Technical Early Ford Quick Change Banjo Build

Everything I have seen on your car is first class. Sorry to see that second class rear end
When you're ready to step up, I'm here!

 

With a Winters V8 Quick change you don't need to notch the 32 Gas Tank.

 

Alright, time for the axle assembly. The only hiccup I encountered was the fit between the driver's side axle and the ring gear. The axle goes through the ring gear in the area circled in red in the photo below and rides on the area of the axle circled in red. The fit was a bit tight, so I found a socket that was the right size, wrapped some 500 grit sandpaper around it, and honed the opening in the ring gear ever so slightly. That did the trick.



I got all my internal parts cleaned up and spread out ready for assembly.



I greased up the passenger side axle and the passenger side of the differential carrier....



And slid the passenger carrier half onto the passenger axle. I then clamped the axle down in a vise to hold it steady when the rest was assembled.



Some more grease on the axle teeth and the spider gears...



Then I fit the spider gears into the passenger side carrier half.



I greased up the driver's side carrier half and installed it the same way it came off. Note the punch marks on each half (circled in yellow), which were made during disassembly. An important step I am told...




The last remaining parts are the driver's side axle and the ring gear assembly.



Those got greased up and went together nice and smoothly thanks to the quick hone job.



Then that whole assembly can be bolted to the passenger side assembly that is secured in the vice.



Threw some washers on, applied some loctite, and torqued them down.




That's it for the axle assembly. Next post will be assembling the housings and shimming the quick change gears.

 

Thanks for posting your QC experience. Looking forward to the rest.

 

On to the next step....

Before final assembly, I finally installed the axle seals. These are the seals at the ends of the banjo housings and they can be tricky to get seated correctly. I used a 3 foot length of allthread and a few sockets to build a little tool to press them in.



The spacing is very important here. You can see my socket held up to the end of the allthread to check to make sure I will be able to disassemble everything once it is pressed/pulled into place. The big socket on the right presses the red seal into place when pulled in with a nut on the end of the allthread shown in a few steps below. The black socket centers the assembly nicely in the axle housing end. The allthread needs to stick out far enough to get on nut on it with a strong enough spacer (I used another socket) to take the load.

The assembly gets inserted in the axle housing. I did this with the axle standing up and elevated from the ground, but you can do this with it laying horizontal on the ground too. Probably would have been easier



If you measured correctly, you'll have some allthread sticking out the end of the housing.



I then placed an appropriately sized socket over the allthread and tightened a nut to pull the seal into the housing. The vice grips on the other end ensure the allthread won't rotate.



The axle seal is nicely in place without any damage. The picture makes it look uncentered but it is in fact centered perfectly.



More to come...

 

Great work a little more than I did on mine.

 

Thanks guys.

The next step was prepping the center section. I changed my mind a bunch of times deciding whether to use studs and lock nuts (which came with the kit), studs and acorn nuts, or bolts to fasten the housings to the center section. I ended up deciding on studs and acorn nuts. That meant I needed shorter studs than what came with the kit. I got some set screws for the job. There are two holes on each side of the center section that go all the way through, so I used sealant on those to prevent any leaks.





This next part is really where the engine stand comes in handy. I rotated the center section so that the passenger side is facing up. Again, I decided against using any sealant and just greased the mating surfaces lightly.


I installed the gaskets/shims for the passenger side based on the test fitting discussed above.

I greased the axle housing mating surface...

And then torqued down the acorn nuts in a star pattern. The instructions said 25 foot pounds if memory serves...

Then the center section can be rotated on the engine stand and the axle assembly can be inserted as shown.

Repeat the same steps for the driver's side taking care to use the correct gaskets/shims and torque it down.

Once I assembled it for the final time, I rechecked the carrier bearing preload and the backlash. All was good. The last step is shimming the helical quick change gears, which I'll cover in the next post.

 

Sorry for the delay in wrapping up this build thread. Life got in the way a bit.

Time to install the quick change gears and get them properly shimmed.

When you opt for helical cut quick change gears, it is recommended that you use the shim kit to adjust the forward and aft play the gears have on their respective shafts. This is done with shims shown below.



The shims come in .030, .045, and .060 thicknesses. The instructions that came with the set were straightforward, but did not address how exactly to measure the play.



Before we start shimming, the spacer needs to be installed on the lower shaft. That's part number SR3417/SR3416 in the diagram above and shown in with the green arrow below. It's a tight fit so maybe heat it up a bit and be prepared to tap it home. A large socket or pipe is helpful here.



I couldn't figure out the best way to measure for the right clearance. Bruce had a great suggestion, which was to over shim the gears, install the cover with the gasket (barely tightening down the cover) and use a feeler gauge to see how much gap you have. The first trick is getting the gap to be even from top and bottom. My clearances were slightly off when I used the same shims on both shafts. My top shaft needed a .060 and the bottom shaft needed a .045. That got me a uniform gap between the case and the cover. See the picture below of me using a feeler gauge.



Some math is obviously involved here. If you have .025 of clearance between the case and the cover, you need to remove about .015 worth of shims. You are shooting for a clearance of .005 to .015.

Once this setting is figured out, you can carefully torque down the cover and your quick change will be essentially all done. I still need to figure out how I will be venting mine, but for now, the project is complete. Hope this helped some of you get an overview of how this project goes. It was certainly a fun one and I am thrilled to have an early Ford style quick change rear set aside for my next project. Thanks for following along. And once again, thanks to @GearheadsQCE for selling a great product and providing even better technical support!

Brad

 

Awesome thread!
This makes me buying my 3620, also.
Mine was an open driveshaft, so I need some time to get the right parts to convert it to closed driveshaft, as yours was from the beginning.
Now I will go thru your assembly instructions.
What was missing at my QC was the instructions- could you please send it to me or take it here via pdf?
Thank you so much!
Again, great job!
Michael




The H.A.M.B.

 

great info on the clearancing of the ring gear bolts

 

It looks like one would have to re-shim every time one changes gear ratio pairs

 

No, the gears are generally pretty consistent for thickness, especially from the same manufacturer. As far as I know, only Winters is currently making helical 6 spline gears. No need to shim straight cut gears, but it doesn't hurt.

 

Good article! I found that by the time you get all done, purchasing the Winters tapered tube completely assembled is the way to go. Just my opinion.

 

I used 35 axle housings. 35-41 same width. Your axle housings are 42-4 8. 2" wider. I used 4 1/2 " back space wheels to tuck the tires in close to the body.

 

After reading through this several times, my question is regarding a complete new Winters quick change rear end with the bells installed. Speedway lists the available axle bolt patterns at 5 x 4-1/2 & 5 x 4-3/4
but is it possible to get axles with the standard 5 x 5-1/2 bolt pattern? It's a great product in itself, but I would hate to loose me bent spoke Kelsey Hayes wire wheels and new tires just to trade up to a new quick change rear end with the wrong bolt pattern. Just might be stuck with the older bells & axles in order to use Lincoln brakes with a 5 x 5-1/2 pattern.

 

Steve,
It is definitely possible to get the Winters rear with the 5 on 5 1/2" bolt circle. I special order these all the time, and have them drop shipped directly to my customers. I don't know if Speedway does special orders.

To incorporate the Lincoln brakes, the housing ends need to be replaced with ones that use the early Ford bolt pattern. There are a couple of ways to accomplish this. You can either use Ford V8 axle trumpets or cut the ends off the Winters housings.

I'll send you a PM with my phone number and we can discuss the particulars.

And to all that are reading this, remember that Alliance Members get a 10% discount. That's probably enough to cover your Alliance Membership and the shipping. Spend your stimulus $ with small businesses. You can't get any smaller than Gearhead's Quickchange Exchange.

Bruce

 

I’m sorry to say that I never got my modified project off the ground and I need to move on for space and time constraints. I just listed this beauty for sale at a bargain price. Hopefully it goes to a good home.

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum...jo-quickchange-rear-winters-complete.1237804/

 

This is a great article from start to finish. I am pretty new to this era of Fords. I recently acquired a 1930 Model A with a Flathead V8, original 3 speed top loader and banjo rear-end. I would like to upgrade to a QC rear end and am looking for a Borg Warner T5 to mate up to it as well.

If anyone happens to read this and knows where a T5 can be found I would love to hear from you.

I just contacted brsturges regarding his QC for sale. If that doesn't materialize I will definitely be contacting GearheadsQCE for advice and selection. Thank you all, Kevin

 

Sorry to hear that. I checked out your ad, damned nice price. Wish I had a need for it! I suspect you’ll have a quick sale. Good luck!

 

I f there is .025 feeler needed then isn't .035 of gear shim need to be removed to get .010 clearence? Also just a note that the set screws used as studs maybe too brittle and snap [over time] but at 25# may not be a worry. I learned this at work as we used them for clamping and some would just give up over night.

 

It has been a while, and my math may have been wrong. Alternatively, I may not have explained that the gasket needs to get taken into consideration. Can’t recall the thickness of the gasket offhand but that may make up the difference.