Projects 31 Model A 302 heads

So im struggling with the decision on heads for the sbf 302. I'm having the block (1979) rebuilt by a local machine shop and leaning towards new aluminum heads (possibly trick flow) vs reworking the stock ones. Everything I've read says the stock ones are garbage and not to waste any money on them.

Here is the current set up and what my intentions are so far.
This car is a 30 year old restoration that I did with my father back in the early 90's. The body is on a TCI (total cost involved) frame, with independent front suspension.
Engine is a stock 1979 302
C4 transmission (3 speed auto) Plan to have this rebuilt (slips a little currently) and used again, after some advice for others here I'm planning to keep it vs an AOD.
1970's 8" rear end 308 gears. Intend to leave this intact. (This site helped identify this for me previously)
I would like to have all components working together, IE. cam, transmission gearing, torque converter, rear end, heads?

I should also mention that this car will continue to be a weekend cruiser and not going to any track.
In my research, I have been looking at trick flow heads or possibly the trick flow top end kit with the cam. Hoping this would all work together since its part a kit? Anyone have any experience with the trick flow heads for this type of set up? Pros and cons? Also wondering if my current hooker headers would fit these heads? I read there are different angles from the exhaust ports, hence my question on the headers working? At the end of the day, I hope to spend wisely on the heads, gain a little hp? sure, why not. Just don't want to have any regrets on the head decision when I'm all done.

I am also planning to upgrade the distributor and coil to msd? (I need to research this a bit yet) (it currently has a stock points distributor) Would this eliminate the need for a brain box? It currently has the brain box wired in. Was looking to clean up the wiring a bit in the process.

I just recently started tearing into it, drained fluids so far and disconnected the battery. Got sick with covid and delayed my progress at this point. Figured I would reach out to the pro's here on HAMB to give me some insite and advice on the direction I hoping to go. Thanks in advance!

Happy Thanksgiving Everyone!

 

I thought that the gt40 heads were supposed to be a really good swap on the 302 and that the gt40 heads were cheap compared to aftermarket.

 

You have a DuraSpark electronic ignition on it in the pictures. Before you decide the heads are garbage consider what RPM you will being running this thing 90% of the time. Cam, heads, pistons you want to work at ? RPM. I have a MSD ready to run type dist. in my ford and it has served me well.

 

I'm not sure what ' spend wisely ' means to you but if it means sacraficing more $$ well my friend just bought a crated Ford Racing engine and it's a beaut with wonderful aluminum heads they did great work and runners are proper design . Can't go wrong with those I guarantee that info for you

 

They are!....

 

People never consider revving your engine to 6000 RPM on the street attracts every policeman in a quarter mile. Factory heads are fine for 4500 RPM.

 

While the Trick Flow heads are quality pieces, IMHO they will be a waste of money for your overall package. Throttle response at the RPM range you will be running will suffer. Put an earlier set of 302 heads on with 1.94/1.60 valves and a mild cam. The headers you have will fit. Ford used the same heads after 1977 in both the 302 and 351 with a 69 cc chamber.

 

When I was putting together my 289 I used RHS heads. I looked at all the heads available including the factory heads and compared all to stock heads. Stock gt40 heads are worth 40hp over stock as cast heads, Edelbrock 60 to 80 hp over stock heads, AFR, RHS, and Trick Flow 100+ hp over stock. There are a number of Chinese heads available but nothing I would consider. The hp bump of the heads is on a modified short block that will use the air increase, it's going from 350 hp to 450.
If you want to do a 302 on the cheap a die grinder, cam and lifters, 4v carb and intake manifold with a set of headers can get you 300 hp. It's the next 100 hp that costs....

 

1. Power wise, most any modern/current aluminum head will make more power. If that's what you want.
2. The aluminum heads will take a few pounds off of the front of the car, if that's what you want.
3. With 3.08 gears, you DON'T have an optimum combination..!
4. Your current heads, with a good valve grind and some port "pocket" cleanup work, should work just fine. Any further anticipated porting, buy the aluminum heads.
Yes, Trick Flow heads are a good bet.

Mike

 

^especially point 3!

 

Another suggestion would be World Products Windsor Jr. Steel heads. A little more costly than the Chinese aluminum heads.

 

I have a pretty long history with these engines. If money is a point, use gt4o or gt40p heads. The trickflow as cast 170cc heads are very good but you can't buy any right now due to shortages. There are flow charts on many heads in comparisons through out the years. The ford gt's are as good as many of the cast iron aftermarket heads. You need to determine what valve reliefs are in your pistons to make sure you have clearance. That's one of the benefits of trickflows. Because of your gear ratio, I would use a very mild camshaft so you don't loose your low end power. If you are staying with a flat tappet cam, summit has an inexpensive line of mild grinds that work well on the street.

 

I was going to mention these heads but forgot, they would be more period correct...

 

I like seeing your Model A, Nice!

 

Figure if it's a highway cruiser going to long distance shows etc. Or around town cruiser.
If long drives aren't the goal, more gear and a snotty cam will be more fun, they love to rev
That's all I got for 302 advice.

 

I like the idea of the World Products iron heads. They've had a pretty good product over the years.
Trouble is rebuilding old heads is if they the valves are sunk too far, been surfaced a couple times.
To rebuild a set of heads with new parts plus machining could be close to half the cost of a brand new set.
Myself I would be leaning towards brand new whatever brand you decide on, but not the Chinese junk.

 

I have the as cast 170 cc trickflow heads , XE268H Comp cam. T5 and 389 gear in my 33 coupe and couldn’t be happier ! Runs strong

 

If you haven’t taken the block to the machine shop, go get at roller cam block. In my opinion, less worries with break in and oil types. Find an explorer/mountaineer and you will get gt40p heads with it. That would be perfect for a street build.

CN

 

Aluminum heads due tend to run cooler...Just an added bonus and if they are ever damaged you can weld them.....

 

The C4 and 3.08 gears will be the limiting factors and are what you need to build around. You need low-end torque, not HP. With that said, my .02 worth...

Yep, those late '70s heads aren't good for HP. Ford designed them to emphasize torque so they're not a particularly bad choice here but you are leaving some HP on the table. The aftermarket heads will make big power at big RPM, but you need steeper rear gears and a high-stall torque convertor to take advantage of them, which will do nothing good for low RPM streetability. If you are willing to convert to a manual trans they become viable but that's another whole can of worms. So in this case, the GT40 heads would be the best choice. These were designed for similar applications with a good compromise between torque and HP. Set the motor up with about a 9.3 to 1 compression ratio, or higher if possible.

Camshaft choice becomes critical. I'd convert to a hydraulic roller cam with an emphasis on low-speed torque and a smooth idle. Don't get carried away, no rump-rump idling cams wanted here. One big advantage to rollers is you can get lift without low-end-killing duration which is one reason the factories went to them. Talk to your cam supplier, be honest in what you tell them and listen to their advice. Figure this out before you do the motor so you can decide on a recommended compression ratio.

Ignition. I'm not a fan of aftermarket distributors, one reason being they usually require proprietary replacement parts. I'd stick with the DuraSpark unit you have, and if you ditch the 'electronic' cap/adaptor/rotor that's on it now you can switch to the points-style cap/rotor for a vintage look (and is available anywhere). Dump the Motorcraft 'box' and switch to a MSD 6A, which will simplify the wiring, and hide the box out of sight. This is my default choice on these and has been for years, and this combo has so far proved to be dead-nuts reliable. You can retain the stock coil, no 'HiPo' unit needed.

And lastly, carburation. I've had great results with 450 CFM Holleys on 302s but those are getting hard to find in rebuildable condition and are now expensive if bought new. My current choice is the Summit 'Autolite' copy in the 500 CFM size with its annular-discharge boosters (a extra-cost option on the Holley and N/A on the Edelbrock). Ford motors just don't run as good with Edelbrock carbs IMO. This size will limit high-RPM power (the motor will run out of breathing at about 6K RPM) but the big improvement in low-speed throttle response is well worth the trade-off IMO. This will also help fuel economy.

That is good advice, and may save you some money and will save some hassle... You could sell your current running long block...

 

I used the Windsor jr. heads 'many moons' ago with good results. (I prefer the iron heads for several reasons)
Small 49 cc chambers is what you want with a flat top piston. In a light weight car with a 4 or 5 speed tranny a 3.08:1 will 'work'.....OK. Snotty cam too! It's not IDEAL for getting power to the ground but it will work ...OK.
Take a look at Skip White Performance for Alum. heads. They may appeal to you.
Light weight vehicles (under 3000 lbs) don't "need" a lotta gear to make them peppy.
Jus say'in.......
6sally6

 

Just install this: BluePrint Engines 302CI Crate Engine | Small Block Ford Style | Dresse

 

Where are you located? I have a set of 68 302 heads, and several sets of 69 351W heads with the larger valves in 94558

 

If a weekend cruiser is your goal I would suggest a 5.0 roller motor with a 4 bbl and a Pertonix distributor. This keeps your combination pretty simple and cheap. With the C4 and 3:08 gears as I run in my model A sedan your mileage should easily be close to mid 20 mpg. In my '33 coupe I run the same 5.0 roller motor with an AOD and 3.70 gear and the mileage has been 26 mpg for the last 107,000 miles. The '32 in my avatar runs a blown early 302 with a C4 and 3.55 gears and actually gets 16 MPG if I can keep my foot out of it.
I hope this helps you make your decisions. Remember weight is horsepower and these cars are very light.

 

Light car, cruiser use, 3.08 rear will be fine.
In a perfect world, I would say "roller block, GT cam (maybe an E303), E7 heads, dual plane intake, 85 Mustang 5-speed distributor (roller-compatible Duraspark out of the box), and small 4bbl carb."
Of course all of that is OT, and IF I were to say that, I would recommend period-appropriate tinwork/air cleaner/paint. And dual exhaust with decent mufflers.

 

I haven't ruled out the gt40 heads as an option, just thought I would ask if anyone had good experience with the trick flow heads or top end kit. Thank you for your advice, its nice to have confirmation from others on what worked for them.

 

So the duraspark should be fine then? Sounds like the MSD would be a good upgrade?

 

I must say, I have been looking at crate engines as an option. My fear is that I know what I have now fits and will fit again if I have it rebuilt. The crate engines are very tempting but don't seem to have enough info (from what I searched) to make me comfortable to pull the trigger on one. The oil pan among other things. Will it bolt right up? Everything is so tight on this that I'm trying to minimize any modifications to put it all back together. I'm a carpenter (wood guy) by trade and not a metal guy, so that presents some challenges for me. Plus I would like to leave a little something for me to do. Half the fun is the journey of the build and what I am able to do myself. Thank you for your reply.

 

Well said. As much as I would like to upgrade the heads, its always good to hear this to keep myself in check and not overthink it.

 

This is what I needed to hear. What is considered an early set of 302 heads? Years?