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Technical Cutting coils...

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by rustydusty, Jul 23, 2021.

  1. I keep thinking about cutting the coils on the front end of my T Bird. The rear springs are sagging a bit, and rather than bring that end up, I'd like to bring the front end down. (Lower is better!) One coil should do it. Am I opening a huge can of worms with alignment issues? I'd like to do this at my buddy's house, then turn around and drive it back. This would be 4 hours each way. He is not set up to do an alignment... 20210527_104414.jpg
     
  2. pitman
    Joined: May 14, 2006
    Posts: 5,148

    pitman

    The front susp. should maintain alignment, (tho you want to check toe).
    Just don't cut so much she bottoms out.
     
    Last edited: Jul 23, 2021
    bobss396 and fauj like this.
  3. I am hoping one coil will not be too much, so rather than cut a half a coil and have to take it all apart again, I am hoping for "one and done". If I remember correctly, one coil cut = about a two inch drop, which should be just about right... I won't have a lot of time to do this.
     
  4. 55blacktie
    Joined: Aug 21, 2020
    Posts: 793

    55blacktie

    Don't use a torch! Use a cut-off wheel. If your rear springs are sagging, it's time to get new springs.
     

  5. jaracer
    Joined: Oct 4, 2008
    Posts: 2,419

    jaracer
    Member

    One full coil sounds like a lot to me. At any rate, after you cut it you should at least use a tape measure or a set of strings to check the toe. It is the setting that causes the most tire wear. A 4 hour drive with the toe way off would cost you a set of tires.
     
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  6. There’s a reason the second step in an alignment is checking ride height….step one is tire pressures.

    Altering ride height will affect alignment.
     
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  7. alchemy
    Joined: Sep 27, 2002
    Posts: 20,405

    alchemy
    Member

    After you put the spring back in the pocket, it will take 100 miles before it settles into it's final ride height. So, if you try one side and reassemble, don't think it will be the final height.

    Unless someone can give you an example of the coils they cut on your EXACT kind of car, using a generality of "two inch drop" for one coil is a crapshoot. Every coil spring is different.

    I recommend cutting a half coil. Make sure to properly align the end of the cut into the bottom pocket if there is a divot for it to fit into. If need be you can always cut another later. But it's really hard to glue some back on if you cut too much.
     
  8. X-cpe
    Joined: Mar 9, 2018
    Posts: 1,958

    X-cpe

    Since the spring sits about half way out on the control arm, the total amount of drop is roughly twice what you cut off the spring. Your results may vary.
     
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  9. I am probably going to cut with a Sawzall, as that will be cooler than a cutting wheel. If I replace the rear springs, I would have to add lowering blocks...
     
  10. I don't know what kind of sawzall blades you have, but mine won't make it through spring steel. Cut off wheel is the way to go...1/2 a coil at a time, trial and error.
     
  11. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,934

    squirrel
    Member

    you won't cut it with a sawzall, unless you use an abrasive blade...and then it'll take forever. Use a cuttoff wheel, it will only get the very end of the spring hot, and that won't matter.

    One coil will probably work ok. the first coil might not drop it as much as the second coil, though. Half a coil probably won't do anything noticeable. But this all depends on the shape of the end of the spring, some are would different than others (pigtail, square, etc)

    Camber is more likely to change than any other thing on the alignment, and toe should not change enough that you could measure the difference. If it does, then the car has a lot of built in bump steer, which is not likely.
     
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  12. Caster will change somewhat as well, although since he is more or less compensating for the sag in the rear it’ll likely be back to close to “correct”
     
  13. BamaMav
    Joined: Jun 19, 2011
    Posts: 6,709

    BamaMav
    Member
    from Berry, AL

    I’d go half a coil to start. I cut the coils on a 70’s F100 a full coil, and it bottomed out. Coil wouldn’t even stay in the pocket after taking one round off. But I didn’t have the engine in either, so it might have stayed if I had. But it was still too low, riding on the bump stops. Yours might work out different....
     
  14. Couple of things here. First cutting/shortening of spring stiffens rate of spring making it stiffer. Second you can cut with gas torch as where you cut the heat will be in what will be part of a “dead” coil so won’t make a lick of a difference to spring at all. DO NOT JUST HEAT WITH GAS TORCH AND LET SAG. Bad news but hey it’s yours do what the ¥ you want.
     
  15. oldiron 440
    Joined: Dec 12, 2018
    Posts: 3,299

    oldiron 440
    Member

    You might be making spark's all the way home....lol
     
  16. TA DAD
    Joined: Mar 2, 2014
    Posts: 1,107

    TA DAD
    Member
    from NC

    I have done some decades ago using a torch and heating the spring and having jack stands set where I wanted the final hieght. Heat the spring until the car/truck sits on the stands and let them cool. It is like in the book We were the Ramchargers " when your young you think you are fixing your car up but really you were hacking it up "
     
  17. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 13,173

    Budget36
    Member

    I guess I’ll ask, what’s the obstacle of doing it at home? This way you could take out 1/2 a coil, run it around and see if more was needed. Would be a bummer to have issues on a long drive home.
    Oh, my first attempt at cutting coils was with a hacksaw. Didn’t go well, in fact it didn’t go at all. Lol.
     
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  18. My buddy has a lift. That's why I'm not doing it at home. The wheels are original to the car as is the tire size. Some chrome 15" wheels are something for the future, but not in the budget right now...
     
    Lloyd's paint & glass likes this.
  19. 55blacktie
    Joined: Aug 21, 2020
    Posts: 793

    55blacktie

    If you do your research, you will find a lot of bad results, including photos, from heating coil springs to lower your ride height. I wouldn't consider it. I also don't see how having the front end higher will improve handling, other than by making the steering lighter. It does, however, help with weight transfer, if you plan to drag race, but I don't think you're looking to turn your bird into a gasser. Ever see an autocrosser, Nascar, etc with the nose up in the air?
     
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  20. lostone
    Joined: Oct 13, 2013
    Posts: 2,820

    lostone
    Member
    from kansas

    Ok my turn.

    First off many old cars during the 60's did indeed come straight from the factory with the nose a good inch higher than the rear.

    We have many old frame books from the 50's up and thru the yrs of using them you start noticing this. GM did alot of them that way.

    I always figured it was for 1 of 2 reasons, 1- factory figured they'd settle more or 2- to give them that running fast look even setting still (think gassers and fast street cars back then). I always figured the 2nd.

    But if it were me, instead of cutting the front I'd throw some cheaper rubber spacers in the rear and raise it. Drive it for awhile, figure out what if any rake I liked the car setting at and then get or cut springs to match....
     
  21. No plans to heat the coils... just want a little rake!
     
  22. Malibu406
    Joined: Nov 10, 2020
    Posts: 230

    Malibu406
    Member

    I put mine in a bucket of water filled to an eigth inch below where I cut. Used a cut off wheel stopping and splashing water on it
     
  23. Don't make the mistake of measuring your drop on an expanded spring! I have seen this done and the result was not pretty! Ancient Chinese proverb- "Cut a little and let it settle, because un-cutting very very difficult"
     
  24. How much did you cut off?
     
  25. oldiron 440
    Joined: Dec 12, 2018
    Posts: 3,299

    oldiron 440
    Member

    The cutoff wheel works well on it's own, I've never had a problem with heat at the end of the spring.
     
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  26. You can always pull a coil out and take it to a parts yard and match it up to a similar spring that’s a hair shorter or not as heavy gauge as the stock ones. The rear coils on my 66 C10 are from a Jeep Wrangler and bolted in perfectly. Dropped the rear about 2” and really helped the ride.

    C74BC490-9B3A-4516-9F9E-50DFD58D8DC9.jpeg
     
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  27. Wire diameter & number of coils make up spring rate.oh and height.
     
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  28. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,934

    squirrel
    Member

    and the outside diameter of the spring is kind of important when you're looking for a replacement.
     
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  29. vtx1800
    Joined: Oct 4, 2009
    Posts: 1,709

    vtx1800
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I think you are getting pretty good advice, on my 53 Studebaker I swapped a later Hawk frame (for a beefier chassis, brakes etc), when I disassembled the front suspension I found one coil was broken, I ended up cutting both the equivalent of 1 1/2 coils. I am guessing that with the engine/transmission swap there aren't many pounds difference, for a wild guess I am pretty happy with the end result. Two inch blocks in the rear. IMG_3865.JPEG IMG_0598.JPG
     
  30. dana barlow
    Joined: May 30, 2006
    Posts: 5,115

    dana barlow
    Member
    from Miami Fla.
    1. Y-blocks

    Cutting coils makes the spring shorter,but also stiffer{ has higher spring rate} so ride is not as soft. That's often OK for us hot rod types. One thing not to do,is use any of these new low side wall tires,those are a danger from both bad ride an poor front end grip in turns.
     
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