Technical use a bead roller to put a flange on a panel?

I need to make some 16 gauge steel panels. I need to put a 90° flange on the bottom edges, around 1 inch in width.
Is a bead roller a viable way to do this?

 

I would use a brake.

 

Yep, you can use these. I believe they are called tipping dies

 

If you needed a bead at the bottom of the panel, a bead roller in conjunction with a handheld brake would be my choice. I have used two pieces of angle iron clamped to make longer 90 degree bends. HF sells a cheap 30" bench brake that works well for shorter panels.

 

I would use a break too - but obviously I don't have one of those otherwise I wouldn't be asking about using a $200 bead roller

 

Anything over 12 in long and 16 gauge is pretty difficult to bend cleanly in a cheap break or using angle iron

 

Has anyone here actually used tipping dies to make a flange?
That's essentially what I need to know - I'm going to base buying the bead roller off of the feedback I get here
Thanks!

 

i have put many flanges , straight and curved, with a bead roller using tipping dies. The problem that can occur is the rolling motion of the bead roller can ad a twist to the material based on size and arrangement of the panel. Now i mostly just use a pullmax to do flanges

 

You are not going to do much in 16 gauge on a $200.00 roller. What are you making that needs to be that thick?

 

In my limited experience with the tipping dies, I ran the piece through many times. Each time closing the gap on the dies. Sneaking up on the bend worked for me.
@SDS I have access to a large metal brake if you need to make bends. Let me know if you are in Boston area we can make it happen

 

Don’t know how much of a bend you need but if you run across it a couple times with the bead roller then you might thin the crease enough to bend it on a small brake. Why 16 gauge?

 

Yes you can add a flange with tipping dies it is what they are designed for. No you are never going to bend 16G with a $200 bead roller.

 

Except for the structure elements, my car is skinned in 20ga.

16ga is thick. What are you making?

 

The typical $200 Chinese bead roller is going to have to be extensively modified for stiffness before it'll even put a crease in 16 ga. They're rated for 18 ga, but IMO that's a serious stretch, and pretty much the upper limit for decent operation after being modified, and 16 ga is almost twice as stiff as 18 ga in bending.

If you can successfully roll a flange onto a straight edge of a 16 ga panel, the panel will be bowed and won't lay flat afterward. The only way to straighten it is by using a shrinker/stretcher.

To answer the original question, No, a $200 bead roller isn't suitable for flanging 16 ga steel. If you had other uses for the tool on 18ga and lighter, they're a very workable tool once modified for stiffness. I've got one in my home shop that I modified and I'd say it will do about 80% of anything that can be done on the $3000 Pexto bead roller in my shop where I make a living. But, for what you're wanting to do, spending 50 bucks at a HVAC shop or general sheet metal shop to get the flanges bent would be a better use of your money.

 

I've brought pieces to my local ductwork shop and they've put 90s on things for me. If you bring them some donuts they'll definitely be more fond of taking in weird 5 minute work.

 

Rear firewall

 

Thanks, that's sound advice

 

A rear firewall between the passenger compartment and the trunk. Maybe 16 gauge is overkill?

 

Doesn't sound structural. I'd go with a thinner gauge metal and you should be able to achieve what you're after. Many good tips here otherwise.

 

I would say no, not 16 gauge.

18, maybe, and 19 or 20, yes.

I did relatively short pieces of 19 or 20 for the quarter panel door opening with a Chinese tipping die and modified HF bead roller for my 36 coupe. Turned out ok, considering I’m no tinmaster. The bend isn’t real crisp, but that may be a skill thing, not a tool issue.

 

Score the back side with a cut off wheel and you can bend it in your vice for free.

 

Sorry, should have read all the way to the bottom before answering

 

Mine is 18ga. It noticeably stiffened up the body.

 

Sounds like you will be putting straight and curved flanges in this panel. Is that a correct assumption? You could always use a plywood buck and a hammer to tip your flanges in. Just keep working your way around the panel. Sharpen up the edge with a dolly if needed. Then stick your $200 towards a stretcher shrinker to get the curved flanges to behave.

 

I'd say if you NEED a 16ga panel flanged with a $200 budget, paying someone who already has the setup to do it for you is the way to go. That or get a bunch of angle iron and tack it to the panel. You could also cut out your 16ga to shape and bolt some perforated angle to it if you don't want to strip the zinc off to weld it.



Scoring, bucking, and beating the panel is a great option for a panel that needs curved flanges in particular but smacking 16ga is going to get tiring.

For a trunk firewall I think 18ga is plenty. What are the measurements and are there curved parts that need to be flanged? If you don't mind making it in a few sections, a cheap brake will do the job with enough clamps. Here is what looks like the old HF 30" which I have used extensively in my shop to bend 18 and 20ga. These are a good tool to have in the shop for the money I've found. HF no longer sells them BTW.
Ironton Portable Sheet Metal Bending Brake — 30in. Wide

If you want a good cheap bead roller that probably doesn't need much modification to do its job well and you want to be able to use it solo with ease, you cannot beat the Eastwood Pro 8" for the money IMO. I have one and I absolutely LOVE IT. Even before I put the motor kit on it, i was actually able to make good rolls solo in my shop with the included 4 post crank. It's only 8" so it does not tend to suffer the deflection issues that the longer flat plate chassis style rollers are infamous for.
Eastwood Elite 8" Heavy Duty Bead Roller
With the Poly lower die or an old skateboard wheel cut to fit, the included Offset top die will tip.
These will also take the old HF dies too, FYI.

You could set yourself up with this rig for less than $200 (right now the on-sale price with extra $25 off sale and code: 1EC7251 you can have it all in for $120!) and massively upgrade your capabilities to form 18 & 20ga. You could possibly do 16ga in more passes and lower pressure but I haven't tried it.

This is my rig. You could get the same setup from Eastwood for like $500 right now ($#440 with that sale and code I mentioned) with sales and coupon codes if you want to be a low buck rock star. Cattle Dog not included:

 

Since you are wanting a rear panel between the trunk and interior, I assume you will need a curved bend. The inexpensive bead rollers do not come with "tipping" dies. You will need to purchase it separately for about $50(+) and make sure it fits your bead roller. Some have different size shaft holes.

You will find that as you roll the metal it will have excess metal that needs to be shrunk as you move forward. If you don't shrink it as you gradually increase the bend, you will have warping occur. When experimental airplane builders make ribs, they are confronted with the same problem. They make a rib shaped form from wood and then gradually work the metal over the side with a hammer. At first the bent edge is uneven because of the extra metal. Instead of shrinking (which you could do if you buy a shrinker), they introduce "flutes" into the edge which only go part of the way across the edge. That leaves a continuous surface at the bent edge.
In the video they show the flutes being induced manually. You can buy a tool (or modify a pair of pliers) called "fluting pliers" which allow you to easily put flutes in an edge. Then you hammer it one more time.



https://www.wicksaircraft.com/shop/...WrcbFUiRKoHLRdLbtucBYCWTa33XKOAQaAgqIEALw_wcB

Here are some I made by drilling some LARGE cheap HF pliers and then welding a rod in one side and grinding them to shape.


Get a bead roller and put some beads in a thinner gage steel after you make the edge and the panel will be stiffer and straighter when done.

 

I like your thinking...this rear firewall will need to have to have a curve at the top, but not necessarily at the bottom (the bottom, with the flange would be better with a curve to it - to match the curvature of the body at the top). You're suggesting I flange the bottom on a brake, add flutes with the pliers, and then hammer the flutes - the stretching of the plier flute will stretch the flange and the the hammering flat again will induce a curve in the larger rear firewall panel?

 

I believe on the fluting pliers you are not stretching anything. You are inducing a high and low spot for the extra material to go to so you can control it. Then the hammering shrinks it. Similar concept to shrinking on a stump. Assuming you want the panel to be straight when its done and of the curved flanges need to be shrunk in some way.

So you are looking at 2 separate but tied together operations. The first is forming the flange. You can use a bead roller, wooden buck, or a pullmax. Really they all get you to the same place more or less. Then you need to shrink the flange to straighten the panel. Stretcher / shrinker or a tuck / flute and hammer operation should take care of you depending on how tight you go.

Do you have pictures of the car you are working on?

 

Or leave the flutes there and rivet/bolt between them as on an aircraft.
If you are concerned about strength you could always add steps in the panel with said bead roller for additional stiffness. Pre-stretching right along the bead lines(with an English wheel or planishing hamme) will reduce the potato ship effect.

 

@SDS which one of your projects is the bulkhead going into?