Technical Help. Plymouth lugnuts

Hey guys I need some help. My brother has a 52 plymouth. Not sure if Cranbrook or Cambridge, both ugly cars by the way. . Anyway it has bolts instead of studs/ lugnuts and he bought some Supreme/ cragar style wheels that are slotted/universal. I know those use special lugnuts with oval washers but in his case what would he need to make them work? Thanks

 

Those cars had screw in studs in those years, you could go to parts store and replace with proper lugs from dorman section , might need a spot weld to keep them from moving

 

are you sure?

and beware they're left hand thread on the left side of the car (originally).

Pretty much a pain in the ass.

The 56 plymouth is the best, it has studs and nuts on the front, and bolts on the back, and left and right. 4 different fasteners required to put the wheels on the car.

 

That's insane...

 

Yea screw in studs for sure and left hand thread on left side.

 

Didn't want them twisting loose on the highway.

 

I've been around a few '50s Mopars and haven't seen a car with a lug nut / lug bolt combo. It was usually either one. I suspect that Plymouth had its front drums replaced at some point. Totally agree they are a pain in the ass. Plymouth used bolts on some cars through 1957 at least, other Mopar brands lost them earlier than that.

To the OP, swapping all four drums from lug bolts to lug nuts is probably going to be your best (or only) path to putting on shank-style lug nuts to mount those wheels. They never made shank-style bolts that I'm aware of.

I have no idea what is the best way to achieve that, but I bet these folks do: https://p15-d24.com/forum/4-p15-d24-forum/

 

well...I had two 56 plymouths, and they were both like that. One was a convertible that had sat out for a long time, and getting it onto the trailer was real real fun. The other was a really original parts car, the guy I got it from had another 56, so I doubt he swapped drums from another year car onto it.

 

I’ve seen the studs and lugs, but never a combination. Kinda makes ya think you could just tap the holes and do the same now, huh?

 

The first thing I did to my 56 Dodge pickup when I brought home: Drill out all the hubs to fit "normal"studs. Bought the replacements at a local trailer supply, measured the area that presses in to the hub and drilled 1/64 under the 'spline'OD. Easy. They can be installed in a press or use the lug nuts that match, well lubed with a hard washer between the hub and nut, to pull them in.

 

You are one unluck guy! AFAIK, Mopar never did that on purpose. I looked at my old Hollander, and can find no instances like that on Dodges or Plymouths. Just a change model to model and year to year from studs to bolts and back. But never different front/back. When I was working in Dad's salvage, they were always one or the other. Except, we ran into a few where someone had changed a complete rearend, usually to get a new ratio, and used a mismatched axle.

There have been many instances of broken bolts and studs on the left side of 40-50s Mopars for some reason. Clueless tire shops and strong impacts!

 

He's gonna be sad when I tell him he can't put them on yet.

 

I have seen a few sets 'back in the day' but it's been a long time. The last one I had was a VW that used shank-style bolts for it's aluminum wheels. I looked for some replacements as these were pretty beat, no luck...

You can buy these... screws | McMaster-Carr but whether they're suitable for lug bolts is unknown, I doubt it. And no left-hand threads...

 

Learning about the left hand lug nuts came when I was working in a station after school. Just could not break them loose. Dub an John Jernigan split their side laughing at me.

 

@slim38

I have changed several Plymouth hubs from lug bolts to lug studs. Not a big deal. I have posted about it before, but it’s been some time ago. Simply stated, you drill out the threads in the hub and press in lug studs.

I can probably provide you with the Dorman Products stud number that I used, but it will be tomorrow before I can check on that and post the #. The drill size used should provide about .012” interference fit between the serrated shank of the stud and the hub hole.. And, I definitely am a proponent of pressing in the studs, not drawing them in with the lug nut and most definitely NOT hammering them in.

Ray

 

^^^^What Ray says.......

 

Thanks guys. Sounds like maybe it's not too complicated.

 

Left hand nuts on the left side was a carryover from the horse drawn wagon days. They didn't have a good way to lock the axle nuts to keep them from unscrewing and the wheel would fall off. Thus, the nuts were threaded to tighten when going forward.

 

When I worked at the Dodge dealership we had a number of young guys come in to buy wheel studs because all the wheel nut on the left side were frozen to the studs. When they brought in broken studs I always pointed out the big L stamped into the end of the stud. Some wouldn't believe me.

 

One of the first things I do with all my the older Mopars is eliminate the left hand wheel studs and bolts and replace them with new right hand thread studs and then I install new lug nuts on all 4 wheels. If you bought an old Mopar from me, I guarantee it had right hand lug nuts on it. Gene

 

I found out about the left hand studs the hard way, Flat tire, left front. After 2 broken studs, I looked closer, and saw that they were left hand studs. Then I just removed them the way that I should have from the start.

 

I did work on a '59 Cadillac that had left hand lug nuts but since I was familiar with Mopars, had no problem figuring it out.

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Hi. check out both www.kanter.com and www.robertsmotorparts.co as both have the correct replacement parts. They specialize in old Mopar. Jimmie

 

@slim38
As a followup to my post #15 of yesterday, I went to my shop today and took these photos of a Plymouth drum that I converted to lug studs. The Dorman Products number is 183. It is a 1/2” x 20 thread..

I would have to do a little more digging to come up with the drill size I selected for this, but the Dorman catalog gives all dimensions of the studs they offer, including the major diameter of the serrations.

As I said in my earlier post, .012” interference fit is a good number to shoot for, though from .010” to .015” is an acceptable range. That is not only my experience, but I recently did see that range published for this purpose. Unfortunately, I cannot recall where, but remember it was ‘authoritative’.



Ray

 

Thanks @Hnstray for info. We'll for sure look into it.

 

Not

Not mine Jim and I've had a lot of them - most likely someone swapped them off an earlier car or the rear from a V/8 car.

 

Yep what suggested - just change to studs or get the hubs off a V/8 car. Have you been up to Trent's place in Sunset Tx off 287 just north of Decatur ?

 

Jaguar from 95-2003 used a threaded wheel stud the same thread as dodge products with bolts.

I did this on my 53 Chrysler.
The right side threads in and done, I plug welded them from the back.
The left side I cut threads to tighten the wheel studs in and then welded from the back .

super easy and bingo Bango done.

As far as your unilug cragars you’ll have to buy the correct shouldered lug nuts and washers .

 

Yep, that clearance equates very closely to the 1/64" I mentioned in my earlier post. Drills specified in fractions are much more common that decimal so that's what I used.

Hardest part, unless you have the correct puller, is getting the drum/hub off the back!

 

I did the same on my Fargo, drilled the holes out and pressed in studs from the back


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