Ok, well I have researched and researched and tried suggestion after suggestion but my 53 Chevy pickup still will not fire. This truck has always ran great, it has a 1954 235 in it, mostly original, still 6 volt and beginning last week I started having problems. Occasionally I’d turn the key and push the floor starter and nothing would happen...if I unhooked the battery and rehooked it up I usually could get it to fire and move along as normal. Well recently the battery was low and had very little cranking power so I hooked it up to a starter pack and got great starting power but no start & since that day it hasn’t started once(well it did once on the first start on a new coil but nothing since). Well fast forward a week or so and now I have installed or changed out: New 00 power and ground wires New coil New battery Removed points and condenser (which were fine) and bought/installed a pertronix setup. One strange event was I installed a new coil after chasing things around for a day or two and it fired right up and I thought I had solved the issue. Well next day went to start it and nope, felt like I am back at square one. I am not getting spark out of the coil as I have pulled the wire out and held it near a ground on the engine block many times and never get anything. I used my test light and have power to both sides of coil and everything seems good, but still no fire power to get it to turn run. A friend recommended running a wire from battery to coil to bypass ignition switch and still no fire when I did that. One thing I did notice was the horn relay clicking a lot recently and also my ammeter gauge has power (per the test light) to both poles but doesn’t seem to be moving. Any thoughts, ideas, what to do next? This truck ran great for the last 5 years as I drove it weekly with 0 problems and now I’m stumped!
When does the horn relay click? And I assume the horn is not connected, or it would be blasting when it clicks? When you had the points in it still, did you check to see if the side of the coil that was wired to the distributor, got Zero volts when the points were closed? Tell us about your "starter pack". Is it a 12v unit?
Starter pack was a 12 volt pack, yes. Buddy I was working alongside thought it’d be ok as long as light were all off. Horn is unhooked but relay clicks when I press horn and seems to occasionally click on it it’s own. When I press horn a few times the horn relay gets very hot
Strange and intermittent electrical problems can often be caused by a bad ground. You said you installed a new power and ground cable. Grounded at the frame or grounded at the block? And do you have a ground cable between the frame and the engine block? Bright and tight? Your issue might likely be something else, but checking grounds is a good place to start.
The horn problem is likely an intermittent short to ground, in the steering column or at the horn switch in the steering wheel. Disconnect the wire from there, to the horn relay, so it won't be using power when it shouldn't. It's hard to say what's going on with the starting issue. It sounds like you didn't do much troubleshooting, perhaps because you don't really know what to check for. I could help with the ignition diagnosis with point ignition, but I don't know enough about how the magical electronic stuff works, to be much help with that.
Is the truck still 6 volt with a generator. You might have fried the voltage regulator. Seen weird stuff happen from that. Also check your starter switch and ignition switch. That’s all the ideas I have. Try bypassing the horn relay like Squirrel said. Just make sure wires don’t get hot. Replacement smoke is expensive.
Has the distributor drive gear pin sheared off ?? Can be enough resistance to drive the shaft (to fool you) but also enough slip to play havoc..
I tried to do a little bit of trouble shooting via the opinions of some of the old time mechanics in my car club. They were convinced first it was battery cables (changed those out) and then thought it was likely points/condenser so that's why I just swapped it out for a Pertronix hoping it would solve the issue. No luck there either. I threw a NOS voltage regulator in it thinking maybe I had fried something there, and still no better result. The strange thing was when I put the new coil on for the first time a couple days ago it fired right up and ran great so I thought I was good!....Until I tried to start it the next day. I guess I should have done a little more trouble shooting before I started swapping things out! Lesson learned here and I just want my old truck to run like it used to...I would brag how reliable it was!
Yep, its still 6 volt with gen. That was one of my first thoughts so I swapped it out with a NOS one I had in the attic. I think I may try a another voltage regulator and see if there's any better result.
Seems to me, the issue you had before putting in the pet tonic (speed check, to heck with it) has followed you. Petronius (again, fuck it) has a good help line. Give them a call for help. Other option is to go back like it was, and it simplifies the troubleshooting process for many here. Just my thoughts.
That should be a dead simple electrical system. Without seeing some of the "hardware" I can only guess at what may be the problem. One thing I can say is the pertronix is very voltage sensitive. Even slightly low on 6V can cause it not to fire. BUT so can the points. Have you checked the starter motor for current draw? Ben
I'm not totally anti-pertronic like some folks here, but for trouble shooting or test purposes it makes sense to keep it simple with points. Measuring the voltage drop during engine crank makes sense, like firstinsteele mentions. If voltage sags too low, if a defective starter is hogging all the current, the plugs will not fire. Check the spark quality from the coil wire to a head bolt. It should jump a 1/2" gap. I've heard some people mention the 6 volt Ignitor system has or had some reliability or intermittent problems compared to their 12 volt version. I wonder if there is actually any real difference in the "6 volt" module, and it's simply running on the ragged edge of minimum working voltage. Also measure the ohms resistance between battery negative post and the distributor breaker plate. This is important for either points or the solid state substitutes. Should be no more than 0.2 ohms, factor in (out) the meter lead resistance for this figure. Sometimes people remove the little uninsulated copper breaker plate grounding strap on some distributors, thinking it isn't needed anymore. It is.
I'm thinking about putting points and condenser back in and walking it back with hopefully better luck. Dagum it!
Do you have the shop manual? If not you need to get it. It's time to think and become one of those old time mechanics.... Who knows what's going on with the horn relay and or the main harness. At this point I would disconnect and isolate/by pass the whole harness. At the Starting Motor Switch....This is the main hot feed to the ignition switch and harness. Disconnect the wire to the harness there...tape it up. Get a new simple switch. It could be as simple as a toggle. Run a jumper wire through the temporary switch from where you disconnected the harness to the + side of the coil. Now you have completely isolated and bypassed the factory harness. You are now straight off battery hot through your temporary (switched) jumper wire to the + side of the coil. Of course the primary lead from the battery is still connected to the foot pedal start. Try to run the engine through this temporary wire....This isolates any trouble in the harness. As others have stated, I would go back to points. Confirm that you have hot to the coil when the switch is on. Now you know any trouble is from the coil to the plugs. Once you have the engine running, then you can D/C the temporary wire and see what happens when the main harness is connected.
I noticed the 12v jump and 6v ignition. I hope you didn't repeat the 12v jump after swapping the ignition to electronic. If not, start by being sure the coil is good and grounds are good. Like others, I'd recommend back to points for troubleshooting. With points one can open/close watch for spark all without actually trying to start. Makes it much easier to locate issues. Did the electronic come with instructions for testing after install?
I absolutely not install a Pertronix ignition in anything that I was having trouble with and having to trouble shoot. You put them in good running rigs because you want them to run better. Not only are they very voltage sensitive They require all matching components especially the coil. There are dozens of "My Pertronix has issues" threads on here and the answer is almost always that the op has a mismatched part in the system. 6 volt systems don't like skinny off the shelf battery cables, you have to use heavier gauge cables that have less resistance for the current flow. 12 Volts can push amps though a skinny cable a lot easier than 6 volts can. Grounds= clean frigging shiny bare metal under the spot where the ground cable makes contact with the block or frame. I've lost track of how many doesn't crank right rigs I have seen with several coats of paint under the end of the ground cable. The contacts inside the foot stomp pedal switch being crispy. It isn't hard to take the switch off the starter and clean up the contacts inside or turn them so they have new contact areas.
I'm thinking the stomp pedal too.... Off of that junction is the hot to the entire harness. He needs to clean all that stuff up. As far as voltage regulators, generators and horn relays....That's a different issue. That's why I recommended a jumper just to get the engine running off of battery. 6V.... Heavy Primary leads... Proper sized wire... Good connections Good Clean grounds
Take the main feed wire off the battery cable terminal on the starter. Run a jumper from the cable terminal to the + side of the coil. The entire electrical system is now deleted EXCEPT for ignition. Try. This is called "junkyard" start wiring. If it starts work backward to isolate. If it doesn't its in the ignition system.
Tried that with no luck. Still no spark. Also threw in a new starter I had to check off that as potential source of the problem. Damn...The saga continues!
To put some closure to this thread, I ended up going back and taking out the Pertronix setup and throwing new points and a new condenser in it and it fired right up. I left it alone and have been enjoying it since. My thoughts were the first time around it was the condenser that had failed, and the second time around I'm blaming it something with the Pertronix and possibly timing. All I know is I'm glad the old '53 is back alive!
I wonder if the booster pack fried the petronix stuff? When i was reading your original post, first thing i thought was the points are fried, then i realized you had switched it out. Only, and i mean the only, problem I've ever had with points is leaving the key on and welding them lol. That's why God made files well, that and to help my grandma escape from jail. Good woman, long story
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