Customs Wiring question: Headlights as turn signals? Or: How to keep the smoke inside the wires with this?

Okay. I had a brainstorm. What if, if I had some magic combination of relays, extra wires, duct tape, some free time, could I make the headlamps in my Riviera function as the turn signals? There's gotta be a way that I can do this and not have to mount some funky lights behind the grill of this thing...

 

Was told by Highway Patrol here that wasn't an option for me. They wouldn't pass it on inspection and car would be parked. Also, I would be concerned about John Q. Public not understanding them since no other car does it.
SPark

 

I totally get that, but...: In the case of the Riv, behind those grills is where they were originally, and, the car doesn't have to be inspected, so, I am prepared to be a scofflaw for the sake of style. ;-)

 

do you want them to work at night, too?

The circuitry is pretty easy, just use a SPDT relay to switch one beam of the headlight bulb (Common relay contact) so it either gets power from the headlight dimmer switch (using the relay Normally Closed relay contact), or from the turn signal switch (preferably through a voltage dropping resistor, so it's not so bright)(using the relay Normally Open relay contact).

 

A long time ago, I built some adjustable head light bulb holders, and moved the headlights in there.

I made a slot grille to exactly match the pod grilles.

I think I have the CAD files, and some pictures.

 

Could you open up the fake slots in the lower pieces and put some amber turn signals behind them? I think the headlights flashing will be confusing to others who will just think you are flashing your headlights at them and have one side burned out. I really think the fronts should be amber, might even be the law they have to be in some areas. Pretty sure they have to be amber on trucks.

 

there exist headlight reflector assemblies with built-in secondary lamp holders for turn signals etc.

also, turn signal logic is a bit more complicated than you'd think:

* in day time you'd wanna flash the headlights ON to blink.
* at night you'd wanna flash the headlamps OFF to blink. which also ruins
your visibility and signals weirdness to oncoming drivers.

(you could do all of the above logic with only two relays, SPDT. one would "invert" the blink meaning to be either on (when headlamps are off) or off (when headlamps are on).

also also, headlamp filaments are fairly hefty, so on/off time is SLOOOOW... typical turn signal on and off times are about 300 - 500 milliseconds so they wouldn't blink as crisply as a small lamp or big LED.

 

I seem to recall that there was a federal? law requiring front turn signals to be amber starting with the 1962 model year.

But we can do whatever we damn please with our hot rods and customs.

 

I don't like the idea of having the headlights flash at all. That would mess with already confused drivers and probably get a nice fat fix it ticket to boot.
Is there room to fit an amber bulb behind the lens cover?

 

Stock, non opening pods have room in them for a turn signal.

There are H4 headlight bulbs, and turn signals in there.

 

You can get away with 2 relays on the common ground wire of each headlight.

The normally closed position of the relay provides ground and the open position activated by the turn signal via an electronic flasher will break the ground circuit.[causing the individual headlight to flash]





The problem with this, is you'll need to have the lights switched on all the time
or some way to power the headlight when using the indicators and the lights off

 

man that grille/nose is super sanitary; i see why you don't wanna other stuff visible. it's beautiful.

this might work for you: https://vwparts.aircooled.net/7-H4-Halogen-Diamond-Cut-Headlight-Assembly-PAIR-p/ch6024ta.htm

 

What if there is an accident? I can just hear the other party's lawyer now. I sure miss the days when engineers designed cars and not lawyers.

Charlie Stephens

 

I honestly had no idea there were 5" (or whatever the exact size is) Hi-Lo bulbs with LED turn signals built in, so my question was answered with that news! I might add some "clear to amber" dual element bulbs on the core support behind the grill too, but you all had good points about using the headlights themselves as turn indicator lights. Thanks.

 

No, no, no! See the blanked-out area at the bottom of the fender lamp grille casting? Replace that with the turn signal assembly from a 1965 (not 63-64) Riviera. Buick already solved your problem. It will look good and be legal.

 

There you go! The factory already beat me to that idea!

 

Those interchange? The light towers are different for the clamshells, but it's worth a look...

 

Always remember, people are idiots. If something works differently than they're used to they need to actively think to understand it, and, well, idiots don't think so they won't understand anything they don't expect. Automotive lights working in a way they're not used to falls under this, people are not used to it so they won't understand the meaning, possibly leading to an accident.

Don't force people to think in safety related situations, they suck at it. Make sure they can keep going on auto pilot.

 

FYI, ‘65 park lamp housings DO NOT interchange with the earlier lower grill housings. So that’s not an option.


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So, back to my idea.....can you open up the fake slots on the ones you have? You wouldn't have to open up all of them, just say an area in the center maybe 2" or 3" square to let the light show through from the back.

 

This is the answer right here^^^^^^^^^^

 

That is what I think I’ll end up doing. A diamond cut off wheel should be just right.


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I think so, it’ll take a steady hand...


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I approve of this message.

 

Remember, oncoming drivers are going to be weirded out already because your headlights are behind those grills... You won't look like a 'normal' car. Start blinking them or add colored lights in them, they'll think you're a flying saucer or something. And I don't see the fuzz being amused with any of this....

 

I would use a drill to make a bunch of holes and a flat file to finish it out if the cutoff wheel is too risky and unstable. Just a thought.

 

From 5 feet away, with the lights on the grills are invisible. '65 Rivieras have the lights in the exact spot. The original park lamps and blinkers are in the exact spot. So, GM built them this way. Honestly, I don't see why the "fuzz" would be concerned about headlights, park lamps, turn signals, in a stock location.
I've decided to try bulbs with LED turn signals and park lamps built in. We'll see if they're bright enough to be noticed over the headlights. If not, I'll put clear to amber lights behind the grill on the core support where they'll be (nearly) invisible with the lights off. I think cutting out the grill back on the lower tower covers is not going to work with my clumsy fingers...

 

Because they're not operating 'as stock'... DOT regs allow for 'concealed' headlights, BUT require that the 'concealment' SHALL 'retract' out of the way when the lights are in use. Which the OEM install on the '65 Rivs did; when the lights were turned on, the 'grills' opened like a clamshell and retracted into the fenders, fully exposing the headlights. Your grills are fixed.... so fail to meet DOT regulations. Plus upsetting the photometrics of the headlights, reducing light on the ground. I'm sure there'll be some 'light scatter' involved too, which may or may not be a hazard to oncoming drivers.

How local LEOs view this will be up to them, but get the 'wrong' cop and you'll get a ticket for this...

 

This one has been rolling around in the back of my mind since the OP. That bottom third of the headlight dingus is just crying out for illumination. (The area below the bumper.) It looks good in the daylight but less so at night. If there was a way to open the "grill" up to match the top 2 thirds, they make these LED bulbs for turn signals that are normally white when on but alternate from white to amber for turn signals, no "dark" in between blinks. It sounds like a lot of work but I think it would turn out very cool.

 

Do the cutting from the back side. If it's the typical OEM casting, you should be able to see the part you want to remove as it'll be raised on the back. Some careful work with a die grinder and touch-up with a small flat file should do it without boogering the chrome in front.