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Technical advice on bad machine work

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by buick bill, Nov 15, 2021.

  1. alanp561
    Joined: Oct 1, 2017
    Posts: 4,610

    alanp561
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Diesel works just as well and doesn't burn as easy.
     
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  2. 48fordnut
    Joined: Nov 4, 2005
    Posts: 4,215

    48fordnut
    Member Emeritus

    I like the idea of taking the head to the shop, having a lot of expensive work done and not picking it up. 5B006E08-5961-4EA4-8F77-3AE8FB04CBA8.jpeg
     
  3. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 13,173

    Budget36
    Member

    That’s what the grind on the valve looked like to me.
     
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  4. buick bill
    Joined: Dec 18, 2008
    Posts: 856

    buick bill
    Member
    from yreka;ca

    the only problem with that plan is it doesnt get my $600.oo . but i guess im going to eat thar ! i like the plan where i just run the orig. head that had no defects and settle for 8.0 compression instead if 8.2 ., oh i guess hind sight is real good . as to the valve . it bent when it stuck open and contacted the piston .before that everything was working . i dont see how a bent velve could be ground . it would be obvious as it spun . the only thing that makes since is a alignment problem with the guide and/or the seat . either way i think i will be re-installing the orig. head today . i will dis assy. it and check the guides , maybe a light hand lap . and if all is good do a FINAL install .
     
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  5. 48fordnut
    Joined: Nov 4, 2005
    Posts: 4,215

    48fordnut
    Member Emeritus

    When the problem occurred is when the ketchup should have appeared. Your money is gone. 90% of shops won't claim their bad doing. Just have it as a learning lesson. Leave well enough alone.
     
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  6. 57JoeFoMoPar
    Joined: Sep 14, 2004
    Posts: 6,138

    57JoeFoMoPar
    Member

    Totally agree. Bunch of fucking scumbags.

    In all seriousness, this is not a situation where it would be worthwhile to bring suit in small claims court since you would need to present some sort of expert testimony as to why the work that they did was shoddy as opposed to you simply installing it wrong or some other reason. Remember, this is a civil action and the burden of proof is on you, not the defendant, to prove every element of your cause of action. Experts are expensive in any field, and it's a poor business model to spend thousands to get back $600. Cut your losses and move on.
     
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  7. you know, more and more it is hard to get good help anymore. I think some of the reason for this is that too many people just deal with it/ eat the loss and go on, paying someone else to do it over or just live with the flaws. If the customer would come back and complain, maybe, just maybe the vendor would think about it before doing shoddy work. I'm not saying go in there with guns a-blazin' but go let them know they screwed up and what it would take to make you happy. If they tell you to pound sand, so be it at least you let them know what they are. Otherwise they just keep getting away with it. They may even think they did a good job, and if the boss never knows he thinks his employees are performing quality work.
    Just my thoughts ....
     
  8. buick bill
    Joined: Dec 18, 2008
    Posts: 856

    buick bill
    Member
    from yreka;ca

    well brought it back . dyed the seat . perfect .ran a hone down the guide to remove the burr pulled the valve from the next cylinder . perfect seal . seats not to deep . we agreed that hard seats were not called for in this application. so no one can figure out what caused the problem . he is going to open up the guides to the next size .replace the valve and we will see . the ONLY idea i can come up with is a slightly off / bent valve .? it was new and not ground or anything so factory fkup ? talk about no luck . im still on the fence about re-installing the orig. head . ill make someone a good deal on a cmplt rbld 848 235 head !!!
     
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  9. KenC
    Joined: Sep 14, 2006
    Posts: 1,045

    KenC
    Member

    [QUOTE . the ONLY idea i can come up with is a slightly off / bent valve .? it was new and not ground or anything so factory fkup ? talk about no luck . im still on the fence about re-installing the orig. head . ill make someone a good deal on a cmplt rbld 848 235 head !!![/QUOTE]

    If it was a new valve it may well have been defective. I don't know of anyone that installs a new valve without chucking it up and assuring the grind is right. Since almost not commercial shop laps valves anymore, the refacing machine is a must to assure a true seat, even (especially?) on a new valve.
     
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  10. 2OLD2FAST
    Joined: Feb 3, 2010
    Posts: 5,216

    2OLD2FAST
    Member
    from illinois

    Do unto others.....
     
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  11. badshifter
    Joined: Apr 28, 2006
    Posts: 3,535

    badshifter
    Member

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  12. buick bill
    Joined: Dec 18, 2008
    Posts: 856

    buick bill
    Member
    from yreka;ca

    not the gas . its been started at least every wk . my experience with varnish is it works fine till it cools then on start up your stuck up . i have way more varnish experience than i ever wanted !! anyway if the valve was bad . which is the only explanation im left with . the shop seems like they would have caught it . they say they vacuum check all valves and some how it was good .anyway they are accepting responsibility for what thats worth . so im just out the trouble .and 3 sets of gasket and several 100 mi. loops . if there is no damage to the mtr /piston and related i guess its all good . or it is what it is ! i tore the orig. head appart . condition was as expected . intakes were fine . exhaust is in need of guides there was a quite a bit of damage on cylinder #6 .apears to have ate a valve in its past. but it had been repaired so was just old and ugly . it did have 3 intake seats replaced . which seemed strange to me. so my replacement of the head wasnt such a bad idea . if i ever get it right .
     
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  13. wicarnut
    Joined: Oct 29, 2009
    Posts: 9,052

    wicarnut
    Member

    Sorry to read about your learning experience, automotive machine shops are like every other service a person buys through ones lifetime, 10% great, 30% acceptable, 10% barely acceptable, last 50% unacceptable, shit work, just plain bad. I started building engines at 14, 1962 , I had machine shop in school so I learned how to measure with proper tools to check various dimensions, such as crank diameters after a regrind or polish, rod and mains ID with bearings torqued, bores, head work rebuilds, guides, seats, lap valves to check seat, assembled heads myself after checking everything, etc. I dealt with several shops in Milwaukee area through the years back in the day and could write a book on shit work received 1 time, never gave anyone a second chance till I found a competent shop, only a few IMO. Also I learned to discretely mark my parts as you might not even get your own parts back. As a young man I worked for SESCO racing engines, learned some skills there that served me well all my life. In my later years with my hobby cars I did not rebuild engines, just bought crate engines as through time the 2 shops I dealt with the owners retired and I have Been There, Done That. So........ My free advice, Caution ! Free advice is sometimes worth price paid. Talk to people to get a reference on any service hired, check with local BBB, never pinch the nickel hard, you tend to end up with a handful of buffalo shit, as a general rule of thumb, you tend to get what you paid for. Good Luck, maybe someone on here can point you in the right direction.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2021
  14. 6inarow
    Joined: Jan 24, 2007
    Posts: 2,361

    6inarow
    Member

    Well sometimes the ultra high compression 848 heads arent worth it. You were right on in post 64. these old 235s shouldnt be that complicated, but maybe they have no experience with them. Might be worth talking to a few inliners in the area for a good recommendation
     
  15. TrailerTrashToo
    Joined: Jun 20, 2018
    Posts: 1,289

    TrailerTrashToo
    Member

    Quote of the day!
     
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  16. Bob Lowry
    Joined: Jan 19, 2020
    Posts: 1,488

    Bob Lowry


    Hey Bill, when I did a 671 blower on my '46 Chevy, it was a bear to lift it off and on by myself. I made a "sling"
    that attached to the ends of the blower and used my cherry picker to easily pick it up. Maybe something similar
    would work for your head. I do feel your back pain....Bob

    sling 1.JPG sling 2.JPG
     
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  17. I vote for putting the original head back on.
     
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  18. Dan Timberlake
    Joined: Apr 28, 2010
    Posts: 1,530

    Dan Timberlake
    Member

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  19. 2OLD2FAST
    Joined: Feb 3, 2010
    Posts: 5,216

    2OLD2FAST
    Member
    from illinois

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  20. buick bill
    Joined: Dec 18, 2008
    Posts: 856

    buick bill
    Member
    from yreka;ca

    wonder no more .the spot , if you can make it out , on the left is where the stem seized in the guide ! DSCF5615.JPG
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2021
  21. buick bill
    Joined: Dec 18, 2008
    Posts: 856

    buick bill
    Member
    from yreka;ca

    does anyone think my attempt at resurfacing the rockers could have been a contributing factor ? DSCF5618.JPG DSCF5620.JPG DSCF5621.JPG
     
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  22. 55blacktie
    Joined: Aug 21, 2020
    Posts: 793

    55blacktie

    I wonder how many marriages the H.A.M.B. has saved by allowing us to vent our frustrations here, rather than beating our wives.
     
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  23. Bob Lowry
    Joined: Jan 19, 2020
    Posts: 1,488

    Bob Lowry

    All of them....
     
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  24. buick bill
    Joined: Dec 18, 2008
    Posts: 856

    buick bill
    Member
    from yreka;ca

    sometimes im trying to post and mine wont shut up !! but i have got good at blocking her out when need be !!
     
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  25. Here is the rub, there are sloppy machinists everywhere and there always have been.
    I have tried several solutions to your problem over the years, often they involved violence. I cannot recommend them to you. The feel good from the solution seldom outlives the repercussions.

    Someone recommended cutting your losses. I am not sure that this will make you feel good but I do think that it is good advice.

    Machine shops thrive on repeat business and word of mouth. They may not ever care if you do not return and may not know why their business is not as good as it could be if your friends never shadow their door but it may save someone you know some headaches. Not recommending them to others is a good way yo recoup what you have lost with them.
     
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  26. 2OLD2FAST
    Joined: Feb 3, 2010
    Posts: 5,216

    2OLD2FAST
    Member
    from illinois

    Sorry ,but that's retaliation , not only is it petty but unless you have no conscience , isn't very satisfying in the long term ! IMO
     
  27. egads
    Joined: Aug 23, 2011
    Posts: 1,419

    egads
    Member

    Sound's like the machine shop is trying to take care of it. Good on them. ( No one is always perfect!! )
     
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  28. buick bill
    Joined: Dec 18, 2008
    Posts: 856

    buick bill
    Member
    from yreka;ca

    yes they say that it will be right . this time . it wouldve been nice if it was right the first time . the second time......... oh well .but i sure hope the third time will be the charm . i guess im heading 150 mi each way to get the rockers resurfaced . i doubt that my attempt was or could have contributed . but all i can do is to rule anything i can out .i guess if my facing wasnt square it could load one side of the stem .dosnt seem to likely . but im wrong more than i care to recall
     
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  29. Flathead Dave
    Joined: Mar 21, 2014
    Posts: 3,959

    Flathead Dave
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from So. Cal.

    Had the exact same problem with a shop in Riverside. Took my 8BA heads in for a cleaning, decking and crack check.
    Went to pick them up and was told that everything was good to go. The crack was so visible that the martians could see it from Mars. When I mentioned the crack, I was told that it isn't a crack. HAHAHAHA...
    I had a cola in my hand and proceeded to poor some of it on the valve relief side and watched it sieve through the head and drip on to the counter top.
    I got my good head and didn't have to pay the bill.
    I will never go back to that place.
     
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  30. Truck64
    Joined: Oct 18, 2015
    Posts: 5,325

    Truck64
    Member
    from Ioway

    Yep, mistakes are gonna happen, it's how they are handled that matters.
     

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