Event Coverage WISCONSIN FENDERLESS HOT RODS & WISDOT

I live in WI., I have a hot rod, 31 Model A with an original title, I also have a "street legal" 70 Camaro funny car, the FC is registered (WI) as an assembled vehicle, no wipers, no bumpers etc., wondering how my summer will go with the police, crazy laws!!

 

Here in lies the problem. If you make a trip through the Dodgeville area, your time might be up right then and there, if you encounter the wrong WSP officer.

Good or bad, you need to push your Legislators to pass a bill with specific guidelines (if you talk with them 1st, there is a better chance for a favorable bill). Then everyone knows what is legal and what is not. At least then if some renegade police officer in some small berg writes you up, there will be a legal guideline to work with. Gene

 

^^ Referring to Old wolf ^^
That’s been obvious for quite some time now.

 

The problem, for the time being, is JUST some RENEGADE members of the WISCONSIN STATE PATROL.......no problems with the County Sheriffs or the City Police Departments, that WE are aware of!

 

Attention all Wisconsin owners of original metal body and frame fenderless cars!!!
here is a post of mine from May 12, 2019, post #166 on
https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/posts/13055914/

"The first guy, Mark, in Dodgeville, Wis. ticketed for the same violation “no fenders” was driving his metal body model A Ford on a boxed model A frame Wisconsin titled as a 1931 Ford with annual plates.

The second guy, Brad, getting the ticket was driving a 3 window coupe, Wisconsin titled as a 1932 Ford with annual registration. He has gone to Court with a "not guilty" plea. Court trial date to be determined.

Some people believe the original A bodied car without fenders has preference over a repro 32 body or frame without fenders as viewed by WSP for fender violations. The same WSP trooper ticketed both vehicles and wasn’t concerned about metal or glas, old or new."

That post was on the thread focusing on Dodgeville Brad's situation.

Here is the rest of the story on the original metal body and frame of the model A. Mark refused to put fenders on the model A and WISDMV suspended his registration! He was informed by WSP to install fenders, contact WSP after fender installation for a reinspection. He installed small trailer fenders on the model A, called for his reinspection, WSP reinspected and passed the model A with the installed fenders. The WSP Inspector decided the original Ford model A serial # did not meet WSP criteria and informed WISDMV to assign a 17 digit VIN to the model A.

So much for the the original metal body and frame free pass theory. An original model A title and serial # free pass is questionable.

It is important to note the WSP Inspector was fully aware of the original metal body and frame. The Inspector did not make any allowances or exemptions for the original metal body.

If you believe your original metal body rods are safe from WSP's misinterpretation of Statute and Code and your registration is safe, read the above story a few times.

Remember properly titled and registered fenderless hot rods have been running on Wisconsin roads for 40+ years, no laws have been changed, what's changed?

Future "traditional" hot rod builders, build away but driving in Wisconsin, not so much?

Curt R

 

What did the WSP/DMV use to determine the "Manufacture" date of Brad's 32?? Reg is clear in that anything after 1950 must be equipped as required by the statue. I would also say that the WSP, in issuing future citations, could state "pre-1950 originally manufactured vehicles were equipped with hoods, fenders etc"... This is going to need both good Attorneys, and a Legislature that understands the ramifications of potential financial loss to constituents who elect them, to clarify and correct their "handshake and wink" regs.

 

I did read in the stats that a vehicle purchased in a different state (jurisdiction) that was legally titled and registered and met the criteria of the state of Wi.... unless in violation of stat 347.??
I am sure that Mark with, original tin and title, didn't want to pull the body so WSP could look at the number. Mine is buried under the left cowl section. Who runs DMV is it WSP???

 

Lots of fenderless hotrods have been on Wisconsin roads legally for the last 4 decades. Far from rare up here. Curt, how was Marks car tagged, Hobbyist or Standard plates. I would think that would make a big difference. With standard plates I'm not trying to fit my car into their Hobbyist, Homemade, Reconstructed criteria, it's now just an old car with plates. Or is the WSP trying to fit a car with standard plates into the Hobbyist, Homemade, Reconstructed criteria ?

 

@Curt R and the rest of the Wisconsin Hot Rodders, do we need to formalize our plan of attack? Each of us doing our own thing individually we may lose out. Our power will be in an organized group that engages SEMA, NSRA, MSRA, etc and then collectively challenge the DMV and WSP. I am more than willing to host a group to organize a plan or propose a strategy, etc.

 

The actual Arkansas law does require tarping if load is higher than 6 inches below bed sides

27-35-110. Spilling loads on highways prohibited Covers required for loads of sand, gravel, and rock Exceptions. (a) No vehicle shall be driven or moved on any highway unless the vehicle is so constructed or loaded as to prevent any of its load from dropping, sifting, leaking, or otherwise escaping therefrom. (b) Sand may be dropped for the purpose of securing traction, or water or other substance may be sprinkled on a roadway in cleaning or maintaining the roadway. (c) For a motor vehicle or a trailer with an open bed manufactured after September 30, 2001, no sand, gravel, or rock shall be transported on the paved public streets and highways of this state in a motor vehicle or trailer with an open bed unless the open bed is securely covered with a material which will prevent the load from dropping, sifting, leaking, or otherwise escaping there from. The cover shall be securely fastened to prevent the covering from becoming loose, detached, or in any manner a hazard to other users of the highway. (d) For a motor vehicle or a trailer with an open bed manufactured on or before September 30, 2001, a vehicle with an open bed transporting sand, gravel, or rock is required to be covered as prescribed in subsection (c) of this section unless six inches (6) of freeboard is maintained at the perimeter of the load within the open bed of the vehicle or trailer carrying the load. Measurements are to be taken at the perimeter of the vehicle's or trailer's bed and measured from the top edge of the bed down to the sand, gravel, or rock being transported.

 

Milner ran fenders and he's the king.

 

OK Boys let's stay on track!

Milner is a fictional character, trailers aint fenders, Arkansas is not Wisconsin and Ayn Rand doesn't have the power of the pen anymore.

I support the OP and will be sure to not spend any of my money in Dodgeville.

 

I suggest you start a petition and begin collecting signatures that can be presented to the local and state elected representatives, prosecutors and administrators (that's all 3 branches). They understand the impact on their chances to be elected/re-elected. They know that each signature probably represents as many as 10 constituents who haven't signed but who do vote come election time. Many of the local and county official positions are won and lost by as little as 50 votes. Believe me, they know how to do the math. If this is mostly a local issue at this time, all it may take is for the prosecutor to squash it at its source, which is the couple of overzealous officers on the street. If that happens, the state "inspectors" will get the message on which way the wind is blowing for them, too.

I've personally never been involved with a petition other than occasionally signing one so I don't have first-hand knowledge of the mechanics of starting one. Actual, physical signatures can be collected at car shows, for example, from car owners and from the general public who are fans and friendly to the idea of preventing the persecution of fenderless vehicles. But with the internet, e-mail, etc., "signatures" can be also collected electronically simply by sending the link to lists of owners, car clubs, related businesses and suppliers, etc. and ask that it be passed along.

 

Wisconsin lets dump trucks run without mudflaps. They also let ATVs and UTVs run on almost every road and as far as I know there is no fender requirement.

 

The State Patrol doesn't care about safety, despite their claims to the contrary. Have you ever thought about what sense it makes to "protect public safety" by pulling you over on the Interstate to give you a ticket for 73 in a 70 mph zone -- or a ticket for not wearing your seatbelt, or an expired tag. The hazard presented by the traffic stop is far greater than the violation being ticketed. It's about revenue.

It's also confusing for some of these officers to give them any exceptions to consider in the discharge of their duties. They like things in black and white. Right or wrong, no inbetween. They tell you that right to your face. "It's not up to me, argue with the judge." That makes them automatically right in any situation.

 

Its short notice,but the Iola Wi. car show is coming up.Great place to have a information booth about whats going on.If a few thousand car show fans contacted their elected offcials all at once it might open their eyes.Thats what its going to take.Squeaky wheel gets the grease.

 

Sadly it plays out like a scene from Star Trek -

Playing the part of the Borg Individual Borg (WISDOT) rarely speak, though they do send a collective audio message to their targets, stating that "Resistance is Futile, generally followed by a declaration that the target in question will be assimilated.

What it boils down to as big brother is trying to quash our freedoms and protect us from ourselves. HRP

 

A Boner, I could "Show you what I have done" but for the time being please accept that I have been speaking with a contact from the Wisconsin Specialty Vehicle council, Madison division. That gentleman has copies of "What I have done" and has spoken with me in great length. Curt R is a close associate of his. I am now very active in my attempt to save my own build and my desire to drive it. I'll share if i'm prompted to by the Wisconsin Specialty Vehicle Council.

 

I will send you a pm July 4 or 5. Thank you.
Curt R

 

Curt, If I can help, I'll do what I can.

 

Dude that's a great way to get this thread and yourself booted from here. Keep the politics to yourself, this is about old cars, contacting people in state with political ties is part of the solution. Giving your personal views about politics in general is not

 

WSP has not indicated the 32 to be a homemade/reconstructed/replica/street modified and they have given no reason for not classifying it as street modified.

Homemade/reconstructed/replica/street modified are termed "title brands" by WISDMV.

I understand the use of generic terms (classification). When discussing things with any government agency they have certain terms. I had to learn their specific descriptive terms and legal speak so I use those terms by necessity not to confuse you or anyone else.

WISDMV issues titles and license plates, they assign the "title brand".

WSP does vehicle equipment inspections. When WSP's gets involved in the "title brand" process there have been disagreements between the two agencies about the "title brand" assigned to a vehicle by WISDMV.

There have been stories of WSP roadside stops of hot rods or modified vehicles, during the stop WSP runs a computer check of the vehicle registration and how the title is branded. If WSP disagrees with the "title brand" sometime after the roadside stop WSP informs WISDMV to send a letter informing the vehicle owner to contact WSP for another vehicle inspection or WSP will tell WISDMV to suspend the vehicles registration and notify the owner to contact WSP for a vehicle inspection. These inspections are performed by specially trained Inspectors.

Unfortunately the vehicle owner is in the middle of a disagreement between two State agencies.

Curt R

 

WSVC does not have a defense fund.

I don't know about WCCA. I have been told WCCA is advising people contacting them about the "fender" issue to contact me. Previously I had informed WCCA of this issue, they thanked me for the info. Their was no discussion or offer a defense fund.

Resolving Brad's problem thru the judicial system will be expensive. He's a two job working guy so he does not have deep pockets. Any financial help going his way would be great.

Curt R

 

I spoke with my fellow WSVC member from Madison about "what you have done", good work. You current activity is most appreciated as will be your future activity.
Curt R

 

I'm thinking our hobby is in the hands of "OUR" Politicians.......voting is how we can influence the direction "things" go! No hobby=no H.A.M.B.!

 

Maybe a rally of all the fenderless hot rods in Wisconsin should descend on the capitol while they're in session, with the news media in tow. Valid plates or not. When you have two cars that look all but identical but one is legal and one isn't, their explanations will ring hollow. They rarely like the spotlight in these circumstances...

 

Sir, It is my pleasure to assist.

 

Has brad already had his day in court?

got to post #1 of this thread
Curt R

 

general info

Brad is sorting out how to deal with the entire situation. Putting in a wiper and inside rear view mirror will be done. Fenders, hood and bumpers? If he wanted that type of hot rod, he would have bought one.

I have been in discussion with the SEMA Legislative staff. SEMA supports our efforts, have offered valuable advice and info.

NSRA and Goodguys have been informed of the "fender" situation. No direct involvement has happened or have we requested their help , yet. Neither organization has a legislative branch etc.

Thank you to all those posting to any of the three threads. Both positive or negative posts show concern and interest. Many suggestions have been added to my list of "good ideas".

a boner is our special guy and friend as well as milwscruffy. Thanks guys.

Big thanks to the HAMB and the moderators for letting these "fender" threads keep rolling.

Every one have a safe and Happy Independence Day!!!

Curt R