I have a 36 ford w/ lincoln front brakes. I'm concerned about really good stopping ability and was wondering if it is possible to put a disc set up on the front? Still want to keep the wide 5 wheels. I have a 39 M/C , that would prolly have to change to some sort of a dual M/C w/ proportioning valve. Front spindles are 36. Change those out as well to 37/40 type then any aftermarket disc assembly. Then some sort of narrow 5 to wide 5 adapter plate. Am I thinking this through properly or am I missing a step of the swap or unavailable parts to make this happen? Thanks all! JM
Disc will move the wheel outwards, and even more with adapters. This compromises proper front end geometry. An imaginary line through the centerline of the kingpin needs to intersect the pavement "under" the tire. Yours will be far inside of the tire which causes incorrect scrub radius, increased wear to tires, kingpins, tierods and box. As you hit a pothole or manhole, that wheel gets yanked outwards violently. The increased shock may even loosen the hidden adapter bolts. back to "really good stopping ability"; once the tires are locked up in panic, your stopping is limited to tire patch, so a skinny tire defeats high performance brakes. If you had excellent drums with brake shoes that fit the radius of the drum perfectly, you can get good brakes by adding a power brake booster if you want less foot effort. I thought I saw that ECI once had an inline booster, not sure. .
I second that, you won't get better braking if the tires won't allow it. See what you can do about making your existing brakes more efficient. Seat the shoes on the drums, keep them properly adjusted, and I think you'll be satisfied with the results.
The ability to "slide" tires is a very poor way to evaluate a brake system, as deceleration decreases once the tire looses traction, along with vehicle control. Keeping the brakes from locking and preventing/minimizing fade is the advantage of a disc over any drum brake, regardless of the type of tire.
While you took the time to demean my comments, I noticed you did not offer your ability to suggest a disc setup that will work with what he wants to use, without negative changes to proper steering geometry. please share your comments .
I've never seen a disc brake setup with the wide 5 hub, one could be made I bet. You need it for the front only? You'd need to find a set of the 2pc hubs so you can seperate the drum from the hub and then machine the hub for a rotor. Caliper brackets for the spindle are available so it'd be a question of mounting the rotor to the hub at the right distance. It'd be a tidy piece of work. Probably have to add a ring so the studs pushed thru and the ring would have the meat for the rotor attachment - thinking out loud. That way the wheel and brake share a common mount, the hub would support the weight and not be the braking carrier. Edited thought, Marty Strode has probably done this with some of his early circletrack cars, shoot him a PM - he goes by his name on here.
The OP stated he wants really good stopping, (when he already has the best drum brakes!) and only a disc will achieve that. Whether he can retain his wide 5 wheels is something that has to be investigated, but there are several disc kits for the early Ford spindles that don't affect steering geometry enough to be a problem, or corrected with a custom back space on the wheel. I didn't "demean" your comments-I simply corrected your assumption that tire choice outweighs a better braking system. JFYI, I'm running 500/525 x 16 Firestiones on the front of my avatar with disc/drum brakes and have never slid the tires in over 15,000 miles, (and several panic stops) as the car's brake performance is very good, and much better than I expected with bias tires.
Lincoln 12" self-energizing brakes should put you through the windshield when set up correctly. There are several factors involved for correct setup. 1 - The brake shoes MUST be arch-ground to exactly fit the brake drums. If this is not done there will not be full contact between the shoe and drum and sub-standard braking will result. 2 - These brakes have adjustable shoe anchors (the large stud at the top of brake plate) that must be adjusted correctly so that the brake shoes are exactly centered in the brake drum. If this is not correct the shoes will only contact the drum on the heel or toe and sub-standard braking will result. 3 - The clearance between the shoes and the drums must be correct. If the clearance is too big then applying the brakes will take too long of a pedal stroke. If the clearance is too small then the brakes will be too touchy and the shoes may drag on the drum. If all of these are correct then the Lincoln brakes should stop your '36 Ford as good as you will ever need.
As far as adaptation, '36 spindles are a problem. They have a unique spindle snout length, not shared with other years. I'd tune the existing brakes.
I think there is something missing here. As others have posted, those brakes should be more than adequate if everything is right. Are the drums new (or how far out are they?)? Were the shoes arced to the drums? Is the linkage correct (did you use a '39 pedal assay, which is not necessarily a good idea, or just fab something)? How and where do the brakes seem to not meet your expectations? Don't get me wrong, disc brakes are great if: 1) You need to stop several times in a row from 100MPH, 2) You need to drive through deep water that will flood your brakes, 3) You are towing something very heavy, 4) You are going down a long steep grade. If none of these situations apply you might be just as well off with drum brakes. Charlie Stephens
Just a quick note- Girlfriends Dad has a 46 Lincoln, when he registered it he took it thru the state inspection line. When they tested the brakes they told him to hit the brakes, he did and they yelled at him as they stopped so well they thought he would damage their test setup. I prefer disc brakes but Lincoln brakes will stop you just fine!
That is correct, they wont fit 36 spindles. 36 spindles have the smaller bolt pattern on the backing plate and the length of the stub is a bit different. The drum on a 36 hub is inboard 7/8" compared to the 37. I have been putting all my efforts into my Willys 4x4 Disc brake kit that fits with stock 16" wheels, but I am now working on my International KB that I will be using wide fives and disc brakes on. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/international-kb-7-chop.989019/ This forces me to work on the wide five disc brake kit. It will use the two piece front hub with an adapter to attach the rotor to it, I have this part worked out but am still looking for the best caliper to use. I have gone through many calipers an either they are either too small of bore, too bulky or in need of a caliper bracket that is too complicated. If anyone has a suggestion on caliper to use I am open to any thoughts. The rotor is 1.02 thick so the caliper needs to be close to this.
Not yet as I shifted my focus to a remote fill dual circuit master cylinder kit. Now that that is done I can get back to the disc brake kits.
Wonder would it be possible to machine off the drum part of the 36 hub so the hub ends up with a flat rear surface like the piece arrowed blue. Then use a 55willys rotor adapter as in POST#20 the piece arrowed red .
The 36 drum sits 7/8" further inboard and you will not have enough room between the rotor bolts and spindle bolts, plus it will run into the steering arm as well. You will need to use 37-40 or 41-48 spindles and 37-39 wide five two piece hub. You could possibly machine a one piece hub but I the stud hole size varied on these.
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