Found what I think is a Y block sitting in a scrap metal pile. Flatheads, I'm pretty well versed in (& there's also what looks like an 8BA on the property too). These, not so much. Is there an easy way to ID if it's a 239, 292, 312, etc. from the outside? Looks like it's pretty complete w/ exhaust manifolds, intake, carb, etc. Thinking of making him an offer (He ignored my offer on his '49-'52 Ford truck) if it might be one of the bigger ones. It was stored inside until a couple weeks ago. I never knew it was there, & I'm driving by there almost daily. Must have been in the barn for 40 years, or more. I don't think the guy has interest in this stuff, as it belonged to a family member who has passed. What's a reasonable offer, & what should I look for?
Yeah, google is my friend. I tell everybody to use it. I guess I was looking for shortcuts, as opposed to scraping grease to find casting numbers.
carb type, oil pan sump location (car or truck or tbird), special valve covers, large or small water pump (large is later), paint color, etc. If you post some pictures, we might find clues that we would not remember to tell you about ahead of time. But you might not be able to do that.
Here's a picture I lifted of a "312 out of a bird" for sale. It shows the shallow front/rear sump of the bird pan, the spacer between the water pump and the front cover, and the bird specific dampener/pulley. It has the bracket for the steady rest on the side, and the bird front mount. If it's got the bird parts, they're probably worth more than the whole engine unless it's got a good 312 crank. Trucks had rear sumps, but not the real shallow front on the pan. Pass cars were front sump. Most of the abandon y blocks I find up here are truck engines. The pan is similar, but more in front than the bird pan. The front motor mount is larger. They are almost always 2 barrels. Birds, and I think trucks, used a rear valley pan road draft, pass cars had the draft tube under the fuel pump. Heavy trucks used a larger (6 or 7 quart?) oil pan. Rams horns were trucks only, but many trucks had the front crossover for a single exhaust. That's the stand back and guess approach. You really need to see the casting numbers. A couple cautions, just in case your lucky. Rocker oiling problems were common. The poorly designed oil passages off the center cam bearing were not forgiving of dirty oil and clogged up. Lots of 312 blocks had cracks in the bearing caps because of a mistake in a torque spec. Cracking between the exhaust valves in the heads were common. I bought a worn but driving 312, and when I tore it down it had a cracked crank. Still ran fine and I don't know how long it would have lasted. So it's very much a buyer beware even if the casting numbers are right. If it turns and is a truck motor, it's a $100 tops up here unless there's specific parts you can use or move.
If it still has stock exhaust manifolds on it the early Ys had narrow like 1 1/4” exhaust manifolds (main body), 292s were slightly fatter and late 292 and 312s had a wider manifold, like 2-2 1/4 wide. Of course the manifolds are easily changed but that was one clue we looked at in the old days. Sent from my iPad using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
Thanks guys. Posting pics (@squirrel ) probably not gonna happen. He might not appreciate that. Just looking from my car, here's what I can see: Looks to be a 2 bbl carb, but didn't appear to be a 94 style. Maybe something newer. Exhaust manifolds sit above the ports. Didn't see any lettering on the valve covers, but did see they look like this pic. The old dude that owned this stuff, was a car guy when he was younger. Owned a gas station / repair shop. The truck I tried to buy was a Ford w/ wrecker boom that apparently had an Olds motor! I need to talk to the guy again before he scraps this stuff. Just didn't want to go mentally unarmed & buy a boat anchor. I don't need more projects, but maybe plans for the present projects would change with a 312...
there are ways but most easy ones will not be the right answer 239 aside most bolt on items are like small blocks a ton of interchange can happen.Miker gave some pointers but even the pan is not a sure fire way to ID as it and pickup can be changed.unless you have a plan for it dream about it being a 312 and let it go
[QUOTE=" I don't need more projects, but maybe plans for the present projects would change with a 312...[/QUOTE] So with the little info,it likely is 292,but 312 maybe not so much. Good to know is;, For a hot rod engine,I like 292's better then 312,here is my why; Both engines look the very same,and the extra size of 312 for other then bone stock is voided out by what the two engines RPM wise can live at ! The much bigger main bearings of the 312 crank make too much heat above 5000+ rpm,292 dose not do that tell 6500+= for racing the 292 last longer. A good trick I use though is to have a 312 crank mains turned down to 292/272 size an use 312 rod,making a 312 that can make more HP with the extra RPM. The blocks are the same anyway,only the main bore an cly bore are not the same,but the block casting is the same. Also as long as you test cly wall for good casting center an low rust, 272 an 292 can be bored to 312 piston size+ a little=nearly any Y-block can be a great hot rod engine. Really the extra size is not enough to help much any way,so lot of work n cost for little extra! 292's kick ass well in 1800 lbs- rods. I long ago ran out of 312 cranks,used them all up oval stock car racing Y-blocks in late 60s n 70s. Have always used a "Y" in my own hot rod, I first built 1959 an still drive !
Everyone seems hung up on 312's but as Dana Barlow said above a 292 is just as good a starting point. The last Y-block I had was a '56 292 block bored .125 which gave 312 cu. in. with a shorter stroke. Revved to 6,500 easily with the occasional wind up to 7K. With an overbore even a 272 can perform well...
I will ask this guy about his "scrap metal." I just didn't want to end up with something that is a boat anchor. I know, some would say it is, 'cause it ain't a SBC. I also have a built flathead, so I know boat anchors... I'm assuming a 239 isn't worth the effort to rebuild. Not when you can get something bigger, for equal money. I'm looking at the cool factor, as opposed to cost vs. HP. I know I could build a damn nice bowtie for the cost of a stock rebuild on one of these old engines, but that's not the point. Also, it doesn't have to be a 312. That would just be icing on the y block cake.
If you don't have a car to put it in, or plan to get a car to put it in, then it's a boat anchor. I should know, I have a few other engines that have been sitting in the shop for a long long time....they're just in the way.
Yeah, i get that. I also have a couple engines waiting around for me to put them into the planned cars. So, I also have a few cars, waiting for me to get to them as well. I do have a '41 Chev 2 door & no planned engine to go in it. A Y Block should fit. Or, I suppose I could have my '53 Merc motor rebuilt for it. Just getting burned out on the same SBC in everything.
@squirrel I took your advice. Didn't even knock on the door. I have too much crap & need to downsize. The scrap pile disappeared. I saw a pair of SBC heads on the top of the pile too. The Y block hung around for another day or two & was gone. They probably couldn't lift that when they grabbed the first load. There is an 8BA style flathead on some framework that looks to have powered something at one time. One of the outbuildings has a transmission bolted to the outside. I'm guessing as a gear reduction for whatever is (was) inside. And, a '49-'50 Ford truck with a wrecker boom & I was told has an early Olds motor. I don't need any of it.
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