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Hot Rods The "Whatever" project

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Dave G in Gansevoort, Sep 28, 2020.

  1. HaHa...I'm glad your BETTER HALF likes it . Can't wait to see the finished project it in real life!!
     
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  2. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Finally got some time back in the garage today. Marked the firewall for the bellhousing cutout, got the dummy block out, raised the front spring mount one set of holes, and did a little clean up. Tomorrow I'll drill some holes to bolt the body to the frame, cut the firewall out and get old mangy back in the frame to establish clearances.
     
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  3. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Got something done with the Whatever project again today. Now it seems like all the little things that need to get done take forever. Just getting the body located on the frame properly means measuring three times, maybe four, before drilling a couple of 1/4 inch holes. Eventually I'll drill for 3/8 flange nuts to weld in but for now the small holes give lots of wiggle room just in case.

    I also mocked up the seating position today. The bottom of the seat will end up 6 inches above the floor. It puts my shoulders just above the back of the body. It feels like I'll be sitting down inside the body not on top sticking out. It feels like I'll also be able to make pedals that I'll actually be able to operate.

    One more thing I have to figure out is getting into and out of the body. Maybe I'll have to make side nerf bars just to have something to step on. Getting my old fat @$$ over the side looks like a real chore. I will also be rethinking cutting the passenger door out and making it operational. Oh how I hate the thought of bodywork!

    And finally today I decided to mock up side panels for the engine compartment. Used some poster board. Man is that compartment SMALL! I'm thinking that the idea I had to hide the radiator being wider than the nose may actually be an option to get more room for the engine.

    I wish I had been told just how small a T body really is, but I'm much better now...
     
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  4. ssffnomad
    Joined: Jul 23, 2008
    Posts: 954

    ssffnomad
    Member

    Hey Neighbor. Been following and you are making great progress.
    BTW, got a new toy . We text this or next week. I pick you up for a ride . Stretch.
     
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  5. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Text tomorrow! Looking forward to seeing a new toy. You too of course...

    You know, guys our size need bigger cars. I keep doing small. First the Minis, now the T. Remind me I said this if I ever start another small vehicle project.
     
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  6. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Put old mangy back in the frame today.
    DSCN1239.JPG It's tight but doable for the most part. It needs to be right up to the firewall so I have to get the T5 in and make a crossmember to support it, doing away with the side mounts I was thinking of using previously. No big deal as I knew that I had to make crossmembers and triangulate the frame anyway. So Marty I plan on plaigerizingsome more of the parts that you've made in your projects. I think that I can even get my clown feet down there with 3 pedals. I'm thinking that I am not going to be able to use the Moon big foot pedal I've had for a couple of decades however.
    DSCN1241.JPG Right now it's a Flintstones car!

    DSCN1242.JPG From the front, it appears that the engine will be inside of where the side panels will end up. Headers are looking like sprint car style. And long tail pipes level with the bottom rails and right next to them. As I'm playing 3D Tetris building this thing, I keep thinking ahead to try not to backtrack too many times. I'm thinking that 3 inch diameter tail pipes with the mufflers built in terminating behind the quick change will look 60s dirt car.

    Well enough for today. I'm feeling it too. I'm thinking that tomorrow's going to be an off day. Just a little tinkering...
     
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  7. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    So I have been cogitating and ruminating over the radiator. Yes there is just enough room to get a radiator between the front crossmember and the engine. I'm thinking that I will use a pusher fan on the front side of the nose support and seal or duct everything thru the radiator that comes in the nose.

    However it occurred to me that maybe I should rethink the radiator. If I were to have a radiator made that actually fits inside the nose, could it be made big enough to cool the engine? It could be angled from down in front of the axle to the nose support hoop. I'm already planning on having the filler point be up above the thermostat. And I can still duct all airflow thru and use an engine driven fan.

    So thoughts, comments, previous experience with something like that? Pictures???

    Thanks for the inputs...
     
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  8. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 8,796

    Marty Strode
    Member

    Having a full hood, regardless of how many louvers, tends to block the escaping air, compounding the problems from the small opening in the nose. Just things to think about. IMG_1895.JPG
     
  9. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Thanks for the inputs Marty. Yes I think I posted a picture of the 54 coupe from 74. Our radiators were not as good as available today, and on opening night with a brand new car, it was running hot. So off came the side panels, which went past the firewall. You can see Jim's feet in the picture.

    I'm thinking that I'll need to make vent area at least half again as large as whatever inlet area is including the nose and potentially some kind of scoop or ??? made into the belly pan. If I can't get enough airflow, well then the side panels will end up on the scrap bin.

    And I like those hood latches. I'm going to contact a colleague at the lab and see if I can scavenge some from some of the old equipment headed to get recycled. A lot of stuff used that style of latch. A lot of equipment has to be weather proof, but easily accessible.

    BTW Marty, where do you get your radiators? Ron Davis has been suggested as a possible source, and there is a local shop that I think caters to the dirt track guys. It will work out somehow...
     
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  10. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 8,796

    Marty Strode
    Member

    Dave, I have never used an aluminum radiator, but the way things are going, it might be our only option in the future. I do plan on using an aluminum radiator in the this project down the road, as it will be powered by 215 Buick, and it will be lightweight ! Simca3.jpg
     
  11. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    That is going to be an unique vehicle to say the least. Looking forward to seeing what you do to it. Maybe I should rethink the Mini that's in the shed and do something along those lines. I could see a 215 in a Mini, however for my money it's got to be an Olds version.
     
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  12. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 8,796

    Marty Strode
    Member

    I have most of an Olds as well.
     
  13. enjenjo
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 2,689

    enjenjo
    Member
    from swanton oh

    The shortest T5 will be from an early 2000s V6 Mustang. It's a WC T5 and most of the various gear sets will fit. The entire tail housing is about 7" long.
     
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  14. This is done in the UK using a FWD gearbox from a British Leyland Sherpa van
     
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  15. 64 DODGE 440
    Joined: Sep 2, 2006
    Posts: 4,421

    64 DODGE 440
    Member
    from so cal

    I'd like to see pictures of that installation. Imagine it's rather a snug fit.
     
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  16. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Really only need the heads. But that's for another day. I'm not capable of multiple projects these days. I gave it up when I retired.
     
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  17. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Any idea what the ratios are? I haven't seen the S10 T5 yet, still in my brother in law's garage. So I don't know if it's the one with granny first... maybe next week.
     
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  18. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Me too. Okay so it's OT, call it a 64 mini... or even a 59, after all most people can't tell the difference between a 59 and a 99 Mini. And let's not even mention that new thing. It's not a Mini
     
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  19. ratrodrodder
    Joined: Feb 19, 2008
    Posts: 380

    ratrodrodder
    Member
    from Boston

    At first blush, I like the idea of angling the radiator back and putting a scoop of some kind on the bottom of the belly pan. Maybe a NACA duct or two? That's not fully fitting with your dirt-track genesis, but... Something that will promote airflow but won't encourage water to go in the same direction (although I don't imagine you driving through too many big puddles or rain, it's hard to control the weather....).

    Hood top but no sides? Or maybe only partial sides?

    Re: the Mini, there's an interesting article in the current Vintage Motorsports mag of a gentleman in South Carolina that shoehorned an O/T Honda S2000 engine and 6-speed into an O/T MGB GT. So it only takes gumption, drive, and a stubborn-headedness that many of us possess (and maybe a welder and some other tools) to make it happen. But that project's for another website - let's stay focused here!
     
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  20. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Spent some quality time in the garage today trying to figure out pedals. First was a really spendy Wilwood floor mount setup actually intended for the Mini in the shed. It's floor is relatively flat and the seating position is in the back seat area. So it fits just fine.

    Well having them on the bench I figured why not try them out in the Whatever. Well even if I bought a new one for the Whatever project with Wilwoods compact master cylinders it's not going to fit. So what next?

    So then thoughts went to Mini pedals. I have 2 sets so lets see what can be done with them. In a Mini they are hanging pedals, with the master cylinders in the engine compartment mounted vertically. Turn them upside down however and they may just work, well with some adjusticating. That's an engineering term. Sort of...

    Now the British engineers, being British, like to walk to the beat of a different drum. To whit, the pedal pivot shaft is 9/16 inch diameter, and the od of the bushings is 0.685 inch, or 11/16 inch. No big problem, but just the same I'd have preferred 12/16 better known as 3/4 inch. I guess if the shape of the pedals works out, I'll drill the pedals for 3/4 od x 1/2 id bushings. The positive side of using these pedals is that they have really small pads, the better to fit fat feet finally firmly into the space available.

    No pictures today because none of this is picture worthy...
     
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  21. drtrcrV-8
    Joined: Jan 6, 2013
    Posts: 1,707

    drtrcrV-8
    Member

    Dave G : Want to thank you for sharing your "build story" with us!! It helps when we see that we are not alone in finding that our concepts don't necessarily work out like we thought they would, but (more importantly!!) how you solved those problems! Again : THANK YOU!!!
     
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  22. Dave G . you got me hooked on your project, I'm going on 81 in Nov. and trying to get my old Reading Fairgrounds modified ready for shows and some hot laps . This modified was Gerry Chamberlains Reading ride and later Will Cagles ride mostly in N.Y. Dave Pelzar won the Fonda 200 with it later on . It's got a 440 BBC , Crower cammed with 13.5 to 1 pistons I'm told it was 700 hp . 3 speed trans . and Franklin QC with Buick drums . 219756390_10221482720670052_4092196895192096316_n.jpg
     
  23. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 19,132

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    Dave
    Have you seen the setup Marty uses on his T's, it's pretty slick, ask him to post the chassis shots without the body mounted.
     
  24. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Didn't he show them in the #10 track roadster thread? I'm going to have to go thru his build and look for the pictures. But of course Marty if you want to post them here I'll never complain...
     
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  25. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 19,132

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    I'm sure that's where I saw them but I can always look at them again!
     
  26. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Thanks for all the kind words. I'm so humbled by the talent I see in every build on the site. I'll keep posting my efforts if for no other reason than to get the encouragement from all of you with your comments and recommendations. These have really helped me a lot to keep moving forward.

    And Hank I remember that car. I always liked the flip up tail. Made getting to the fuel cell and qc much easier I bet! I still have the plans for the frame for my first modified. I've often considered recreating it, but some parts would be so difficult to find, that it stays just a dream.
     
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  27. Marty Strode
    Joined: Apr 28, 2011
    Posts: 8,796

    Marty Strode
    Member

    Dave, this is what I use in the track roadsters, using 35-38 Ford complete pedal assy. They always need to be re-bushed, shortened and a little bending required. The part I like is mounting the master cyl back a couple feet, with a rocker arm between. Also, you can change the pedal ratio, by changing the blades on the rocker arm. IMG_0667.JPG IMG_0685.JPG
     
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  28. ratrodrodder
    Joined: Feb 19, 2008
    Posts: 380

    ratrodrodder
    Member
    from Boston

    Marty, that is slick! You gotta be careful, you keep giving Dave ideas and he'll never get this thing finished! ;)
     
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  29. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 2,598

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Nice! Thanks Marty. Interestingly the Mini pedals I have are shaped similarly to those, and when turned upside down will be very similar in shape. And like I said the pedal pads are small, about 1.5 inch square. Should help on room.
     
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  30. Shoe size will help too. LOL
     
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