Technical Reverse Valve Body Chevy Turbo 400 Question

Reverse Valve Body Chevy Turbo 400 Question?

Ok guys - I've settled on using a TH400 - thanks for all the help! I now have a CAR TH400 scheduled to be rebuilt, and will pick up a CAR driveshaft yoke (anyone have one cheap?)

Next step - should I get a standard valve body or a reverse valve body? The reverse valve body sounds like fun, but will it work with my Hurst Quarter Stick?

Thanks in advance for the input!

 

Really...you're worried about the shifter..?
The mostly obvious answer is no, a reverse valvebody trans. will not work with a standard pattern valvebody shifter..!

Depending on how old the Quarter Stick is, I believe the later ones had changeable plates. If so you just need to buy the corresponding plate.

Otherwise, it's new shifter time.

Mike

 

You typed CAR a couple of times. Is this some kind of beefed up transmission (Art Carr?), or just a run of the mill TH400 from an automobile?

 

Sounds like you've decided on a manual shift VB. Might I ask why?
Your previous post said you will be doing primarily street driving. You never answered what the other percentage would be. I would assume you mean the drag strip...So then what ? Friday night grudge and time trials? Bracket racing?
I supposed you may be bored without that 4 speed. That's all it is.

 

If you are going to shift it manually, why not keep the 4 Speed? If you go with the 400 and are mostly on the street I think you will get tired of the manual reverse body.

 

Thanks for the replies

Like my earlier posts explained, I am new to the concept of an auto in my Gasser. Like the old saying goes - "opinions are like assholes - everybody has one". I already have the Hurst auto shifter, which was given to me a number of years ago by a friend. He originally told me that he used in his drag car, & that he used it to shift a turbo 400 with a reverse valve body.

Looking at the shifter, I could see no indication of whether it was for either shift pattern. I just want to know what options are available to me with the equipment I already have on hand. I do know that I'm not cheap, but I also don't usually waste money.

So to ask my original question in a better way -
1) Is there a way to determine whether my buddy's memory was correct (is this a shifter for a reverse valve body tranny)?

2) What are the pros/cons of a manual valve body for use primarily on the street, with an occasional grudge match night at the track

Thanks

 

Clamp the shifter in a vise, put it in what would be normal drive position then see what it take to move the shifter all the way to where low would normally be.
If you have to use the lever to go from second to low than it would work. Or at least that is my way of thinking.

 

why would you get a reverse shift pattern?

I have a manual vb forward pattern 400 in my Chevy II, I've put over 20,000 miles on it so far. pretty easy to drive when you get the hang of it. But for street driving, it's nice to put it into neutral pulling up to a stop. without having to run through the gears.

and it's not very traditional, either, is it? I think the reverse shift pattern thing came along a decade or so after gassers were a thing.

 

Wild Man, You didn't answer me yet, so let's assume you drive your "Gasser" on the street , 100% of the time.
Yet, your friend used that shifter to drag race , in which case, he was all the way down in third, until maybe he dropped it down in second after the turn off.
You, on the other hand, will be pulling into Cool Joe's Hot Dog Stand and ratcheting that thing up and down, up and down, until you're sick of it.
Listen to Jim here, if you must have a manual VB. Get a forward pattern deal and make a shifter like Jim's, or spring for a Turbo Action shifter, and donate that ratchet ass thing to a museum. Nothing real traditional about what you're doing anyway.
You come here looking for advice, not so much for opinions, I take it. You heard mine.
Next..

 

Mark & Jim

Thanks for the straight answers.

I was unaware of the option to get a forward pattern shifter with a manual VB

As I said in the stat of my earlier thread, this whole automatic thing is new to me. While my daily driver has been an automatic for year, my '57 has always been a 4 spd. Surprisingly, only one of my 4 sons can drive a stick. I'm not getting any younger, so I want to make sure the '57can be enjoyed by my sons long after I'm gone - hence the change to an auto.

As far as my car being a "Gasser", it is. It was strictly raced in 1966 & 1967 here in Ohio running a 301 SBC. In the middle of the season on '67 the 301 was scattered - I still have (7) Jahn's 12:1 pistons & rods. I am the one who removed the track wiring harness, and re-installed luxuries like headlights & interior. So when I call my car a gasser, it was a gasser!

 

My advice would be to teach the other boys how to drive a stick. I have a reverse manual VB in my 57 but I'm not planning on doing a lot of street driving with it, But all my cars are registered and see road use. With a manual valve body forward or reverse you alway have to remember to put it back in 1st when you come to a stop. I believe the reason for the first reverse pattern t400s was so that with the shitty shifters available at the time you wouldn't put the fucker in neutral or reverse while going down the track. So in short if you just want to mainly street drive the 57 put a standard t400 with a shift kit and have fun.

 

yup, if you go to far on the 2-3 shift the valves bounce off the pistons....won't happen with a reverse pattern vb.

 

As per usual people giving advice about something they don't even know anything about, but damn sure telling you how it's so terrible that you should never do it..ha ha ha
If the shifter is indeed reverse pattern all you do when coming to a stop is squeeze the handle and in one motion move it forward. There's no ratcheting, there's no moving it up and down to get back to neutral, squeeze handle and in one sweep it goes there.
Now as far as putting a manual valve body in it, I wouldn't, if like you did say the main purpose is street driving with an occasional grudge race. Granted it's not that far removed from the standard transmission you're removing, it would be just as easy to teach the kids to drive stick as to teach them to drive a full manual valve body.
I think it's easier to forget to shift it than a stick, with a stick you have the clutch in, that tells your brain you need to do something with the shifter. With the automatic you roll up to your stop using the brake only, just like your every day driver.
I do drive a full manual reverse valve body th400 with a Quarter stick on a regular bases on the street. If I were you I would leave the manual valve body alone, put a good shift kit in your regular valve body so you can drive it like a manual if you want or leave it in drive if you want.

 

Wow.. How about that. Must have been a B&M that came in my shop last year then. It was a forward pattern T200 , and I had to ratchet it all the time... Up, down etc..Plus you couldn't tell what gear it was it by looking down at it .
It all looked the same.
Anyway, I ripped it out and threw it in the scrap pile and put in a Turbo Action.
Maybe you'd like it, Swade. I would have given it to you.

 

I think the original idea with the reverse valve bodies, was with the upshift, the shift was always made towards you on the drag strip, using the direction of motion to assist in the shift.You can see how that would have had the "assist" with shifting while going down the track? Other than that, there is absolutely NO reason to have one, and your car is a "street car" after all. Even if it were to see the drag strip occasionally, it still makes no sense; 100% track, OK, street, no way. Now, shifters were designed to be normal pattern or reverse pattern; better find out exactly what you have. I bought a reverse pattern by mistake once, and sold it at a loss, just to get rid of it; and guess what brand shifter it was (just like yours)? Your Quarter Stick should have a 1-2-3 towards you if it really is a reverse pattern, but no one can really tell by the photos you provided; ,a normal pattern would be 1-2-3 away from you. Why not go with a lighter clutch, like a diaphragm, and use a hydraulic setup rather than manual linkage? I say keep the 4-speed, but it's your car, and you know your issues better than us. I am Butch/56sedandelivery.

 

Thanks but I'm a HURST kind of guy, it's a great shifter for racing with positive gear selection. I have a forward in the Henry J, reverse in the 41 truck and another straight on the shelf that came out of the truck. Another bad thing on reverse pattern is you can't roll up on your buddy, throw it in neutral, give him a rev and drop it back in gear to slide on by like with a forward pattern.

 

That was probably the "Pro Rachet" the "Pro Stick" is the B&M version of the Quarter stick. I always tried to sell the Pro stick instead of the rachet type...


And to the OP... I'd leave it a stick if it were mine. If I was going auto a good shift kit and leave it non manual would be my choice for street use. You can still shift it if you want.

 

Thanks guys for all the straight answers

Looks like it's a standard valve body w/ a shift kit (& new shifter) - thanks for taking the time to give me the pros & cons

Have a great Friday!

 

If your kids have been around this car for years and have never spent the time to learn how to drive a 4 speed, well they probably won't ever drive it with an automatic. As far as that goes they probably aren't going to be able to figure out a reverse pattern either.

 

Oh, they would love to learn how to drive the 4 speed, but my car isn't the kind of car to practice on! Remember back when you were learning how to drive a stick - like the first hill you had a red light on - were you in your dad's hot rod? Even though my sons are grown men (the youngest just turned 28) they still don't want to piss off the old man.

Besides, their Mom could actually drive it too

 

My understanding was reverse valve bodies were created for 1 reason only, safety. It was to keep you from slamming the trans into reverse in the heat of racing at ludicrous speed (space balls reference) when you wasn't paying attention to what gear you were in.

Friend of mine had a reverse manual in a vega, fun for awhile then got boring pretty quick having to shift up and down constantly thru town. Total different experience than driving a true manual transmission.

 

If you have it set up to shift automatic, it can be shifted manually when you want to.

 

In general the full manual valve bodies were so the driver had full control over the shift points.
I had an interesting experience with one; in the mid 70's I had a sbc/turbo 400 in a tube frame Maverick, strictly a 1/4 mile car.
A local guy with a small transmission shop build the trans as a sponsor, I supplied the trans core and the converter and full manual valve body (both B&M).
Now this is not something I would reccomend doing nowadays but I did my first test out in the street, launched the car and clicked the B&M series 60 shifter to second and the engine rpm's went sky high, dont recall how high but it left a stain for sure (no rev limiter).
Called the trans guy and he came over and looked it over, he had no prior experience with this valve body so he just decided to put a "brown box" TransGo full manual valve body reprogrammer kit in it and that fixed it, glad it didn't happen at the track!

 

One thing I don't like about reverse valve bodies are if you happen to be in high gear and there is some kind of engine or drive train failure you have to go from 3rd down to 1st, unless you get another neutral below 3rd gear.

 

Don't own a manual valve body tranny(gotta T-5) but........s'plain it like talk'in to a third grader.
IF I shift from 1...going to 2.....end up in 3...how can that be a pain on the street?!
Whether its shift'in forward or reversed.....don't you still go 1....2....3? Down shift coming to a light...
3....2....1?!
Can't see the hassle?!
Jus try'in to learn not cause a fuss!!
6sally6

 

2 words....rental car

 

Mine is designed to not engage in a lower gear when you are not on the gas, don't ask me how that works but certain brands work that way. I've had the discussion on another forum because I thought something was wrong with mine, but that's just how it works.

 

I can't say I blame you for not reading this whole thread.
Now go back and read post #8. There's a clue for ya there.

 

But when your pulling up to a stop shouldn't ya have down shifted anyway?.So in a reverse pattern 1st is next to neutral . If the op is going to go manual valve body ,I'd do a reverse pattern but a ratchet style shifter on the street may get old.

 

No. Not necessarily.
We're not driving a semi here. No need to downshift as you are coming to a stop.You have a torque converter.Not going to stall if the shifter is in third.
Hot rods , especially "gassers" , tend to have bigger duration cams.They don't always idle like a Cadillac.
As Jim said, it's nice to be able to click it into neutral when coming to a stop , if it starts to load up or stall.
But, those who want to come all the way back from 3rd at the bottom, it's your world , and your reality.