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Technical 12v conversion

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by w2w, Apr 16, 2020.

  1. w2w
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 211

    w2w
    Member
    from East Coast

    How should I wire it with a resistor?


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  2. brading
    Joined: Sep 9, 2019
    Posts: 704

    brading
    Member

    If yours is a ordinary 12v coil you do not need a resistor in the circuit.
     
  3. My entire Ready Reference including the original wiring diagram for this was scanned and uploaded years ago to the Chevy Forum. It is available at no charge. Log on and go to the '49 - '54 Forum and they'll direct you. Your diagram is showing a negative ground which is correct.
     
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  4. w2w
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 211

    w2w
    Member
    from East Coast

    IMG_2501.JPG IMG_2502.JPG IMG_2503.JPG IMG_2505.JPG IMG_2506.JPG IMG_2507.JPG IMG_2500.JPG

    Green wire on coil is -
    Last 2 pics are:
    -Wire from alt connected to wire from regulator that was on firewall
    -wire going from white side of alt DA to ignition switch.


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  5. KenC
    Joined: Sep 14, 2006
    Posts: 1,045

    KenC
    Member

    I can't tell from your pics. But, if you have a 'normal' chevy solenoid there are 4 terminals. 2 large ones that are used for battery cable and starter internal coils. One of the two smaller ones is connected to the Start terminal of the ignition switch (maybe by way of a nuetral or clutch safety switch). The other goes to the coil + but is only hot when the start is engaged and is used to bypass the ignition resister used with coils usually used in this app. The coil should also have another wire on the + terminal connected to the resister and Ignition terminal of the switch.

    So the answer to your question is: it depends on which solenoid terminal you used for that connection.

    The need for a resistor depends on the exact coil you bought. If it is marked 12v for use with a resistor, use one. If it marked 12 for use without a resistor, it isn't mandatory. But the reason for that setup from the factory when 12v was introduced is to provide better starting voltage. Choice is yours.
     
  6. I just realized this is the '49 diagram. I'll be back...... 52rrts064.jpg
     
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  7. This says '50 so hope it helps...

    52rrts065.jpg
     
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  8. Rotated that for you. Easier on the neck.:D;) 52rrts065.jpg
     
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  9. Thanks Don ! :):):)
     
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  10. w2w
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 211

    w2w
    Member
    from East Coast

    Thanks guys. Now I need to graduate as an electric engineer. Ha


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  11. w2w
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 211

    w2w
    Member
    from East Coast

    IMG_2508.JPG IMG_2509.JPG IMG_2510.JPG

    The diagram that came with the solenoid said not to use the post that isn’t used currently being used.
    The black wire goes to the + of the coil (that comes off the 3 wires that are taped going back to the firewall)


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  12. w2w
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 211

    w2w
    Member
    from East Coast

    Also I called Advance and they said the coil doesn’t specify needing a resistor. That is just says “direct OE replacement”


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  13. KenC
    Joined: Sep 14, 2006
    Posts: 1,045

    KenC
    Member

    Direct OE replacement for what? Was it purchased by application? If it's a chevy from the late 50s-60s it requires a resistor.
     
  14. w2w
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 211

    w2w
    Member
    from East Coast

    Drive works 26189 12v coil

    It shows a lot of cars and trucks, mid 90s up


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  15. w2w
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 211

    w2w
    Member
    from East Coast

    Ken C
    Did you take a look at those pics? Does the solenoid look wired properly? Or should I utilize that empty stud?


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  16. MO54Frank
    Joined: Apr 1, 2019
    Posts: 440

    MO54Frank
    Member

    I would say the wire you have going to the coil comes from the ignition switch. Might be a good idea to verify continuity with a ohm meter. But since it ran before the 12v change that is probably okay....
     
  17. Jack E/NJ
    Joined: Mar 5, 2011
    Posts: 836

    Jack E/NJ
    Member
    from NJ

    While you're at it, switch wire needs to be wrapped with electrician tape from HomeDepot. Cu strap from sol to starter needs to be bent up from anywhere near the starter case. Jack E/NJ

    tapestrap.jpg
     
  18. Heavy Old Steel
    Joined: Feb 1, 2019
    Posts: 96

    Heavy Old Steel
    Member

    A multimeter is your friend... The coil + should have 12v to neg. Battery terminal with key in run and no resistor, just over 6 volts with resistor. The resistor saves your points when running is bypassed when starting to give 12 volts to coil.



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  19. KenC
    Joined: Sep 14, 2006
    Posts: 1,045

    KenC
    Member

    Questions and answers from the Advance site regarding this coil:
    Is this 6 volt 1.5 ohm
    Verified Reply - SolomoNo, Dodge, this Driveworks Ignition Coil (Part # 26189) has a vehicle system voltage of 12 Volts and it has a minimum primary resistance of 1.0 - 1.7 range. To locate the exact ignition coil, please provide us with the year, make, model and engine size of your vehicle.
    QDoes this coil have a built in resistor
    Verified Reply - SolomonNo, Gus! This Ignition Coil - Part No. 26189 can be used with external resistor or where resistance wire is an integral part of wiring harness.
    If it were mine, it would get a resistor installed as mentioned earlier. The unused solenoid terminal would be attached to the coil + along with the wire from the I terminal of the switch. That last wire would have the resistor in series with the switch and coil.
     
  20. JUSTIN PERSINGER
    Joined: Apr 28, 2020
    Posts: 100

    JUSTIN PERSINGER
    Member

    Use a ballast resistor from a 1957 Chevy, can be picked up at Orielly's. As far as starting, Does your motor whirl over, but you can't get it to fire?
    If so, check your points, make sure your battery ground is to the block of the motor, and recheck your coil, add the resistor, and try again.
    Then once it's up and running you can verify charging system is actually charging.

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  21. A few notes about ignition coils...

    There's really no such thing as a '6V' or '12V' coil, just varying primary coil resistances which controls how much current they draw. Typical points-style coils will be in the 1.2 to 1.7 Ohm range as a general rule. On a 12V points-ignition system, they're run through a ballast resistor to increase point life, the full voltage is only used at starting for the hotter spark. You'll burn the points up quickly without one. Ballast resistors pretty much disappeared once electronic ignitions came on the scene.

    Your OEM coil with a properly-sized resistor (generally within .1 Ohm of the primary coil) will work just fine.

    The limitation with electronic ignitions is how much current it can switch; i.e. turning the coil on/off to generate the spark. This is related to the primary coil resistance in Ohms, as long as it's not less than the ignition rating you're good. Some aftermarket ignitions are less particular about this (MSD for one) as they limit either current according to RPM or by limiting dwell time. The latter doesn't reduce current to the coil, but does reduce the coil 'on' time at slower speeds, which is where the damage occurs.
     
  22. brading
    Joined: Sep 9, 2019
    Posts: 704

    brading
    Member

    First to add to what Jack E/NJ has said in post #47 first disconnect the battery then take that strap off give it a good clean and refit do the same with the big leads. Then take a spark plug out, hold it against a clean metal of the engine, get some to spin the engine over and see if you have a strong spark. ( I apologise if this sounds like trying to teach you to suck eggs )
    It would make no difference to the starting fitting a ballast resistor at this stage as the w2w has said in post #9 that the engine ran ok before he changed the Genny for an Alternator. As we can see the w2w is not very wise on auto electrics so in my opinion it would be best to go through this one stage at a time.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2020
  23. w2w
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 211

    w2w
    Member
    from East Coast

    Ok thank you guys. I appreciate all the wisdom and years of experience.
    I admit, electrical systems are my downfall, but I can make anything outta metal.


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  24. w2w
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 211

    w2w
    Member
    from East Coast

    So there has been some talk about my issue being burned up points. Haven’t checked yet but a few people told me that could be the issue, too much juice to the old ones. If that’s the case than I’m converting to electronic ignition.
    Thoughts?


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  25. Jmountainjr
    Joined: Dec 29, 2006
    Posts: 1,672

    Jmountainjr
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Converting to electronic ignition isn't necessarily a bullet proof solution as they also can have issues. I don't want to sound critical, but I cringe when I see non-sealed crimp connectors all over the place and frayed wires. They are trouble in the making. Cooroded and broken wires are just down the road. Either use heat shrink connectors or cover them with heat shrink. I prefer non-insulated connectors and heat shrink when needing to splice a wire.
     
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  26. KenC
    Joined: Sep 14, 2006
    Posts: 1,045

    KenC
    Member

    I never like to make more than one change at a time when troubleshooting.
    So, I'd make it run before any further changes. If the root problem isn't fixed, and you install a new system it may not work either. One step at a time
     
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  27. w2w
    Joined: Oct 17, 2008
    Posts: 211

    w2w
    Member
    from East Coast

    Copy.
    Ya I was planning on making sure the wires were fixed and cleaned up. But wanted to make sure everything worked properly first.


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