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Projects Building My First Roadster in San Francisco

Discussion in 'Traditional Hot Rods' started by J.Ukrop, Sep 7, 2020.

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  1. J.Ukrop
    Joined: Nov 10, 2008
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    J.Ukrop
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    This project has changed the way I look at things, especially my writing. Last Friday, I shared the saga of a kid and his A-V8 for my weekly Jalopy Journal feature. As I'm sure you can guess, the photo of the flathead with the white firewall grabbed my attention. 147605694_10157611281626338_1671213359184094866_o.jpg
    As did this shot of the builder, Ed Leal, and his friend bombing around and raising hell in their hometown of Newark, California.
    11080391_10152672651106338_6170582195356403800_o.jpg
    If you have a few extra minutes, feel free to check out the article here.
     
  2. wuga
    Joined: Sep 21, 2008
    Posts: 563

    wuga
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    If you were racing, drag or circle or whatever in the 50s or early 60s, the pits in the evenings were dark and the white firewall reflected the light to work on the engine. The white firewall is a great tribute to those guys and their times.
    Warren
     
  3. J.Ukrop
    Joined: Nov 10, 2008
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    Warren, that is a great piece of trivia that I can't wait to pass on. Thank you!
     
  4. trevorsworth
    Joined: Aug 3, 2020
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    trevorsworth
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    Cool! That's one of those little things you had to be there to know.
     
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  5. RodStRace
    Joined: Dec 7, 2007
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    RodStRace
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    Also easier to spot leaks!
     
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  6. J.Ukrop
    Joined: Nov 10, 2008
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    Did I ever mention that I have the best friends? While I'm away, David sent me some photos of the roadster's windshield frame. He said that the metal was basically flaking away like tissue paper, but he was able to repair it with bronze and silver. In his text, he labeled it as "Agap," which is an acronym for As Good As Possible. Well, my mouth was agape because I think it perfectly fits the character of this car. Best of all, it's sturdy. I'm excited to get my glass template going and eventually have a windshield.

    IMG_3211.jpg

    IMG_3212.jpg
     
  7. J.Ukrop
    Joined: Nov 10, 2008
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    While we're talking windshields, I figured I would share a little more history on this particular frame and the posts. As I mentioned earlier, they were chopped and brazed back in the 1950s. This is the car pre-chop, channel and flathead. Looks familiar, doesn't it?
    131297899_1333779176980462_3299150536018581565_n.jpg
    Although no photos of it in the '50s or '60s survive, this is the configuration it is in today. 131347335_1284671088552590_5059642642226912449_n.jpg
    I'm really excited to be starting a new chapter for these old hot rod components.
     
  8. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
    Posts: 5,776

    Six Ball
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    from Nevada

    That is beautiful but I like where yours is better. The pursuit of perfection has hurt more hot rods than it has helped. None of my favorite hot rods are perfect. Perfection may even be a negative? o_O
     
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  9. missysdad1
    Joined: Dec 9, 2008
    Posts: 3,305

    missysdad1
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    I agree 100% that perfection can be and often is a negative. If you are a show car guy, knock yourself out, but if you like driving your car as opposed to sitting and looking at it perfection can really put the brakes on your enjoyment. If it's too nice there is a point at which one starts limiting the use of his car so that it won't get dirty, damaged or worn-looking. This point is hard to anticipate but you'll know you've reached it when you decide to take your late model instead of your hot rod. A quick analysis of your motivation will likely reveal that you've become afraid to hurt the hot rod by exposing it to everyday conditions. Time to re-evaluate how perfect you've built your hot rod and perhaps not make the same mistake again.
     
  10. 97
    Joined: May 18, 2005
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    97
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    Or perhaps close your eyes , harden up, and just use the damn thing, until you get to the point where driving the hotrod is more fun than what somebody else sees, .........you can't see it while you are driving .
    I live by the motto that what somebody else thinks or says about me is none of my business...it also applies to my vehicles....
     
  11. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
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    Six Ball
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    from Nevada

    Then on the other had sometimes I accidentally see my pickup as others do and I'm a bit embarrassed at things I have conditioned myself to ignore.
     
  12. J.Ukrop
    Joined: Nov 10, 2008
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    Carl, that car is amazing. Great shot of Bay Area life from back in the day. I wonder if it's still out there?
     
  13. J.Ukrop
    Joined: Nov 10, 2008
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    For the final leg of my Oregon trip, I headed down to McMinnville to meet with Noah Norwood. Noah's also in his 20s and, along with being a talented metalworker, he runs Hot Rod Kid Designs out of his family's backyard shop. A few weeks ago, he asked if I would like to be a guest on his new podcast. With a slight shuffle of scheduling, we were able to make it happen. I met Noah at the 2020 Harvest Field Drags, where he and his dad were racing their newly acquired Model A roadster. TRK Launch.jpg
    It's in the middle of a rebuild, some of which is top-secret. Here's how it currently sits. IMG_3410.jpg
    Noah is making me a pair of patch panels for my chewed up rear wheelwells, much like the set on his dad's car. IMG_3406.jpg
    This T is his longtime project. It sits on a Model A frame and runs a hopped up flathead. The nose is actually two '32 Ford grille shell tops stitched together. I'll have more on this badass little truck at a later date.
    IMG_3414-1.jpg
    As they say here on the H.A.M.B., "Pics or it didn't happen." This may or may not be me in the studio talking about small garages, four-bangers or being extremely nervous about submitting my first story on The Jalopy Journal. I'll post the link to the podcast episode when it's finished!
     
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  14. If it isn't you, someone sure looks alot like you... :rolleyes:
     
  15. 51504bat
    Joined: May 22, 2010
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    Some good photo shop guys here on the HAMB.:cool:
     
  16. 97
    Joined: May 18, 2005
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    If those HAMB photoshoppers had been at it he would have been chopped and possibly channelled!
     
  17. Six Ball
    Joined: Oct 8, 2007
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    Six Ball
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    from Nevada

    A star is born. Once your voice can be heard beyond its natural range there can be abuse. o_O
     
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  18. J.Ukrop
    Joined: Nov 10, 2008
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    I do have a brother!

    That's a fact!

    Maybe they could help me fit in the roadster better!

    Haha I can take it—I think?!
     
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  19. J.Ukrop
    Joined: Nov 10, 2008
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    Do you ever come back to the garage and say, "Wow, I have a lot of work to do?" For whatever reason, I was feeling a little overwhelmed by just about everything yesterday. Nonetheless, I opened the garage door, rolled out the car and got to work. Seeing it sitting there in the driveway made me feel good. It's come a long way in the past seven months. I'm excited to have it back on the street again!

    Last night, I was able to chip away at some small tasks. First, I finished painting the firewall (some touchup may be required later, but that's no problem). Then, I gave the coil bracket a little bit of love. This piece came with the car and the square edges always bugged me. Now it's a little more custom. IMG_3431.jpg
    Next, I got the studs in and started playing with the throttle configuration. I will be creating a fixture to ensure it ends up in the correct place when I weld it on there. More on that later.
    IMG_3432.jpg
    Using the nearest piece of cardboard, I mocked up the throttle pivot piece. I'm thinking that the final one will be a little bit longer on the top, but this is a start. Anyone know what that square headed bolt was originally for? I got it with a bunch of hardware from the 1950s; it was only used for mockup. IMG_3435.jpg
     
  20. 97
    Joined: May 18, 2005
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  21. J.Ukrop
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  22. J.Ukrop
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    Sometimes it's easy to forget that, first and foremost, this car is a learning experience. Today's project taught me that I still have a lot to learn. My plan was a simple one: weld the threaded bung on the intake to mount my bell crank.

    To kick things off, I made a fixture to get everything in place.
    IMG_3503.jpg
    Like this. IMG_3504.jpg
    I have no idea how I came up with this approach, but it did a nice job getting the bung in position.
    IMG_3505.jpg
     
  23. J.Ukrop
    Joined: Nov 10, 2008
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    Next, I drove down to Mazi Moto and asked Yama if it would be better to MIG or TIG it. He said TIG would probably be best, and he gave me brief but informative TIG lesson. It wasn't long before I was creating beads, melting metal and, of course, botching a handful of welds. Being the great friend that he is, Yama was patient and gave me lots of great advice.

    When it was time to weld the intake, I took extra care to get the cast-iron manifold to temperature. After tacking the bung in place, I welded around the perimeter, making sure everything was strong. I felt great!

    Then, as I was finishing up, I heard a crack. "That's weird," I said to myself. "Did that just crack?" Lo and behold, the intake had cracked—in multiple places. My heart sank. Yama, Mike and I inspected the damage. I tried to fix it with more welding, but that didn't work.

    I ground down the weld to see how deep the crack was. Strangely enough, it disappeared. That being said, I wasn't convinced. I shot some WD-40 down the intake. It seeped out around almost the whole welded area. We tried the same process in reverse, viewing the results with Mike's endoscopic camera. There's no denying that it leaks a lot.

    What a bust. Yama suggested that I should text David di Falco and ask if he had any tips. David said welding steel to cast iron is very difficult because they shrink at different rates. He says he's seen lots of cracks just like the ones on mine, and he should be able to fix it with fillet brazing. I'm heading up north to his shop on Tuesday to pick up the windshield frame, so we will try it out then.
    IMG_3506.jpg
    Setting up.
    IMG_3510.jpg
    The cracked area that I tried to fix by welding it. As you can see, it only cracked further.
    IMG_3513.jpg
    My first day of TIG welding. Even though it was a total failure, I'm glad I tried. Everyone has to start somewhere. IMG_3514.jpg
    We're gonna cut it apart and try to save this cool old manifold!
     
  24. 97
    Joined: May 18, 2005
    Posts: 1,982

    97
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    Tell me Joey, how was the Stromberg adapter fixed to the manifold? It looks like brazing from here.....brazing works wery well on cast iron...I think you will be able to repair the cracks with brass, but it will take some effort a cleanup. It would probably be easier to make a new manifold from pieces of tube.
     
  25. Tim
    Joined: Mar 2, 2001
    Posts: 17,092

    Tim
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    from KCMO

    The joys of cast iron.

    worse case you’re further along the learning curve.

    best case you’ve got a really good plan for building an intake haha. Building one would have really saved me a lot of head aches building the header. All the trouble was clearing the existing intake lol
     
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  26. SilverJimmy
    Joined: Dec 2, 2008
    Posts: 524

    SilverJimmy
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  27. dumprat
    Joined: Dec 27, 2006
    Posts: 3,479

    dumprat
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    from b.c.

    Ok lads I have welded lots of cast and steel to cast iron.

    Tig is wrong!

    Stick welding with a high nickel rod. Grind it out with a carbide burr and weld it cold! No more than 3/8" at a time then peen the crap out of it till it cools. Cast iron doesn't shrink or expand, steel does. You need to neutralize the stress welding imparts. Thus the peening. .

    Arctic 139 works good.

    You can braise weld it, but that is just globbing brass on the surface. It works just isn't as strong, nickel silver is nice for this and stronger than brass.
     
  28. winduptoy
    Joined: Feb 19, 2013
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    Cast is funny stuff and is very variable in quality. Mold sand in a casting can be a problem. Also on automotive stuff, oil contamination can be a challenge. I have TIG repaired cast with copper as filler material. It can be done.
    The best way is to heat it in a furnace and oxy/acetylene weld with cast rod. Then gradually dial the heat in the furnace down to cool it over a 24 hour period of time.
    My favorite for an application like yours is to use 49% silver solder and braze it....after preheating the entire piece, then cover it up in a bag of vermiculite or wrap it with Kaowool ceramic insulation blanket to let it cool slowly over a period of time.
    There is no free education and learning by doing means you will retain the knowledge for a long time into the future!
    What happened is recoverable. Thank you for sharing.
     
  29. 1-SHOT
    Joined: Sep 23, 2014
    Posts: 2,693

    1-SHOT
    Member
    from Denton

    Try TIG welding with 309L it works great but it’s harder than hell. If you have to drill it you need a carbide bit and go slow or it will make it harder. Also if you need to tap it you can only go about 1/4 turn at a time and back up clean tap often. The high nickel content in 309L makes the weld flow good. Frank
     

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