Art & Inspiration When does traditional "expand"? (If it ever does)

Nostalgia is a term I have a hard time with. When you drive your fox body you "wax nostalgic". That is because you were there. The wife and I could get real nostalgic about a '58 Merc because that was our first car that we owned together. But when I see a 20 something car with a muscle car saying that it is his nostalgia car my brain says, well maybe to me but not to you he was not there.

 

Something for everybody in this world.

But I like the HAMB's mid-sixties cut off. It's perfect for my tastes.

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You most have missed the NAT's South this year, I saw several toyota'a and a Honda

To be honest we have a pretty active hot rod scene in my area and as you said there are very few young guys able to purchase a Deuce, but there are stuill lots of inexpensive entry level cars if a young guy really wants a pre 65 car.

There is a local club here busting at the seems with younger guys and they have a large group of early cars. there is also many guys around with different mind sets, the foreign set, tuners, 4 wheel drive, caddy's and so on.

There seems to be something for every car & truck guy in the upstate of South Carolina. HRP

 

The very reason this forum is filled with knowledge and experience is because of its strict cutoff guidelines.
It’s by far the most traditional forum on the planet attracting experienced hot Rodder s from the actual period.
Why would any of us want to change that.

 

I was born in the '50s but I am a '60s kid and prefer a '60s build. The mid '60s cutoff is perfect for me.

 

So....this is an interesting discussion...I’ve always been a 50’s and 60’s mild Kustom kind of guy, but have also have other cars in between..including some go fast cars...well I started buying mid 60’s - late 60’s Hot Rod, Car Craft, Etc magazines...suddenly I wanted to own a hot little street car...built in that style or era..to me it’s traditional, and period correct, doesn’t really fit into a category, it’s not a stock build, so the purists don’t dig it, todays go fast crowd says why would anyone throw money on a 289 to get 350 hp, and where’s the nitrous and turbo, so I built it to something a guy would do in his garage during that 60’s era...other than the CNC ported aluminum heads..

I gotta say I was really digging where Traditional Rod and Kulture was at..they had everything from flathead powered A’s to 69 Vette with a wild paint job and Cragars...again both styles that kind of have a fringe following.

I gotta say if there was a “HAMB” for “traditional” builds of 60’s and early 70’s street / drag cars I’d be an active participant.

For now I like my HAMB how it is...

I will say it’s a little easier for me to identify with that era of car..I remember the neighbors daily driver plum crazy Challenger , the others 70 Cutlass with cragars, my Dads 70 Nova, As a kid in the 70’s that’s what we saw...

I pretty much dig anything built to resemble a place in past history from my youth or before ..I don’t care about LS powered crap, or pro touring, that’s too modern..if I wanted that I’d buy a GT 350 and be done...but if it’s old, looks cool, and is built to a bygone era chances are I’ll dig it..

Is this pic Traditional ???

 

Take a look at Good Guys and NSRA they updated and expanded and accept Gremlins and other misfit brands and years of cars to keep the money rolling in. HAMB not money based so it can stay as it is, let's keep it that way.

 

I try not to use the word traditional went it comes to building cars, because you can use some petty out there stuff, engines drive drives ect... and still come up with a car that looks like it rolled out of the mid 50's

@moose's 30 Sedan 1951 Plymouth 218 flat 6 powered


Bill Commane Jimmy 6 (332 C.I.D)


I would much rather see a 67 Chevelle with Cragar SS, a Sun Super Tach greenline gauges, and a T-handle shifter. The a resto-mod 55 Chevy, or some mid 90's Honda with tie-wrapped on (Zip ties) air dams.

 

We have lots of tuners and truck stuff here.
A few car clubs with several younger members. The best local gathering here is open to anything. I like that.
If the nsra mats has foreign stuff, cool
I will have to check if my yota is allowed. I might just join if it is.

 

I think the thing about kids today who spray can their cars and add a fart can are the same kind of core group that hot rodders came from. They experiment with what they have on hand and do so with little money. They collectively have made some of the little cars into real drag race weapons with cheap turbochargers and nitrous.
That gets them involved with mechanical things, and I think thats a good thing. Many of them would like to have a really old hot rod, but they don't have the money or the tools to do so. I think the big difference is that as they get older there will be few rebuildable icon cars and nothing with any real "mystique". I think they will grow up and accumulate money and tools, and they will be the ones who continue our heirtage. They will buy our old cars and parts and continue on.

 

Yes @Taboo56Chevy the word traditional can be used however you like and welcome to the Hamb derailed thread zone.
This site does not own the copyright to the term traditional. Use it anyway you deem appropriate
The rules here are set by the boss and operates under his definition of traditional. Many of us here including me like his definition.
His football, his yard.
This comment was made on a traditional 7 year old Iplone.

 

Who's the dumbass who came up with "Day Two"? Probably the same dumbass who came up with "Body Drop", instead of Channeled.

 

I imagine, some day there will be guys talking about Traditional Tuners, lol. "Bro, Check out my Period Correct, Honda Civic!".

 

Maybe I should start stocking up on Pep Boys, light up shifters and neon kits! Might be the Ardun heads of the future....

 

Year One is the term (and parts house by the same name) that supports the restoration end of the muscle car world. Back to the condition as it was in year one.
Day Two was quickly adopted as the look of say a 68 Olds the second year off the showroom floor; headers, TA's, TT's, under-dash tape deck, cam, carb, valve covers, air cleaner, stripes, slappers and spoilers, etc..

I think the two terms accurately describe the look and genre guys are seeking and help them build their cars accordingly. Used in a sentence, "My 442 is a day-two muscle car, I'm not a restoration kind of guy". Without any pictures you now have an accurate image in your head of my Olds.

 

Which is a term......out of place on the HAMB!

 

I think for me, traditional is a very broad term that covers anything, sure it’s possible to have traditions that started in the eighties or nineties or any time. Is it the traditional sense covered here? Of course not. This place should not change however I’m the first to be happy to see anyone work on cars. It’s very narrow minded to refuse to accept the fact that there is anything outside of our time frame discussed here. Like Anthony I have a broad range of cars/automotive interests, none of which are truly H.A.M.B. friendly. Does that mean I’m not welcome here? Hope not. I agree with Mark that era correct works better.

I have no idea anymore if this is way off what the thread was about anymore but there it is!


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It has already expanded a bit. Some people think having a traverse leaf spring with and I-beam and split wishbone automatically makes the car traditional. But not when it’s on and obscure off brand.
When enough people believe something is traditional and the old generation can’t be there to explain it. It just becomes so.
Also when the site owner gives it a pass.

 

They already are.

 

Interesting thread with no one right answer. For the record, I like it the way it is around here. I wouldn't go to a show that had too many Camaros and Mustangs. 70s is late model to me, even though I know that 1970 was 50 years ago.
I had a very sharp mechanically minded employee/friend, unofficial one of my own kids guy who died unexpectedly this past summer. He appreciated my stuff, and basically, as an old soul, understood my stuff, too. But, he also, besides working for me, built Mazda RX8s with GMC 6 cylinder engines, swapped the trans and rear ends, redid all the computer shit, and made my engine swaps look like tinker toys. He and his partner were having pieces cast in China, and doing ridiculous stuff to these cars, building for others, and gaining a following on youtube.. These cars would scare the shit out of most of us, and would give you nightmares from a test ride.
But he also wanted to buy my 39 Ford and put some damn evil Jap motor in it. It would have been a beast, but I always told him I wouldn't sell it to him to do that.
If he had lived, I might have sold it to him eventually. This kid could and did fix unfixable stuff, and had amazing skills and abilities. He WAS a hot rodder, and owned v 8s, too.
We always argued about electric and Tesla shit. I tried to get him to join the HAMB, but keep his mouth shut.

 

not even close. Hot rods are a passion, a lifestyle almost. fart cans on a Honda are something you do cuz you friend did it. then you move on to some other interest.

 

All we have to do is bump up a year every 10 or 20 years and most of the flamed PT shit will be gone and most of us will be in HOT ROD HEAVEN and could care less about about fart cans or traditional.

 

How and when did the five speed tranny get the pass?

 

This is the earliest one I found
Looks like Feb of 05
https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/t-5-5spd-to-flathead-adapter.46109/
If you do a generic google search on s10
5 speed tech, the Hamb is one of the first and maybe the largest single spot for info on the subject.
I often google off topic subjects for info and the Hamb is almost always a source for info. I wasn’t around until 09. Apparently, it was much less traditional of just different then.
However, the boss man has explained a few times why the lines are blurred.
And here we are beating the same dead horse again.

 

When I found this place I stayed because I like it here. For my 2 cents worth it should stay just as is.

 

What would it expand to, the '80's, '90s? One word "icky"

 

The basic problem is one of "definition". Everyone has their own version of what is "traditional" but since we are on Ryan's site, his is the only one that counts. The secondary problem is that his definition is purposely kind of vague, which is a good thing........except its needs a little clarification .
Let me explain......
There is one set of rules but they are placed in the "Introduction" section meaning they apparently apply to all three thread sections equally. That seems a little illogical to me. The only rule anyone seems to have somewhat of a problem with is Rule #4
4. We cover traditional '65 and older American cars only. All other threads will be deleted. We don't cover rat rods, muscle cars, mustangs, or VWs.
Now that rule doesn't say anything specific about tires or motors but I'm told that means no Radial Tires, No Radial Tires that Look like Bias ply, No Wide tires. It also means no electronically controlled fuel injection engines, no engines produced after 1965, no 3 speed overdrive automatics, no A/C, and on and on. So it doesn't actually say any of those things, it only refers to the cars themselves........and since most of the Pre 66 cars didn't have that stuff, its logical.

The problem is that the location of that rule is in a place that means it covers all the groups, not just traditional. On the surface it means that there is no discernable difference between whats allowed in all three groups.

We all know that the vast majority of hot rods contain components from cars and the aftermarket that were not available in 1965. Rather than tell everyone they can't participate unless they are period perfect, my suggestion is that the HAMB go with the following rules.

All cars posted on the HAMB must have been manufactured prior to 1966. We don't cover rat rods,muscle cars,mustangs,or vws.

In the Traditional Section: All cars and components must have been available prior to 1966 and should have period specific bias ply tires and engines from that era.

In the General HAMB Section: All cars must be of pre-1966 manufacture and resemble Traditional Hot Rods. We don't cover rat rods, muscle cars,mustangs or vws.The components will allow any American Engine and transmission and the use of Radial tires as well as overdrive automatics and A/C .


My opinion is that by making a more defined but still somewhat generic set of rules like these and applying them to the section they apply to, there will be less confusion. Whether we want to admit it or not, the vast majority of street rodders have evolved to the point where even though they love somewhat Traditional vehicles, they are interested more in a "semi" Traditional look rather than a "period perfect" car. By the current rules a 350 Chevy engine is not acceptable since it was not made until after 65. I think its time to make the genre so that anyone wanting to stay specifically Traditional has their area on the Hamb.............and those that are satisfied with building a pre 66 but with more modern tires, wheels, and engines have their section. " and never the twain shall meet"

I just think by defining the groups this way, we won't continually wonder if we are breaking the rule, or the intent of the rule. I don't think its really going to change things.......or the people who post here, because the basic rule is that you have to be working on a car made prior to 1966. There are a lot of really really Kool hot rods out there with wide tires and later model engines. Its the overall look that counts !

Afterthought........maybe we just need a "semi-traditional" section added ?

 

Bob
It sounds like you've been around this stuff for awhile, I don't know how old you are but some years younger than me I think, and (if) you are more custom minded compared to more performance oriented I can understand your feelings about the term "day two", and believe me, the term is nothing new, even to many other HAMBER's.
There is a large segment here that have been hot rodders since "back in the day" but were not necessarily deeply rooted in the performance side of this whole shindig.
I'll expound on the comments from BB, our esteemed @#$/&% from the other side of the creek by saying though I don't know when "day two" was first coined the practice was in full swing in the very early 60's within the "performance" sector.
I didn't want to use the term "musclecar" because not only was the term not being used quite as early as say 62, it is not something that is embraced around here equally.

 

"Traditional" and "Nostalgic" are two things that are truly subjective to the individual, as is clear by the responses every time this subject comes up. That is perfectly fine, as each of us is a product of our experiences and how those experiences inform us personally. No two of us will ever "define" traditional exactly the same way.

The good news as related to the HAMB is Ryan has specifically defined "traditional" for us in context of the website. His definition is informed by his personal experiences and preferences. Whether you believe he is correctly educated to the subject at hand is irrelevant... he pays the light bill, he makes the rules. I can and will accept the HAMB for its intent... its purpose is to provide content for that definition of traditional.

As far as defining "Hot Rodders", Anthony is right. Those kids on your lawn may not build cars like you do, but they are building, or at least interested in building cars, and that is what matters most. If we were willing to spend a bit of time embracing their culture (or at least their Hot Rodding spirit), they might be quite willingly influenced by ours, and that growing concern about torch carrying I keep reading about might find a solution.

My pennies.