Technical Tig welder question before purchase.

I'm going to get a Tig and had a few questions and needed some input. I don't want to start a shit storm and I know there's been billions of posts about what brand to buy. A lot of reviews I've looked at have been a few years old (2017 and older) and I'm looking for some current input on a machine that people have been using for a few years.

I'm looking for something that's going to last well past the warranty period, a solid machine for a home welder (who's just starting out). I've been reading about water cooled vs non cooled and inverter vs non inverter. I've come to the conclusion that I would like a 200-250 amp machine and if it's upgradeable to water cooled if need be in the future that would be a bonus.

Miller:
I've read some negative reviews on the Syncrowave 210 about breaking down quickly and was wondering if anyone has a newer one or input on one (2017+).

Everlast:
I've watched a few reviews on the 250dx, some like the accessories, some say to get new quality ones.

Primeweld 225

APH Aplha Tig 201XD

HTP invertig 221

My head is swimming.....

I'm also going to post this on the Garage Journal.

 

Don't know if this helps, but at least it's very entertaining

 

I love my Miller sincrowave
But bought it several years ago so probably not much help.
Used the dynasty’s, those are great but more$$$
We have a Lincoln at school and the instructor hates it compared to the blue ones.

 

Damn, add another one to the list .

 

Well, I bought the Alpha Tig 201 about a year ago and it does work but with all the adjustments I don't know what the heck I'm doing. A guy at work brought in his Eastwood basic model Tig machine and I could lay down a very nice bead. I know I have to experiment with different electrodes, but it just seems too aggressive. Guess I just have to play around with it more. It does work and gets good reviews on the internet. I had to get new tungsten holding parts (you know the parts in the torch that hold the tungsten) they were machined off center. I just e-mailed them and they sent me new ones, and not just one, they sent 3 complete sets. I do have to say the warranty dpt. is very good but the thing is, you don't want to have to use the warranty department.
Don't take this as a negative review, I'm sure I just don't know what I'm doing.

 

I would take a look at the Lincoln Precision TIG line. I bought a new 275 in 2002 and it's still going strong. I don't think the basic design has changed in that time. They have a 225 and a 275 in the amperage range you're looking at. I'm a home builder and just do basic maintenance on it (change the coolant once in a while, pull the covers off and blow the dust out). It does not have all the features of a more modern inverter machine, and is less energy efficient, but it's been a really robust welder for me.

 

I don’t know how much you know about tig machines, so some of what I say may seem like a basic “duh” type comment.
Not all tig machines are capable of welding aluminum. The machine needs to have A/C capabilities.
Aluminum can be welded with a very basic A/C capable machine, but if aluminum is one of your main needs, a machine with a pulser and a/c wave control would be a better choice than a plain jane/ fixed wave unit.
I love welding with inverter units. They are extremely precise and controllable to the nth degree.... But the reliability is not quite there for me. They are expensive up front, and expensive when things go wrong.
I have no brand loyalty. I like blue, and I like red.
My personal machine at home is a precision tig 275 by Lincoln. It is large for a home machine, but it does everything I could want to do with it, and it has been 100% reliable. I bought it used 8-10 years ago. It is self contained with a cooler, has a pulser and a/c wave control, and it was reasonably priced (used) for $2200.

 

My son and I purchased a Primeweld 225 AC\DC about 6 months ago. Did a lot of research before purchase. It got great reviews. Has all the bells and whistles I need. Welds aluminum beautifully. Welds 18 gauge body sheet metal very well.

I was even able to weld 2 razor blades together.

Pulse and wave control. It was right around $700. I think it is very comparable to the red and blue welders in the $2000+ range. Best bang for the buck IMHO.​

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I may be lucky but I bought an Eastwood 200 ac dc machine right after they were released. The pot in the pedal has died once and that's been it. I called them asking about a longer torch cable. The tech informed me that 12' was the industry standard. End of discussion. I machined an adapter to use my 25' cable of my old setup and went to work. There are long cables and parts in many places for these. Most inverter machines all use standard parts that have been in use since the 60's or before. Maybe I got lucky but the machine has done everything I've asked it to do. My suggestion is to only buy an inverter machine from someone who's been in business and has a history of good warranty service. Welders are electronics and if you buy enough of that category, you know there is around a 20% failure rate. Good luck with your decision.

 

I've had an Econotig since the mid 90s. I don't have a need to do NASA level uber thick stuff, and frankly I'm sure I could safely build a complete 'moly drag chassis with it without ever approaching the duty cycle limit. I also have no need to do 8 solid hours of 1/4"+ aluminum welding, but for heavy sheet aluminum and even a few casting repairs over the years it's performed admirably. It's awesome for sheet metal, exhaust tubing, roll cage work, essentially everything a hot rodder like "us" will ever need. Yes, I'd simply like to have a bigger liquid cooled unit, but I have yet to be in a situation where I can justify the expense. Some have seen my schtick over the years and the fact that I used and entry level machine on some of it means nothing to the finished product. Biggest job I ever did was a full 12pt 'moly cage in a Fox body. Lots of tubes. Lots of welding. No issues, no worries as to weld integrity, and pretty handy for every aspect of that job and several others similar. Lost track of how many 'moly suspension pieces I've fabbed with it, and several I have stayed in contact with still have those parts in rather fast race cars to this day, and most were done in the late 90s to early 2Ks. I've had it so long I could sell it used for more than I paid new back then. Just sharing my personal experience, and while in crash and safety for Tier 1 OEM supplier I did all day weld jobs with both Lincoln and Miller. I'd take either and see that the same as painting. You can do a Ridler winner with a HF spray gun, but it's a whole lot nicer job to do with a big-ticket Iwata/DeVilbiss/SATA/Binks. At the end of the day the guy behind the welding helmet has a lot to do with the quality and safety of the weld. The frequncy of actual work should dictate the need and investment. I also think you should let us know what you end up doing. Just sayin...

 

I can’t help with a testimonial on new machines as all mine are older. And you may already know this but the inverter machines require less amperage input so if you don’t have a enough power in your shop you may need to go that direction. Also your on the right track for wanting to add a cooler down the road if you plan on any amount of aluminum welding. You can do it but you need to stop and let the torch cool down. I had a guy melt the silver solder out of the gas connection and melted down the whole thing.


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For what it's worth, depending on where you're at on other machines, I have a Miller Multimatic 220 which is the multi-process rig with DC/AC TIG functions, the HF start plus a pulse weld function. I'm a noob when it comes to TIG welding but it's a pretty smooth machine and should be upgradable down the road if you need a cooler. It was spendy I won't lie, but it's the last welder I'll buy. I joke and say it's my kids...

 

1oldtimer , hi i have a hobart tig machine that I'm looking to sell,not to you though because your on the west coast I'm on the east coast. anyway I've used my machine for cm,ss, ms and alum. to weld up my nostalgia fe dragster comp. coupe that's been on the Hambs web site. never had an ounce of problems welding with it. the only draw back if any is when welding alum. you really need to know what your doing. Ive welded my shorten olds rear end housing which has 1/4" tubes with absolutely no problems. My machine goes up to 165amps. which is more then you'll ever need. Like I said not looking to sell you mine but for the hobbits that you are the Hobart family is a very good option. and they would be right in your price range for someone starting out. You need to realize its all the added stuff that will jack up the price.. You might be interested in buying used and getting all items with the unit. Well good luck and when your ready happy welding. Mike

 

A friend of mine is supposed to be buying the Eastwood tig.
He emailed me a few to look at to help him decide. He wasn’t aware of the aluminum issue. One was a multi purpose machine that said it welded aluminum if you purchased the spool gun. So I assumed this one only liked aluminum on the mig side. The specs and reviews look good on the others.
Make sure it is aluminum capable and I also look at the minimum a machine welds on. You will be surprised how little amps you can find yourself welding with on these old cars. An 80 year old piece of sandblasted, overworked 19 gauge is no longer 19 gauge anymore.

 

How many amps do you have available in your shop? Pay close attention to the draw on the different machines youre looking at. Many tig machines are still transformer based (versus the more modern Invertor controlled) and have massive primary draws, more than a lot of people have available at a single plug in their shop. Syncrowave 210's had some issues early on but I think they've got it sorted out (I had one and never had a problem with it, but upgraded to a Dynasty). Look into warranty times and ask your distributors about service between the brands you're looking at.

 

It's funny you post this, I took the day off today sitting here waiting on ups to drop off my new primeweld 225 ac/dc tig.

I took a year to review, read, watch YouTube vids, posted on forums before I bought the primeweld. I started out looking at the lotos and the aph and ended up with the primeweld.

Never found but a couple neg posts and most could be put to owner error. Watched numerous YouTube vids and again most were surprised and happy how well it performed. Check out a vid by the fabricator series. He goes thru the review pretty thoroughly and was the final decision for my choice.

That and from what I've read a great 3 yr warranty that pays shipping both ways.

Plan to spend the weekend playing with my new toy!! Err.. I mean new "tool" ....

 

Found the link

 

No matter what you decide on, here are some things to consider.
If you use an air cooled torch it will be larger and bulkier than a water cooled torch which doesn't help fine control as much. Doesn't sound like a big deal but if you crank the amps up, the torch can get hot to your touch. Then you need to buy a larger capacity torch that even bigger and isn't cheap.

If you buy a water cooled set up, you need some type of water cooler with a pump and the factory ones aren't cheap. Its merely a cycling of water and a homemade one can be made reasonably inexpensively.

Service and Parts......Buy something that you can expect parts availability and possibly local service. I checked on one of the better (?) off brand units a while back for a secondary MIG machine. Yep the price was great, but any problem and you had to ship the unit to California for service/repair. I had an issue with my Miller MIG. Tried all the ideas I could think of, but it didn't help. Seemed to not be getting gas to the weld. Swapped regulator, and another bottle.Checked connection and spool and changed wire. Finally gave up and took it to a LOCAL repair shop. In 10 minutes he had it fixed. Apparently some dumba** (me) had stepped on the welding cable and since it exits on a downward angle from the machine, it had pulled down slightly and was allowing the gas to escape and air to enter.
He pushed the cable in about a 1/4 inch and tightened the clamp. No parts, and said forget the labor charge. I insisted that he take some money for helping me because it was my dumb act that created the problem. IF you ever need to have your machine looked at for a simple or a major problem, local service is important.

There are lots of little things that are not apparent or overlooked at the time of purchase and become "wish I had" later on. Infinitely variable controls are preferable to "stepped" controls. The quality of the foot control and the torch and the tips. All things you often notice later.

If you buy something, I would recommend IOC (Indiana Oxygen Company out of Indianapolis. They ship it to your door for free and usually have the cheapest prices I have found. They are on Ebay.

Also get something that has both AC and DC so you can weld aluminum. You will find aluminum takes a lot of amps and you need the water cooled torch.

I have a Miller 200 and its a great machine. I would also recommend that you attend any Street Rod National event or possibly Good Guys or something large and similiar. They usually have booths set up where you can see and try machines out. They also usually offer show prices.

So, no matter what you choose, those are some things to consider.

Remember parts availability years down the road is an important consideration, and a name brand welder will hold its value. 10 years from now a name brand will still be worth 75% of what you paid. My son has a Miller 212 (mig) we paid $1700 for about 5 years ago. I think they sell for $2200 now. He can get his money back if he wanted to sell it............but he doesn't want to sell it.

 

I have a Miller Synchrowave 250DX - bought it new 2005, has never failed me.

 

Well as a professional welder since I was 17 and a welding instructor for the past 22 years I was going to offer you some real world experience and knowledge until you said that the Diversion Sucks

I’ve had a Diversion 180 in my garage for the last 8 years or so and I have had no issues with it and I’ve used it for everything Steel ,stainless and aluminum during the building of my RPU.

For a machine that sucks it’s been great.

So now rather than offer any advice on newer machines we have tried and used at the school, I’m outa here.

 

I bought a slightly used Miller Synchrowave 180 a few years ago from a hobbyist who lost interest. Got the welder, tank, consumables, Miller cart and bunches of filler rods for $1200. It works great on aluminum, stainless and carbon steel. I have no complaints and have had no problems. If you are patient, you can find a quality used machine that will serve you well. I doubt you need a water cooled torch for automotive work.

 

It sounds like you are shopping new machines so my experience is different but I bought my used 300 amp Lincoln as part of a package deal from a shop that was going out of business. It was one year old in ‘95 when I got it. It’s still going strong with no issues all these years. I’ve considered replacing it with a new smaller, more efficient machine but how many of the new machines that fit my budget will still be working perfectly 25 years from now?


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I'll throw in my vote for the Alpha (or primeweld -- as it seems like the same thing). Been using it for a couple years no issues works fine for me. Its at least a third the cost of the big names. I use it pretty regularly mostly on sheet metal and 3/16 mild steel (check out my latest build). I did upgrade the foot pedal. Its ac/dc too. But I do not do much aluminum.

 

I never thought I would say anything like this.

I used my friends PrimeWeld, and I liked it.

 

Mine is a generation older than that one, and I have had no issues.

That said, the pulsing feature is not all that useful as the ones in modern machines are.

 

As said earlier I bought a Primeweld a few months ago and it has the upgrade pedal with it now, instead of the cheapie. Also comes with the better quality CK torch. I can also vouch for customer service. You get a very helpful English speaking fellow on the phone in the US. We had a problem with the first welder (we thought). Called customer service. With very little explanation, he offered to ship a new welder to us to compare to the one we first received. It arrived freight free in 2 days. Turns out it wasn't the machine, we had the machine setup wrong. Called support back. They paid to ship the 2nd machine back. I don't think you can get better customer support than that.
I don't own a nickel's worth of Primeweld. I am just impressed with the whole deal at about 1/3 the price of the comparable red or blue ones. By the way, I have been welding for better than 50 years ( a lot of those years professionally) and was always a blue guy.

 

https://www.everlastgenerators.com/product/tig-stick/powertig-185dv

I bought a new Everlast 185 a year and a half ago and have gone through maybe five tanks of Argon since. I've welded everything from 19 GA to 1/2" thick. After 20 minutes of the 1/2" stuff, the torch got too hot to hold, so I let it rest, but it never tripped off. Then back at it again.

I've done some aluminum too, but I'm not really good at that so I can't comment on this machine's ability in AC.

The price is very affordable for a TIG machine that will do most everything a hobby car guy might want. Only extras I had to purchase was a new inner collett as the supplied piece wouldn't let me jamb the tungsten in from the front. And I have to change tungstens a LOT.

 

I have noticed a few comments on this thread which are questionable, at best, so, understand that many "experts" are anything but.

Here is the impossible:


PrimeWeld, welding 1/4" aluminum, with an air-cooled torch, plugged into a 120V 20A outlet!

 

I'm impressed. The Primeweld came with an adaptor for 120v power, but have never tried it.

 

It does limit maximum output, but for most automotive stuff, it will be fine at 120V.