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Hot Rods Black coolant in a blown hemi

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by moparjimd60, Sep 23, 2018.

  1. moparjimd60
    Joined: Jan 22, 2018
    Posts: 71

    moparjimd60

    Ok I have a question for pro’s
    My 354 hemi new build has 75 miles and cam break in time. Noticed the coolant started out green now is very dark almost black. No water in oil, no smoke out exhaust at all. Not sure what is going on. Any ideas?


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  2. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,931

    squirrel
    Member

    test the cooling system for exhaust gasses?
     
  3. seb fontana
    Joined: Sep 1, 2005
    Posts: 8,442

    seb fontana
    Member
    from ct

    I would drain the system and put straight water in and see what happens..Might be a head gasket leak in to coolant, there is a test or two for that..A Hamber will know and chime in..
     
  4. Atwater Mike
    Joined: May 31, 2002
    Posts: 11,625

    Atwater Mike
    Member

    A good parts house will test the coolant at the radiator with a liquid tester.
    This will denote the presence of carbon monoxide in the coolant.
    Pulled studs, leaking head gaskets: This is why they 'O' ring blocks (or heads, either way) on blown engines that reach high compression 'pressure'...

    I used to simply use the C/O 'sniffer' in the open radiator cap. Of course, this was in 'CALIF', where there is smog...and smog stations!
     

  5. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,931

    squirrel
    Member

    I used to do that too, before my 1970s Sun machine mostly quit working....
     
  6. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 23,263

    gimpyshotrods
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    My money is on head gasket leak.
     
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  7. moparjimd60
    Joined: Jan 22, 2018
    Posts: 71

    moparjimd60

    I don’t disagree but if it were head gasket would I not see signs of it in the exhaust?


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  8. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,931

    squirrel
    Member

    Combustion pressure is higher than cooling system pressure, so if it's a small leak it will let combustion gas into the cooling system, but not let coolant into the cylinder.
     
  9. Rickybop
    Joined: May 23, 2008
    Posts: 9,605

    Rickybop
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    If you have a head gasket leak and there's exhaust pressure going into the coolant, looking down into the radiator through the filler neck, you should see bubbles coming to the surface of the coolant when the engine is running.
    Please be careful when opening the radiator cap.
    Remember that there won't be any flow and no bubbles to be seen until the engine is warmed and the thermostat has opened.
     
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  10. moparjimd60
    Joined: Jan 22, 2018
    Posts: 71

    moparjimd60

    Ok I am going to get a tester this week if it shows head gasket is there a way to tell which side ? Or will I just have to change both?


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  11. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,931

    squirrel
    Member

    if it's a head gasket already, you probably need to change something about how the head gaskets are set up, to make it work properly.
     
  12. moparjimd60
    Joined: Jan 22, 2018
    Posts: 71

    moparjimd60

    Also is there a brand that you guys like ? I have delt with cometic before just wondering if there is a good brand that isn’t 100.00 a side.


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  13. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 23,263

    gimpyshotrods
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    There is no way to tell. Gaskets are sold in pairs. Do both.

    Examine each that comes out carefully. Do not just toss in the new ones. You absolutely must determine the root cause of failure, and rectify it.
     
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  14. moparjimd60
    Joined: Jan 22, 2018
    Posts: 71

    moparjimd60

    Ok I have 1 more piece to add to the puzzle, I changed the starter yesterday and had to drop the header and collected the coolant in a drain pan it was black, today 24 hours later what ever was in it has settled and it’s green again. Does this still fit the head gasket model?


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  15. RichFox
    Joined: Dec 3, 2006
    Posts: 10,020

    RichFox
    Member Emeritus

    I would reread post #3 and do it. Cheap and it might tell you it's something in the coolant from the machine shop.
     
  16. moparjimd60
    Joined: Jan 22, 2018
    Posts: 71

    moparjimd60

    Thanks squirrel for the help, could you please expand on your thought when you say how the head gasket is set up? Such as sealers or the finish on the surfaces?


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  17. squirrel
    Joined: Sep 23, 2004
    Posts: 55,931

    squirrel
    Member

    gaskets, surface finish, studs/bolts, torque, and possibly add metal O rings.
     
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  18. 73RR
    Joined: Jan 29, 2007
    Posts: 7,174

    73RR
    Member

    Flush the cooling system as a cheap first step. Since you did not say anything about elevated water temps I'll assume that the water is just full of crap. Now, if is running 'hot' then the story changes...

    .
     
  19. moparjimd60
    Joined: Jan 22, 2018
    Posts: 71

    moparjimd60

    No it does not run hot, 180 most of the time, and does not build excessive pressure in the system. I spoke to the machinist that did the work on it. He said he had never heard of such but did say it could be residual from the acid dip, he had to dip it more than once to get it clean. He recommended flushing and filling till it clears up.


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  20. Hollywood-East
    Joined: Mar 13, 2008
    Posts: 1,993

    Hollywood-East
    Member

    Since you have the coolant out, flush the engine, if black shit comes pouring out, You got lucky... Easy enough right there..
     
  21. A good way to check for exhaust into the cooling system is to take a bottle that you and see through fill it with water then put the over flow/ vent tube into the bottle of water and run the engine until it gets up to temp. Once at operating temp run at about 1000 to 1500 RPM and look for bubbles in the bottle of water . If you get a few bubbles you should be good if you get lots of bubbles you have compression getting into the cooling system. Hope this helps
     
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  22. Arominus
    Joined: Feb 2, 2011
    Posts: 394

    Arominus
    Member

    Except cometics, they sell individually, my old man made that mistake recently when ordering for his stroked 440, he wasn't thrilled.
     
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  23. moparjimd60
    Joined: Jan 22, 2018
    Posts: 71

    moparjimd60

    Update, looks like I may have dodged a bullet, warmed the old hemi up and stuck the overflow into a bottle of water ran it up about 2000 for about 30 seconds and no bubbles at all ! Guess I will just keep flushing it out till it clears up. Thanks for all the advice and input.


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  24. 19Eddy30
    Joined: Mar 27, 2011
    Posts: 2,314

    19Eddy30
    Member
    from VA

    Not so any more Jimpyhotrod,
    Alot of performance Head gaskets are single packed now $85 up each
     
  25. We use powder cascade to clean out radiator and cooling system, Drain the coolant and fill with just water and the powder cascade then run for a while some times we have to do this a couple of times then flush and run with clean water a couple of times, Don't us liquid dish soap it will foam up and not work under cooling system pressure , good luck with it.
     
  26. moparjimd60
    Joined: Jan 22, 2018
    Posts: 71

    moparjimd60

    That’s awesome, how much powder did you use at one time?


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  27. jimmy six
    Joined: Mar 21, 2006
    Posts: 14,795

    jimmy six
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    When your done, use only distilled water with your antifreeze for the 50-50 mix. Don't know on a hemi but I always drain blocks from the side plugs in the block.
    We can only run water at our racing venue and distilled water stays clean for a season.
     
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  28. we use about 2 cup but that is in a big 12 to 20 Gallon radiator in a tractor or over the road truck.
     
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