Installed a set of wheel cylinders in a '40 Ford last week. Went to bleed them and found the bleeders' were metric. Installed a new starter today and found the long bolts had heads just abit bigger than a normal 1/2" bolt. The nus that were installed on the other end of the bolts had heads the were 13mm. I guess metric has come to the old car market. Anyone else finding the same thing ?
Yeah, I put a set of the Boling Bros. Lincoln brake kit on the front of my '40 last spring; everything went well until I pulled the bleed screws to install Speed Bleeders... you guessed it, metric heads. At least the threaded portion was still inch so the new bleeders still fit.
I think the USA is just about the last outpost for UNF or UNC threads. The rest of the world went to the ISO standardised metric thread forms something like 50 years or more ago. Metric treads have been creeping in to US production for some years now, so it was only a matter of time before these started to turn up in aftermarket parts for our old car hobby.. Here we need to go to a specialist supplier to get bolts nut and screws in imperial sizes. Just might need to add a few more spanner sizes to the tool box. Another excuse to buy tools.
Call me an old grouchy bastard that is set in his ways if you want but in my opinion metric SUCKS. If you don't want my opinion I don't really give a damn
Canada went metric in the '70s and the US decided against it, which I thought was the right decision. Anyway, for years, and even still now, to some extent, getting metric fasteners like nuts and bolts (especially replacements for special bolts) can be a challenge. Still no problem buying most of what I need in imperial sizes yet. We seem to be stuck between two worlds in the sizing of parts and fasteners. I've noticed over the last few years that metric sizes have been creeping in on parts for older cars. Brake bleeder screws is probably among the first ones I noticed. The nuts on starters and alternators for wire connections are almost always metric now. It's not uncommon to have to go back to the tool box for metric tools to finish a job that started out with nothing but standard sizes.
Like Canada, Australia went metric in the 70s with imperial units gradually withdrawn over time. It's not such a big deal or overly onerous to become accustomed to, the world isn't ending; the sun still rises in the east and sets in the west. I have and use both AF & metric sockets, wrenches etc.
I remember when we went metric and didn't like it. However I tend to think mainly in Imperial and can easily convert back and forth. Teaching math for 37 years I taught in metric but occasionally used some US published worksheets/materials and my students had no problems with them except for the occasional reminder of how many feet are in a yard, etc. But the metric is a way better system as its based on multiples and divisibles of ten. Also based on the size of the earth iirc. And we do still sell dimensional material like lumber and metal in Imperial units. And the US did not reject it completely. If in doubt stop by some if not all the scientific labs. But when it.comes to cars built in N. America I'm still a little surprised when I see metric fasteners...
I still try and use only imperial fasteners on my builds. Trouble is the quality of either metric or imperial is a worry nowadays. Still even have some whitworth spanners on board, especially for the odd pommy stuff.
The metre (Commonwealth spelling) or meter (American spelling) (from the French unit mètre, from the Greek noun μέτρον, "measure") is the base unit of length in the International System of Units (SI). The SI unit symbol is m. The metre is defined as the length of the path travelled by light in a vacuum in 1/299 792 458 of a second. The metre was originally defined in 1793 as one ten-millionth of the distance from the equator to the North Pole along a great circle, so the Earth's circumference is approximately 40000 km. In 1799, the metre was redefined in terms of a prototype metre bar (the actual bar used was changed in 1889). In 1960, the metre was redefined in terms of a certain number of wavelengths of a certain emission line of krypton-86. The current definition was adopted in 1983 and slightly modified for the sake of precision in 2019. Source: Wikipedia
Try working on older British cars, sometimes you get a mix of Whitworth, UNF and UNC. Metric is simple, you just move a 0 or a coma to convert. I met a lot of Americans who don't use measurements or weight on a daily basis, when you ask them questions in imperial they need a printed chart or Google... Now I like to use the kind of bolt thread the car came originally with.
Metric is by far a better system then imperial. here in Canada we have to have the most basterdized units of measure then anywhere else. we use both systems interchangeable gallons pints millilitres litres Fahrenheit Celsius etc. just the way we do things. Almost everything industrial and machine wise is still imperial due to the USA being the big player almost everything else other then construction materials is metric. I don’t care either way, both systems work and work well I don’t understand how Canada switched to the metric system in the 70’s and I still have a hard time finding metric hardware when I’m looking for it !!!
Converting to metric, inch by inch! Here in sweden we went metric in the 1880s if I remember correctly, there was a ten year change period. There are still things with sized based on inches, so it's hardly a quick process to eraze it completely.
My complaint with the metric system is that the system is based upon 10. When you want to divide something in half, it goes to 5. Do it again, and you end, up with a stupid 2.5. All because God decided to give us 10 fingers instead of 8 or 12. Sent from my SM-T350 using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
My understanding was in the 70's Canada and the US agreed to go metric. It rolled out but came to a hard stop in the US but Canada carried on. It was a painful time as building products were imperial & metric. My friend was building a house in inches and had a load of plywood dropped off. Could not figure out for a couple minutes why the plywood was off the joists at the ends to finally realize we had metric sheets. Now the building materials are imperial except concrete blocks where the masons fudge the joints to be in inches. The blueprints and everything sent for approval needs to be metric. The code books are metric but we continued working with old units in our engineering office but the process engineers was all metric. We flipped back and forth with ease. Autocad made it easy to do the drawing and switch units back and forth without effort depending on who the drawings went to. One of the big metric - imperial mix ups was the Gimli glider that was a 767 that ran out of fuel on its way to Winnipeg. The airplane was ordered to be filled with a quantity of fuel but the airplane was filled by the ground crew using the number but was done in litres & not gallons. There are 3.78 litres in a US gallon so the airplane was shy a lot of fuel with Winnipeg originally probably one of its non fueling stops. It was brilliant flying that glided the airplane about 200 miles and put it down on a former air force base saving a lot of lives. There definitely is a logic in the metric system where the units all make sense. I do all my calculations in the old units and convert so I am comfortable with the design. I convert metric to imperial just for a quantification that fits in my old brain. If all had stayed the course with a firm conversion all around then I would have adapted to not give it a second thought. Like Fortunateson I can comfortably flip back and forth. I can usually calculate in my head faster than with a calculator but sometimes can't remember where I left things. It is a royal pain when a bolt has got a good start then comes to stop so clearly one or the other is metric. I have to always look up the metric grades to compare against the imperial grades to see that it is in the strength range I need.
Back in the early 90's, I was repairing a foreign made machining center that got damaged in shipping. I got to a point where I realized that I needed metric pipe fittings. They simply did not exist here in the USA. I couldn't find any. I eventually got them shipped over from the manufacturer. At least my Rigid pipe wrenches fit.
I bought a set of unused stainless flathead center-dump headers from a guy real cheap. He said they "didn't fit". The headers were just fine (I was very impressed with their quality, as a matter of fact). The problem was that all of the fasteners supplied with the headers were metric.
I know if it’s anything other then “standard” metric sizes your SOL !! A lot of equipment from overseas comes with metric hydraulic fittings and there’s just a few places that stock it. fine thread or corse thread metric anything over 1.75 or under 1.25 is hard to find other then one place by my shop. I find brafasco Fastenal etc stock all and any imperial stuff, you walk in with metric and it’s like your asking them to make you a sandwich. maybe it’s a Toronto thing, Toronto is weird compared to everywhere else in the country.
[QUOTE="VANDENPLAS, post: maybe it’s a Toronto thing, Toronto is weird compared to everywhere else in the country.[/QUOTE] Yes,yes it is.
On the German and Japanese equipment from the 70s to 90s we work on, "Metric" pipe threads are often "G" BSPP ( British Standard Pipe Parallel, needing a sealing washer etc) or "R" BSPT ( British Standard Pipe Tapered ). They are a hilarious mix of inch pipe sizes, and a 55° thread angle and usually, but not always thread pitches just a little bit different than NP threads. G1, G 3/8 , R 1/8 etc. https://www.parker.com/Literature/LPCE/product-experience/_common/Fitting-Threads.pdf https://www.teesing.com/en/page/library/publications/basics-of-thread/g-r-rp-thread-bssp-bspt Real Metric hydraulic fittings are straight metric threads, with a face feature for sealing with a washer or o-ring or something. Metric tapered pipe threads exist, but from my experience pretty rare.
I blame England for the world-wide metric creep. It's simply because, during the height of the British Empire, they invaded and subjugated more countries, that didn't even have threads yet, than anyone else. But the British insisted on using funny money, a system so convoluted, most of their territories couldn't begin to figure out how to adopt it. I think the US and pretty much all of North and South America went with metric money from the get-go. (I'm not a numismatist so fact check me before you quote me.)
I see what you did there. And I approve. But I can't believe that I haven't already seen t-shirts and coffee mugs imprinted with that saying.
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