Technical Pie Cutting 29 Coupe into Roadster, will it work ?

Hey Guys.

Last year I purchased a collection of 28/29 Model A parts, that included a beat up set of coupe quarter panels, roadster cowl and doors, fibreglass decklid, grill shell plus various floor panels.

For the last year my intention has been to piece it altogether on a decent rolling frame and sell it off. There have been two things stopping me from doing this and that is what body style I should build it as and a lack of funds.

I was going to put it together as a sports coupe until I realised the closed cowl I purchased was twisted and the doors that came along with it were cut down, scratch that idea.

My next thought was doing it as a roadster, since original roadster quarter panels are next to non existent in my part of the world and I can’t afford Brookville ones, that cancelled that option, so I looked at fabricating my own, I have all the equipment, but I lack the skill levels at the moment, so that cancelled that idea out.

My next option was doing it as a Roadster Pickup, the panels are relatively easy to fabricate, but the biggest hurdle is the bed, especially fabricating a tailgate, so I have gone cold on that idea. Keep in mind even if I could afford repro panels to complete any of these bodies I would be paying 30 percent more, due to our low dollar, not to mention import taxes and freight, forget it.

After talking to a guy on the phone about buying some cheap engine blocks, he asked me what I was doing with the blocks and I told him I was piecing a roller to sell off. I mentioned it was going to be A Roadster Pickup, and the discussion went around around to what would be most likely to sell.

Of course coupes and roadsters top the list so I am back to square one. Out of the two, the roadster seems to be the most easy to put together. I thought about the parts I purchased last year, the guy was trying to turn it into roadster but gave up and sold it to me.

As the coupe quarter panels are taller and shorter lengthwise than roadster ones, I knew I would have to re-work the upper part of the quarters so they would take the shape of roadster ones, at first I thought of cutting them off and re-welding them into place, but realised what a nightmare that would be, then I had another idea.

How about pie cutting about a third of the way up, along the bottom edge of the belt line to the B pillars. With this section removed, the quarter panels could be brought down to the height of the roadster doors.

I know it’s not as simple as it sounds, but compared with my other options, it’s my best hope. I am just wondering if anyone has used this technique to change thier coupe quarters into roadster ones ? Or will I be going going into the unknown with this.

Any feedback is appreciated.

 

The beauty of hot rodding and customising is the freedom to think outside the box. The only rule is there are no rules. Sure we have a tradition direction to adhere to but plenty of knowledge and prior thought, a good eye and a steady hand and you should be able to do it. Just remember you aren’t locked in to it having to be exactly the same. The difference might just be what sets it apart instead of making it the same.

 

Sure it's a challenge and your the sculptor...there is one thread that comes to mind an albeit it's a custom this fella continues to fabricate a rolling, drivable, art piece...so yeah go for it...after all it's the Jalopy Journal.

Some inspiration to get in the slice and dice mode...

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/new-member-watch-me-section-my-desoto.1024562/

 

I am sure you're aware but if your not what your proposing to do would be a coupster and it's probably been done as many times as old cars have been made into rolling open flatbeds around the farm. Type in coupster in search and there will be many threads.

Metal working is learning curve stuff but theres lots of threads on that too. Be careful welding and fabbing is a serious business. Wear your safety shit...

 

It certainly won’t be the same, the doors will be the same length as coupe doors for more room.

 

This is a well known discussed benefit or plus for a coupster based Hotrod...the
Windshield dash area and of course the curved area at the back package tray area is where extensive rework occurs to mimic the roadster.

 

Here's a really nicely done Coupster/Coupester...yours is 29 but the principle is the same.

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/1930-coupster.959503/

 

Removing that section in your drawing won’t work,you would have to continue the cut right down to the bottom of the quarter otherwise it would distort and pucker out at the end of your cut.

 

you can't bend a fiberglass trunk to match the new curve of the quarters

 

...looking at these two subjects I don't see why it would require anything more than the adding of the cap or roll at the top of the quarters and doors wrapping around the back and from the door to dash area to match the true roadster. This of course is still a challenge but totally doable.

 

I agree with stogy,
a buddy makes me coupester door tops, or caps... hammerformed, they are slightly wider than roadster as the coupe doors are thicker... I narrow the A and B door jams to look more roadsteresque…. also the A pillar left to right... I narrow front to back and tilt the A pillars back 10*… I use the leftover caps to make the top of the quarter match the door...
I use the coupe doors and quarters as this keeps the body the same length...
'32 cowlvent as the windshield won't swing out...

 

pic of a "'28 Cabbie" built 2 years ago from tudor / sportie parts…

 

Its one of those things that once you start mocking it up it'll tell you what it needs. I built a coupster in my 20s from coupe cowl and doors and Chevy rear quarters. Wasn't the best car but it was fun

 

It could be done as many have mentioned but the cut would have to come all the way down to the rear of the quarter panel under the belt line or else the belt line on the quarter will have a distinct kink where you show the pie cut stopping in the drawing you did. To me it would be easier to add a cap to the door so it matches the quarter. Anything can be done. The question is if you are doing this just to flip it why bother? If your doing it because you always wanted a roadster and have limited funds, thats a different story.

 

Option #1) I'd personally keep the Roadster cowl and doors then start building a rolling chassis while I'm raising $$$ for a set of Brookville Roadster quarters. Start by unloading the non roadster panels; closed cowl, doors, Coupe quarters. That should get you one quarter. Now start selling off other extra parts and shit hanging around the shop. Go on a budget, quit dining out (cook your own food). Don't hire out anything around the house. Do some overtime or side work, all while staying home and working on the chassis (staying home keeps your money in your pocket). You'll be surprised how quickly the saved money will pile up.
Yes, your dollar is weak and shipping is a bitch, but that goes for anyone down under that will be buying your roller so it should bring a higher price. You'll have more in it but will get more out of it (more than a RPU or Coupster). It'll be a true Roadster without any body surgery. Nobody will question the work you did splicing quarters and doors. It'll be all new from the jambs-back, with original Roadster cowl/doors. Tough to argue with that.

Option #2) Build RPU from the Roadster cowl and doors. All that fab time you propose to modify quarters and doors could be put to building RPU back panel, quarters and bed. Or buy the Brookvile quarters-they're relatively cheap. Buy the Ford script tailgate and bend up the bed sides and front. If you don't have a large enough brake, cut out, bead roll the panels, then mark them for the bends. A sheet metal shop will knock out the bends for a couple hours labor. Weld it up and you're good. Again, all new panels from the jambs-back with original Roadster cowl and doors.

Keep in mind that a buyer shopping for a Roadster is going to be a stickler (Roadster snob-no offense implied) and not be as interested or interested whatsoever in a Coupster, Sport Coupe, Coupe with it's roof lopped off. Whole different level.

 

I've witnessed this kind of dilemma dozens of times over my 70+ years of Hot Rodding. 3 things stand out in your opening post.
(1) and that is what body style I should build it as
(2) and a lack of funds.
(3) I have all the equipment, but I lack the skill levels
These 3 things all add up to your project Dead before you even start. Your other statement is this, quote "For the last year my intention has been to piece it altogether on a decent rolling frame and sell it off" end of quote. The only other thing missing for total disappointment is "I don't have a place to work on it".
I have Never seen this combination of issues turn into anything productive or of value. My advise is to think long and hard and most of all Don't try to Fool yourself into doing something you know you can't get done or turn usable pieces into Scrap Iron. Reality is a Bitch. Disappointing yourself is worse.
The Wizzard

 

I have never seen on of these that diden't look like what it really is "a coupe with the top cut off!"

 

technically it will become a "Coupester"

 

No, technically "Coupester" is a New Gen description for "Look at my Pile of Scrap Iron"! Sawing the roof off a Coupe will never make a Roadster of any value other than to the builder of said Pile. It's just Cheep entertainment for the rest of us.
The Wizzard

 

What you say is true 99% of the time. Here is one of the few exceptions I have ever seen: https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/1930-coupster.959503/ It has the added benefit of longer doors. I only wonder if it would have been easier (and less expensive) to start with a real roadster?

Charlie Stephens

 

Thanks for all the feedback, positive and negative. Pist-N-Broke raises a lot of interesting points that need clarification. Yes a lack of funds and skill level is something working against me, as for body style, this has been decided. That is why I posted this topic, not to see if it’s viable but to see if it’s been done this way, and to go ahead and do it anyway, despite the lack of skill of finances.

Going back to the former, my lack of skill is balanced out through several mentors, I can call on, who all live within a short drive from my home. One has decades of experience restoring and building cars, especially Model As, There is also guy who lives in the next town from me and owns an original Model A Roadster body that I can get all the measurements from.

As far as skill goes,they are all able to offer me plenty of advice, but my best source of learning has been online, The HAMB has been very useful as well as various metal shaping Tutorials on YouTube from the likes of Ron Covell, Lazzie, Iron Trap Garage and Peter Tomassini.

It may seem odd to some that I would spends thousands of dollars in metal shaping equipment before I gain the necessary skills to use them, but this was the only way I would ever get the opportunity to learn. There are no courses available to learn metal shaping in in this part of the world other than the occasional intensive one day seminar.

At four to six hundred dollars a pop, that money is enough to buy me a modest English wheel, bead roller or sheet metal brake, which I have done. Furthermore I have started buying downloadable metal shaping DVDs as well, budget permitting. Again I believe you learn far more by rewatching things than in any one day class, and it’s cheaper in the long run.

The other thing I should point out is that I am not trying to build a cut down coupe, it’s not a true going to be a true roadster either. As desirable as 28/29 Roadsters are, they have many flaws, the short doors for one. The idea is to fabricate a fresh pair of doors, that share the same length as coupe doors and the same height as roadster doors. This is much easier than trying to modify existing coupe or roadster doors. The other way I will be keeping the cost down is through building my own hood and decklid.

I have done several of each now so I am confident enough to do them for this project. I want to sell this off, pay some bills, buy some more equipment and panels and eventually continue on with my couprielet project. It’s small steps, but that is the order of things.

 

And that is my point, most don’t but not all, there was one built over here that looked 100 percent genuine, he used a real roadster cowl and doors, lengthened the quarter panels and reshaped them at the top to bring them into line with the lower roadster doors. It can be done, and as long as the buyer knows that’s what was done there is no issue.

 

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/1930-coupster.959503/

Nobody would actually be doing it to pass it off as a Roadster...it's a form of Jalopy Hotrod. I don't care for Roadsters and prefer a roof over my head but its really no different than making a Fordor a Tudor or a Shoebox Sedan a Convertible. To me there have been many credible variations of standard body styles.​

 

With your burning desire to learn, I would have to say "go for it"! It will be a great learning experience and if the longer doors don't bother you can probably make a pretty decent looking Hot Rod!

 

A bed and a tailgate are probably the easiest thing for you to fab up...vs your other ideas.

 

there is a post or a link to a post about a coupester conversion on here...
they replaced the short above deck panel with the longer roadster panel...
this meant moving the upper quarters forward, removing the extra, and then filling the "gaps"...
they also shortened the cockpit which looks more roadsteresque...

 

Not a Model A Bed, I have looked into this and spoken to a number of metal shops about shaping the sides, even they said it would be difficult. To do it correctly is to use 16 guage sheet metal which is harder to shape especially the swages around the wheel arches and radius along the bottom. The tailgate is equally challenging. The other challenge is sourcing an original bed to get patterns from, these are rare, here and very expensive, nothing is cheap in Australia.

 

I know you are down under, but if it helps I have the front half of a '28-'29 roadster quarter...
free if you can swing the shipping...

 

One of the other considerations for hacking roofs off is also considering the strength lost by removing what was structural support.

You as the fabricator must add support similar to a Factory Roadster or better structural standards for yours and everyone else's safety. There has been and continues to be many hackjobs in the amateur field and that is scary.

So you are in the drivers seat.

Many attempt things and they shouldn't. I farm out a fair bit of what I do as I know what my limits are.

Some here flame those who don't do everything that is their ride. I don't subscribe to this at all...

Do the best you can...and at the very least you will have to certify it via you're Vehicle Inspection which is pretty stringent.

 

Thing is, you're not going to end up "with an original xxxxx"...so you don't have to reproduce something to an exact print.

Have you ever tried to split a 1/4 panel...the butt weld it together?...heck...just grab two pieces of shiny new metal and try it.

I guess if you think you are building something to flip...I can kinda see your point...but you still won't have an "original XXXXX" , so why not build yourself a car/truck/-whatever...you can enjoy and learn some on?

Never heard of someone having a pile of parts and no experience saying "I can make a buck off of this"