Technical A Question About Paint.

all depends on how good and how long and or who put the last paint job on. if I did it 20 years ago [properly] I would make any repairs and paint over my previous job but then again sometimes it is more work to blend out the boy work and old paint to make it look right. the cost to fix it later will be more or the "price" of living with the flaws will be worse than the work to make it right now.
do yourself a favor, have it blasted all off by a reputable stripping company. the paint will be gone, the old filler will be gone the rust will be gone and you will still have your roll of sand paper, a cleaner shop, some time to do something fun and your sanity.

 

I knew a stripper named "Jello". She was so huge that she shook all over...

 

Depends.....A POS daily driver with low expectations and a 10’ spray job, probably not.
A nice, keep forever car, yes.

 

I’m shooting for a nice (not show quality) driver. It’s gonna be used to haul stuff and cruise around town.

 

The use of spray stripper or any stripper for that matter doesn't have to be messy. Do one panel at a time. Squeegee the bulk of the residue off onto newspapers below the panel. Follow with a rinse or mop off the remaining residue with a large water soaked towel. Rinse towel and repeat until clear of residue.
When completely dry and free of stripper it is imperative that the panel be cleaned with a wax and grease remover.
I repeat... WAX AND GREASE REMOVER. Nothing else works the same.
Strippers contain wax which seal the chemical allowing them to attack the paint. This wax must come of for obvious reasons. The water rinse doesn't remove wax.

Some paint actually lifts away from the surface and dries ( I've seen factory finish do it on a M-B 280 SL ) while other types only soften enough to be easily scrapped off.

 

Chem stripper is a mess,
It great for a car with all pristine metal on a precious car but crap paint.

 

Every car you strip is going to be different from the last one. Sometimes paint stripper lifts the paint really easy - sometimes it doesn’t. When it wrinkles up easily you can can scrape it off with a plastic bondo spreader but sometimes depending on the prior types of paint ( or 18 layers)it just sits on the car.....laughing at you.

It can sometimes help if you sand the spot you are going to strip with 80 - 120 grit - it helps “open up” the painted surface and help the paint stripper penetrate better. Go slowly and carefully do one panel at a time . Paint stripper can make a big mess ... into a bigger mess.

Paint stripper can be the answer but sometimes it may just be easier to sand the paint off the car.

 

Edit to the OP.
Since I’m painting the underbody and frame are there any suggestions about what to use? I’m wanting an epoxy paint for each and am thinking about Raptor or Lizard skin on the underbody. Thoughts? Things to avoid?

 

Hi kids, late to the party. Lots to unpack here but let's try to keep it simple. Job#1 is to have a clear vision of what you want. Full stripping is essentially restoring the finish. Are you into a restoration? Even then, as alluded to above the level of restoration can include not stripping every painted surface. Cleaning jambs can be ok, provide a clean surface and a mechanical bond (sanding) and recoat.

I can already tell this can easily become building a watch vs telling what time it is. Let's render it down to the most important thing to any finish, MIL THICKNESS. Too much doesn't last. We've all seen an old custom with gallons of clear over gallons of colors and graphics and looking like mosaic tile in an old restroom. That hard thick coating went through untold cycles of expansion and contraction. Bend a piece of 1/8 plastic sheet and it goes a long way before it breaks. Now try it with 1/4". SNAP! with half the effort or distance bent, right? So think of your paint surface this way. Is stripping the only way to ensure quality and longevity? Sometimes it is. Then there's the question of how. Chemical is a mess and has it's own worries of contamination as well as health hazards. Abrasive or blasting removal is best done by experienced pros. A sand blaster can make a door look like a flag waving on a windy day, even soda and media can warp in the wrong hands. There's also simple sanding, but not with a 40 grit grinder. One can view the stable surface as pretty "primer" and sand it to within a whisker of it's former life. All the highs and lows show. Repairs are always taken all the way down with the exception of less severe dings and dents. Sometimes a bit of careful hammer and dolly is all you need. I tend to do all body work before stripping on restoration projects. If welds are involved they too get a good cleaning. All of this banter assumes a compatible foundation. If it's still OEM sand it and seal it, it's been there all this time, what's the worry. If it's that custom with the mosaic tile look, strip it. Surface cracks tend to go all the way down and CAN NOT BE FILLED. They will reappear like magic on the 1st hot day. That's a strip job.

The most important bit of info here goes back to MIL THICKNESS. Even if you sand the existing finish keep that in mind as to how far you have to go. The thinner the final finish the more durable it will be, PERIOD. That goes for primer, mud, sealers, all of it. Remember the plastic sheeting analogy and you will succeed.

 

John,

The question about how far to go with stripping a car is a lot like these medical questions.

Open heart surgery?
Stint?
Aspirin treatment with diet and exercise?
Good news, it’s acid reflux.....

Each car is different and has different needs but then again each is similar.

There is just so many variables. Each “treatment” involves a certain amount of risk.
Over treatment of course solves the problem but is costly with lots of acute risk. When correctly done, back to bare metal can provide as good or better than when the car was new.

Botched work or unforeseen circumstances with a bare metal car, can mean the end for it. I have seen plenty of stripped down cars, left to rust. I have seen plenty more started and for whatever reason abandoned. These cars would have been much better off if no restoration was started.

Things to consider that only you can answer.

Is the car a viable platform?
Many of the cars mentioned above may have been far beyond the “restorer”. They were too rough to start on.

Does the “ restorer”, you, have the talent, means, equipment and ability to see it through?
If you do not have the equipment, do you have the means to get it or hire it done?

It’s a common assumption that bare metal is the best way to go. That assumption is based on the premise that the repair or finish application will be done “ better” than the factory.

Now let’s look at some risks with the treatments mentioned in this thread.

Chem stripper.
My opinion on the chemical paint strippers is that it’s really for stuff like furniture and filing cabinets for the home shop.

Can it be utilized by the home Auto shop? Sure, but is has pitfalls.

It’s messy, like toxic waste dump messy.
It’s dangerous.
It can burn you.
It can damage the lungs.
It’s a poison so keep kids and pets away.
It must be cleaned off completely.
This stuff can settle into seams and strip off the new top coats if not totally removed. This has happened to some very high end restorations that were “dipped”.
It requires immediate action after washing.
Big question....
Can it be completely cleaned and primed and is this better than what’s already there?

Blasting.....

A home sand blaster and cabinet is a handy tool for the home shop. It’s great for wheels and small parts.
Can the home blaster be used for the whole car?
Yes, but it needs to be a good one with the right media and the right operator. Like most of this stuff, it requires a certain amount of skill.
Like chemicals the media can hide in seams.
The unskilled operator can damage panels.
The byproducts or waste is blown all over the place.
It can be dangerous if proper protection is not used.
It requires immediate clean up prep and primer.
The stuff goes every where.
Consider the mechanical components.....steering axles, brakes, ect, ect, ect......

Pro blasters.....

Industrial blasters....

will blast a car for cheap. What comes back is a piece of junk with worse than Rustoleum primer but the job was cheap.

Pro auto blasters...

Make sure these guys are not industrial blasters posing as automotive restoration blasters.
Check out the reputation.
A good automotive blaster will use the right media and the right primer.
It’s expensive but consider the cost and time with the home fixes.
What comes back is a solid and clean platform to start on.
My brother had this done to a mid 60s pony car.
All I can say is Wow!.....
What came back is a garage guy’s dream.
A clean canvas so to speak. It was just a pleasure to look at that car all clean and in epoxy primer.
There were some surprises like more damage and rust out but it’s in plain view ready for repair.
It’s in prime so there’s no.....I gotta put something on it stress.
If you have indoor storage this is a good route to go.
As mentioned earlier the mechanical stuff will still need attention but with the milder media the pros use the potential damage is not as acute.

Sanding......

Most shops go this route. In my opinion this is the most realistic for the home shop. You are using tools you already should have compressor, grinders, DAs and spray guns.
It may be labor intensive and slow but as you go, skill increases and while panel damage is possible it’s really easy to notice and correct as you have more feel.
If you can’t have one media blasted and epoxy primed by an auto blaster.....this is the way to go.
With sanding you slowly remove layers and can feather, leaving viable factory primer or finish if you choose to do so.

It’s what I’m going to do.

I have three main projects....
One needs disassembly, patch panels and most if not all of it will go down to bare metal.

The 2nd has a crappy paint job that will be color sanded to look like good 56 year old paint. Eventually it will have panels that need to be stripped down and refinished but it’s not critical the whole car being stripped down.

The last one has original paint, some minor rust and damage but it is what it is and will be driven as is.

Each is different and has different needs.

Your chassis question....,
For DFW area.... I would clean up the chassis and use Rustoleum Red Oxide topped with semigloss Black. This is far far superior to what the factory did and in the DFW area it should last years and years.

If you lived in the Midwest or Northeast the epoxies may be the way to go but at the gateway to the Southwest a simple chassis re-paint is what I would do.....

 

Better late than never. I like that analogy. It makes perfect sense. I have seen some cars painted a few times that look exactly like you are describing. It just looks off. Most people probably wouldn't see it but car guys would notice. I definitely do not want that.

All valid points and things I have thought about. It makes me feel better knowing that others have the same opinion. Fortunately for me the Jeep has been in Texas its entire life. I have the history of it from the original bill window sticker and the salespersons name and number. The history gets fuzzy after the original owner went into a nursing home and his kids sold off his “junk” just to makes space for god knows what.

I feel like I got lucky with finding the Jeep in my own backyard. (literally 2 miles away) It doesn’t have any of the normal rust problems that other examples have such as the rockers, quarter panels, and fender flares. The worst of it was the lower edge of the firewall where the floor pans joins the firewall. I had to make new pieces but that wasn’t too difficult. For me, this is a larger project than I have ever tackled but it is not something I can’t do. I was a mechanic for a decade and have always been able to work with my hands. I am not a master craftsman, but I do ok. My biggest challenge is trying to do all of this in a home garage with limited space.

I had considered using the Mastercoat products that another user on here sells because of the great peer reviews but I really would like something easy to apply in the garage. Would the Rustoleum work well for the underbody also, or would I need to look into something different? I assume you are recommending the topcoat from the same Rustoleum product line?

 

Hello John Armstrong rather than see you paint the bottom of your car in that fashion I will send you, if you like, 2 quarts of the high gloss black single stage. Just brush it on like you would rust oleum. PM me with your address and thank you for the kind words

 

Satin black kits on its way. Read the paperwork and wear gloves

 

That is awesome. Thank you so much.

 

You're welcome have fun