivated to get you squared away and happy. You've already spent how many hours to get no where with the DMV. How much more of your time are you willing to waste? Go the private registration route and move on with your project. Good luck and let us know how you get along!

 

My first thought was to make sure you don't go back to that DMV office. Chances are quite high that the sleepy town DMV office you live 5 minutes away from will remember you, and if not they will remember the blue and brown Model A.

Kansas registrations are pretty easy, especially when compared to some of the stories I've heard from other states.

 

I said this in another thread , polite , curious, patient.

they are government workers doing a job and need to follow the rules .
Yes some take the little power they have and wield it like a sword.

not most , but the ones who do can drive you crazy.

my parents inherited an estate and with it came a 12 year old Ford Focus , my mom went to one DMV and was told she needed death certificate, probate , safety inspection, emission inspection , lawyer letters noterized documents blah blah blah.
My mom laughed and said the car ain’t worth the effort.
Following week went into another DMV office and was told to just show the death certificate and ownership $20 dollars later car was in my moms name.

 

LOL I had them refuse to title/register a harley once because it did not have stock paint. I ultimately rode over to Sacto to get it done.

Good luck.

 

I don't understand what the big problem is. Buy a car with a title..... easy peasy !! Take the title down and transfer it to your name. It is far too much of a hastle to get a title from a BOS or try to get any other form of title. If you know you are going to build an assembled vehicle then you should know the hoops you have to go thru to get the title. If you don't, you should have looked into it before you decided to go that route.

 

In many states there is a difference depending on if the car is already titled in the state you want to do the transfer. In Kansas, buying a car with a title from another state does require a VIN check done at a KHP location before you can go to the DMV to get the title work done. If the car you buy already has a Kansas title, I can skip the KHP VIN verification and head directly to the DMV office. They don't need to see the car. A couple years ago I bought a pair of Model A frame rails with a matching Kansas title. I was able to transfer the title and register the rails as a complete vehicle. Ever seen just a pair of frame rails with a valid license plate?

 

I have found most of titling problems and dealing with DMVs are self inflicted...sorry.

 

Vehicle registration and the DMV in California is always a dicey deal. Anything can affect the outcome and some of it you have no control over, which is frustrating to say the least. Like someone mentioned, they have no motivation to do what you want them to do and the fact that they face dozens of rude, impatient, unknowledgeable customers each day doesn’t help. She probably didn’t have any idea how to interpret “complete” vehicle and wasn’t about to stick her neck out for you with an attitude and a car like that.
While it might be $400 to get a registration concierge to get it completely titled and registered (a decent price), some will do a simple VIN verification for less if you do the legwork at the DMV to start the process and get the forms. I start at AAA and see what they can do and what they recommend and proceed accordingly. Going into the California DMV is the last resort.

 

1949 IH KB1 frame. Bought as a pile-of-parts. Transferred the title on the way home and registered it as non-operational. I never did anything with it, the frame was very loose, I could put one end on the ground and twist it by hand... Project was beyond my skill set and budget. Sold it to @Terraizer about 10 years ago for 1/2 of what I paid for it. I suspect the diesel fuel for the round trip from CO cost more than this pile of parts.

Russ

 

California has eight times the number of registered motor vehicles as Alabama has people.

It is a scale and, scale of crime issue.

We don't have a remarkably higher level of theft and fraud here, just way more people and vehicles.