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Projects Street rodded ‘40 Ford pickup freshening

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by TudorTony, Sep 29, 2018.

  1. Atwater Mike
    Joined: May 31, 2002
    Posts: 11,625

    Atwater Mike
    Member

    O.K., some real misnomers here: "Frame is '47-'53..." No. It's '47-'52. In '53 they were F100s, and the same frame 'til '56. '53-'56!
    But I salute you for putting the apostrophe first, to omit "19".

    "Ford pickup frames were the same from 1932 to 1941." Nope. 1932 was all alone, '34 and '34 the same, then '35-'41 the same.
    Note the frame pix Mr. '48 Chev posted. Look at the pickup frame, it swoops 'up' where the cab would mount. See the nice bare frame rails? NOW, look at the passenger type in the second pic. Low and swoopy, like it's dropped already. See the pretty 'X' member? And the other Ford armament? I had a 6-71 blown Chrysler in one of those frames, engine was out of Joe Reath's dragster, first one to turn 180 MPH.
    Engine never twisted my '46, but it DID twist the lip of the Santa Clara police that attempted to catch me...
    That was NO 'wimpy' frame.
     
  2. Blue One
    Joined: Feb 6, 2010
    Posts: 11,459

    Blue One
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Alberta

    Finally some corrections :)
     
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  3. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    OK, now that I’ve been properly spanked & I accept the spanking on my lack of detailed knowledge that Mike obviously has (seriously Kudos to Mike!). I’m still trying to figure out the exact yr frame? I can’t see any numbers in places supposed 2 B. Here’s some identifiers, rear gas tank mounted between frame rails seems to fit right w 4 mounting bolts on 2 on each side flanges(pics). Fuel fill on passenger side of tank ( builder put gas fill tub in bed floor). Cab & front Clip mounts lined up with center of clip mounts on outside face of frame rail ( frame dimension 34” outside rail to rail in vicinity of Cab & Clip mounts ). It has I/beam style front suspension w parallel leafs. Also parallel leafs on rear ( frame 34” outside dimension rail to rail in just in front of rear leaf). Steering box while converted to power box seems to utilize stock mounting area just behind radiator on front driver side frame rail.
    What yr frame do u think?
    2AF581D9-2946-4AF3-BCF4-AE08DBBD9EEA.jpeg BBC078C0-5E6B-4F58-AE98-58BCF55FB47F.jpeg 3F00F3A7-6BF3-4103-B73D-A6E2903D7182.jpeg
     
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  4. 34Phil
    Joined: Sep 12, 2016
    Posts: 553

    34Phil
    Member

    Later axles are a couple inches wider so tires sticking past fenders now. I don't think you can lower what you have unless you get some skinny wheels and tires.
     
  5. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    Thx, based on description in my last post trying to determine what yr frame is?
     
  6. eberhama
    Joined: Dec 19, 2003
    Posts: 673

    eberhama
    Member

    40/41's had the gas fill on the left fender, 42-47 are in the cab, and fill on the pass. side. So I'm guessing the tank is a random junkyard unit that happened to fit between the axle and that crossmember. Here is a thread on the ford truck board with a '47 getting torn apart, to compare to.
    https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1556502-help-me-please-47-half-ton.html
     
  7. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    Big help,
    Thx, pics helped!
     
    loudbang likes this.
  8. 42-47 1/2 ton pickup frame
     
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  9. The bed and rear fenders are probably 42-47 also. You can see if the cab is/was, if there is a fuel spout welded up on the drivers side. Also 41-42 had cage nuts on the inner cowl for the fenders to bolt to, 42-47 the fenders "float" and have an odd square that sticks out right in the hood hinge area where the top of the rear fender bolts too. I wonder if that is a 42-47 pickup with a 40 nose stuck on it.
     
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  10. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    Very possible, from all I’ve read/seen so far I’m convinced frame is 42-47. I think the obvious thing is two 5/8”-3/4” holes where the outside steering box once was. Pics on site Eberhama posted showed the steering box & could see the mounting hardware. Builder put power steering box on top of frame behind radiator. If as u suspect the bed & rear fenders are 42-47 bed should be mounted directly to frame & not similar be to 40 as in pic below? upload_2018-10-4_14-49-13.jpeg
     
    loudbang likes this.
  11. 42-47 beds are like 2" wider....you could find measurements for both and find out. Also, the rear fenders are different where they meet the running boards to accommodate the different width of the bed.
     
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  12. Last edited: Oct 4, 2018
  13. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    I’ve been under the car for quite a few hours the last few days. This is where I admit the only relatively easy way to lower a bit is removing the oak mounting spacers. As Cab, bed & front clip R correctly aligned to each other & spacers vary from 3” under the bed & only 1 3/4” under Cab & clip, really could only lower 1 3/4”. Gotta think about whether it’s worth doing so little. Dropping front I beam would lower the front fairly easily but would give the car quite a bit of rake, as truck has a rake already thinking would need to do Both . Having said all that Truck needs wheels & tires & think I can mitigate the look with size & offset, getting the tires under the fenders more & larger diameter tires, 28-30” vs 24” on it now. Don’t have the $, room, equipment or piss & vinegar to switch frames. Maybe if I hit the lottery. Thx for all the suggestions & insight!
     
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  14. Put an F1 dropped axle in it with the springs flipped under the axle and you'll get it down in front, the rear lower it with dearched springs.
     
  15. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    I like the idea 4 the front. Not familiar with de-arched springs 4 rear? Is that a buy or a make?
     
  16. Take the rear springs to a spring repair shop and for about $100 you can have them take the arch (curve) out. Truckers all know where a good spring repair shop is if you don't know of one. You can usually get about 4 or 5 inckes this way. JW
     
  17. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

     
  18. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

  19. I opened this post when it was still on it's first page and after reading I decided "Not" to add anything myself. This was due to good info popo'd off and the O.P. being set on doing things His way. Then the fact a budget appearing to be non existant. Nothing wrong with that, I just didn't want to play. Now your talking about How to drop the back 4" and again it seems to involve $$$. I'll post up a photo so you can see how to do it on a Zero budget unless you can't weld yourself. Just Zoom in and enlarge the photo and focus on the front hanger of the rear spring. You can do that on all 4 corners of your rear springs with the springs and hangers you already have. Can't get any Cheeper than that. You don't even need to remove the bed if you can weld overhead.
    The Wizzard
    20170915_082919.jpg
     
  20. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    Thx
     
    Hot Rods Ta Hell likes this.
  21. BamaMav
    Joined: Jun 19, 2011
    Posts: 6,707

    BamaMav
    Member
    from Berry, AL

    Wish you were closer, I'd love to have those!
     
  22. Hot Rods Ta Hell
    Joined: Apr 20, 2008
    Posts: 4,670

    Hot Rods Ta Hell
    Member

    ^^^^ This for the front, though it looks like you may have oil pan clearance issues?

    Pist N Broke's 4" shackle relocate for the rear.
    It may need 6" which could be accomplished with a rear end housing flip to the top of the springs.

    Personally, with your years of experience as a wrench and machinist and your limited budget, I'd;
    • Pass on pulling the wood blocks. Too much work right now for only a 1 1/2" drop.
    • Flip the front axle to the top of the spring (with maybe a dropped axle) for about 4" drop.
    • Flip the rear housing to the top of the springs for 6" drop. I'd just quickly pull the bed for the rear lowering. No matter which route you go for the rear, you'll probably be in for exhaust and gas tank relocating. Having the gas tank out for safety while cutting/welding is a bonus. You may need to C notch that rather flat frame for clearance (there are simple bolt on frame notch kits available from Bell Tech, etc as used on late model pickups that might be able to be adapted if you're not up to welding).
    • Change out the rolling stock to something more appropriate and that will fit under the fenders. Borrow some wheels for an afternoon and dry fit them to see how close you get to an optimum fit/look.
    • If it's still not low enough, pull the wood blocks this Winter for the additional 1 1/2".
    • Lastly, put the word out for a 35-41 frame. You may luck out and find a Rod shop that's rolling one out from under an old Rod in favor of a new Alston chassis (see this all the time on the TV shows). Typically, it may be boxed, have a dropped axle, disc brakes, V8, etc. It could be a reasonable start to a fresh/budget chassis build for the truck.
     
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  23. I ran a 406 Ford in a 40 ford truck with stock frame and frontend , rearend was an Olds with Chevy parallel leaf springs. only problems I ever had was breaking rear springs and "U" joints, the frame was fine, drove it daily for more than 10 years. No problem Whichever way you go, don't make it a big project at best it's a 2 to 4 week job.
     
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  24. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    Thx, good stuff!
     
  25. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    Got it! Thx
     
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  26. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    Back to the engine: Been tuning replacing periforal engine components that were on the car 23 yrs in the barn storage. Points, plugs, wires, regulator, coil etc. Hadn’t done any cooling system checks till now. Fired it up & let it run for 15 minutes with radiator cap off. No coolant movement & as warmed up water overflowed at cap. Assumed stuck Thermo removed top hose loosening at block first as it came loose bunch of water belched out at thermo side BUT NO THERMO? Guessing blockage some where? Pulled lower hose & rest of water drained from radiator do blockage not there. Coolant looked amazingly good for 23 yrs, still the correct green & pretty clear. Thoughts ideas? I’m thinking water pump froze?
     
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  27. Quote; "Thoughts ideas? I’m thinking water pump froze?". end of Quote. Is there a belt on the pulley and was the pulley rotating? If so how could the Pump be frozen? You ran it for 15 min with the Cap Off? What did your Temp gauge say if there was one?
    The Wizzard
     
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  28. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    Belts all on pulleys & spinning. Shut down @ 200degrees. No water flow? Pressure pushing water out of upper pump intake when removed coupling @ thermo.? Thought blockage might be in radiator decoupled @ lower hose & radiator drained so no blockage there.
     
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  29. What condition is your lower hose in? Is there a Spring inside it? I have seen them suck them self totally closed and stop flow.
    The Wizzard
     
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  30. TudorTony
    Joined: Jun 2, 2013
    Posts: 231

    TudorTony
    Member
    from NJ

    Didn't remove lower hose but it is not collapsed and when the radiator drained it did from that hose. There was something curious I noticed that I didn't think important til you mentioned u've seen debris from the spring & hose breaking down cause issues. On the thermostat seat their the top brass half of the thermostat was there, no bottom portion ie., spring flap mechanism? I didn't think much of it as the coolant was puking out of the top pump mounting face. Thought if it had deteriorated to the point of breaking up would have been blocking the flow and with all the coolant belching out of that orifice didn't think it was a prob. I've seen weird shit people do and thought original owner having overheat probs might have pulled it apart and put the top half in for some extraneous thought process? I'll set up a power flush thru engine and see if I can clear whatever is blocking it. Still thought I'd of seen some agitation looking into the radiator cap while engine running from pump with no thermostat & didn't?
     
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