On the right side of the water pump below the lower mounting bolt hole, there is another small passage into the block that ties into the main water pump passage. The zips riser does not have a provision for this setup and just blocks that passage. Would this maybe cause a steam pocket to form in the cooling system? I am getting some funky temp gauge readings and have (I believe) checked all the usual suspects and I am looking for some ideas. D
No problems with my Zips pump. Did you open the bleed screw when you filled the system? Sent from my SM-T350 using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
The Zips pump instructions indicate that this system needs a bypass setup to operate correctly. The instructions state that if no heater is plumbed into the cooling system, then a bypass setup should be connected from the water pump heater hose connection, back to the water jacket outlet in the passenger side cylinder head between the No. 6 and No. 8 cylinders. In order to eliminate the funky temp readings you are seeing, you need to have the coolant circulating from the passenger side cylinder head to the water pump, either directly with a bypass hose or thru the heater system. I've had a Zips pump riser on my 32 for over 18 years and it works fine, never overheats. Several times I have blocked off the heater or eliminated this bypass during the summer and have experienced the same temp issues you are seeing, it never actually overheats, but the temp gauge shows temp spikes occasionally as if there is an overheating issue, especially when stopped in traffic, but it goes down once you get moving.
Sounds similar to what I am seeing. I do have a heater plumbed into the system and should have stated that in the original post, my bad. I also saw the gauge problems when I used the shut off valve and although it reads high sometimes it does not appear to be running hot. D
To add to my original post, I am running a flow cooler pump, 180 stat,(high flow type) 17 inch six blade fan and a shroud with the correct clearance and fan depth. Yesterday when the temp outside was about 25 when I went to breakfast (about 4 miles or so} it didn't even come up to temp, kinda like the stat was stuck open. I now have about 2700 miles on the car. D
You've read all the post's now for this. What is your highest temp reading? Thermostats cycle. So just like your house, the temp goes up and down.
Swings between 180-210. I sent this gauge back to Classic and had it recalibrated. (sp?) I would expect to see some movement in the gauge, but this seems excessive and that is why I asked what exactly the extra hole in the water pump does. Seems like I remember Smoky Yunick doing something with the water flow to increase temp in one area and maybe lowering it in another to pick up some HP, but can't remember the exact details of the article. I haven't replaced the sender, and don't mind doing it, if it will help the problem. D
Swings like late model cars do today. I'm not saying to live with it. Do what you feel needs to be done.
Make sure your temp sender is grounded properly, thread tape has been known to mess up the ground. Also a stack of pipe fitting (bushings) can put the sender tip out of the water flow and cause erroneous readings. Sent from my iPhone using The H.A.M.B. mobile app
Sender direct install to manifold, no sealer. I am thinking of removing the riser and drilling the passage in it. Trying to find out exactly why it is there on stock motors. D
Yep. Been foolin' with this stuff for a long time and can't get this one figured out. This is why I asked here on the HAMB. Very seldom do I see a problem not get solved on here. I checked the stat that is in it now on the stove with a thermometer and it opened like it should. The sender is in the runner closest to the side the extra hole in the w/p is, thus the question about it. D
My setup is similar to yours, I have a 180 thermostat with four 1/8 inch holes drilled in the thermostat flange, as others have suggested, , a Walker Z Cobra radiator and a high flow water pump. During the summer, it comes up to the 180 temp in a reasonable time, then as long as the car is being driven, the temp stays right at 180. During extremely hot summer days with the outside temp in the 90-100 degree range, when I come to a stop light, the temp gauge will gradually spike up to 220-240 degrees within the two minute traffic light cycle. Once the light changes and I get rolling, the temp will drop back to the 180 temp within 60-90 seconds. In my mind, this is due to the lack of constant water flow at idle, which may be a by product of the Zips system, I can't believe that the water can get that hot or cool that fast, it too quirky. These temperature swings alarmed me at first, but the radiator is not showing signed of over pressure and puking water due to overheating, it just goes thru these extreme cycles during the summer, all of this is happening with the Zips recommended bypass setup. During the winter, it generally stays right at the thermostat 180 setting. As you mentioned it not coming up to temp when it was 25 degrees outside, I've experienced the stay scenario, generally when it gets that cold outside, I use a piece of thin black poster board paper installed inside of the grill shell and block off the lower half of the radiator to aid in keeping the coolant warmer. You mentioned you do have a heater installed and when you close the heater valve you are effectively closing off the bypass function that the Zips wants to be in place. Is your heater hose connected to the recommended outlet between the No. 6 & No. 8 cylinders or is it connected to the intake manifold? The Zips instructions want it connected to the cylinder head, I'm guessing it may make a difference, but I'm not a rocket scientist, so I can't say. During the summer, I disconnect the two heater hoses at the firewall and connect the two hoses directly together so the recommended bypass is still functioning, however, no water is circulating thru the heater core. Removing the Zips riser and drilling the lower hole on the passenger side may not work. I would imagine that the riser flange in that area may be solid aluminum, if so, in addition to drilling a horizontal hole, you may have to also drill a vertical hole to connect it to the coolant flow. From what I have gathered from other forums discussing this issue, having the holes drilled in the thermostat flange serves the same function as having this bypass hole connected to the water pump.
My heater is plumbed in the "traditional" fashion. LOL The old style heads have no provision for a fitting. Manifold fitting is right beside the sender in the intake runner. Sounds like your system is doing the same thing as mine. I am like you as I cannot believe the coolant cools down as fast as it does. I am running Classic Inst. in mine, yours? D
I'm running a Zip's with the 6 cyl. aluminum HD for AC water pump from Auto Zone as recommended by the late Deuce Roadster. Using late heads with the bypass hose as shown on Zip's instructions above. With a SW direct reading gauge and a drilled 180* thermostat,and you can't make it run hot, plus there's no weird fluctuations in gauge readings. If you can find a damaged and discarded early head and see if there's room to drill the outlet in yoursthe same as yours in someone's scrap pile, it might be wise to saw it open at the spot where later head have the drilled and tapped water outlet and check for room and sufficient "meat" to drill and tap yours.
Vortec motors don't have that hole. With out that hole and no bypass hose the coolant in the block will not circulate until the thermostat opens. You need this hose or a heater system if you do not have that hole https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/att...1413725507-98-vortec-questions-bbc-bypass.jpg
Well, I have a heater plumbed in the way they used to be before the hole in the head was invented. My thought on this is that the lack of circulation through that passage may be causing a hot spot at the #2 cyl. and since that is where the coolant runner is that contains the sender, it may be causing the problem. I can drill the riser out and then go in from the bottom of the riser boss and drill to make that passage connect and then plug that hole. There has to be a fix for this and I really don't want to drill the head to do it. D
My by pass hose is hooked up to the rf hole on the intake. 330hp vortec crate in my '32 roadster. . When in a parade or equivalent in hot weather will go to about 210. Can bring it right down by reving in neutral. I worried about it for a while but decided it was OK. although my other cars don' t go over 185. I did drill a 1/8 hole in my 180 thermostat, but cant say it did anything.
No, the bypass hole is in the lower portion of the riser or the stock pump. This will all be done with the riser off of the car. D
https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/zips-water-pump.751509/ Review this previous thread concerning this same topic. Post #30 by Johnny Gee suggests as an alternative you could install a thermostat riser and plumb the heater hose to this location on the intake. This would just be a work around for the older cylinder heads that do not have the outlet port between the 6 & 8 cylinders. In theory it would create the needed bypass route, just create more of a hose routing issue, of course, having the available room to install this scenario may be a problem for some applications. Plumbing the heater to the RF intake water port I believe is only seeing hot water after the thermostat opens, which is not creating the required coolant bypass the riser instructions indicate is needed. I've run mine both ways, intentionally, with and without the correct bypass. My experience is, without the bypass you may see the temp spikes off and on, mostly at idle speed on very hot days, the temperature gauge is telling you its about to overheat, but in reality its fine, and everything goes back to normal once you get moving and get the water pump speed up. The Zips system works fine, it's just different!
The big passages in the pump to the block water flows in so for the water to get out is what the small hole in the block is for it goes into the inlet side of the pump. This allows water to circulate in the block when the thermostat is closed. With out that hole you need a route for the water. A bypass hose from the intake manifold to the pump or heater plumbing will supply that route. When the thermostat opens the radiator is that route.
Pics of my setup. No room for the stat riser, had to shave some off the top of the housing to get it under the carb. Looks like I have a leak at the shutoff. It never ends........D
I will add my 2 cents. I drill and tap the bleeder screw hole on top of the Zips housing at 1/8 inch pipe thread. Then I run a constant bleeder hose into the top of the upper radiator hose. You could put a bung in the radiator if you want to. My temp never varies. I have cured several of these problems this way and my friends do the same. Try it.
I'm not understanding how that is going to work as you are totally bypassing flowing coolant though the block and head and just circulating the coolant in the radiator until the thermostat opens. The aforementioned bypass hoses or running it though the heater circulates the coolant though the block an heads with the thermostat closed but doesn't send it to the radiator. The heater acting as a radiator if it is connected. If you just run the heater hose from manifold or head back to the pump it doesn't do a lot of cooling but does keep the coolant moving. There are some heater control valves that while a bit ugly do acts as a heater bypass when you shut the heat off and the coolant continues to flow. This isn't just an issue with the V8 with or without the Zips riser though as my 48 with the 250 did the same thing in that at a light the temp rose and as soon as the rig was moving the temp dropped right back down. I figured it was lousy air fflow the fan I have on it though. More of a ricky racer drag race fan than a cruise in traffic fan.
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