Technical Early K code 289 thoughts

If it isnt...looks like he some extra rusty giblets in there

 

Well, if that's true that still doesn't really help with the value; that would mean it's 'correct' for a early Fairlane but not the Mustang, somewhat limiting the market for it. Valuable to a Fairlane guy but less so to a Mustang guy (and there's more of those out there).

Did you find a serial number stamped on the block? Factory-installed 289 High Performance engines had the vehicle serial number stamped into the righthand side of the block near the battery's negative-cable attachment point. If that's missing, then this was probably an over the counter motor, could even have been a factory dyno mule.

 

Timing cove is most definitely a 63. Notice the Filler tube. 64s had the boss for the filler tube but was not used. HIPO crank and Heads. Is it a 5 or 6 bolt bell-housing????????????????

 

Someone may have posted this but all K code 289's had mechanical advance distributors with dual points. The housing was smooth and had no provision for a vacuum advance.

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"Someone may have posted this but all K code 289's had mechanical advance distributors with dual points.The housing was smooth and had no provision for a vacuum advance."
The first part is true, the second part could be true...but remember this is Ford. The really early hipo
apparently used the distributor as mechanical advance and plugged the vacuum diaphragm. There are a couple of pictures on the internet showing the plugged disconnected diaphragm re: "K" Fairlanes.
I've owned and still own a couple of 271's for over 50 yrs. One had the VIN stamped on the block,
the other came through Holmann Moody and no stamp (as expected).

 

yes

 

I've been looking since I started the thread and so far the only stamp I have found is the date code.(3F06)

 

Block numbers are "upside down" above the starter location.

 

I know the cast numbers are in this location, but I have yet to find anything stamped(other than the date code as mentioned)

 

F W I W,,,,,in 1963, Karol Miller had a 289 in a Falcon hardtop at Bonneville,,, he had friends at Ford,,,

 

not True - this is a genuine Ford photograph of a 64 289 Hi Po, vac advance is plugged from the factory, the second photo shows the main cap difference, otherwise the blocks are identical down to the casting numbers

 

Ok, so my Tony Gregory 289 hipo book states that all the distributors were mechanical with no vacuum provision. Maybe the book is only referencing mustangs. My dad bought a 64.5 mustang k code coupe new in June of 64' and it had mechanical advance.

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Nope, that's a '63 motor. The timing cover oil fill was gone in '64, replaced by valve cover fill. Ford found that the timing cover fill (along with the intake manifold-mounted PVC) caused major sludge build-up in the valve covers/heads because of lack of air circulation there. Keep in mind that factory publications didn't always reflect production reality as the book had to be produced and available at about the same time as the cars, so any late changes didn't always get included. The manufacturers would put out supplements or service bulletins later to cover those that may or may not get included in later editions.

 

The engine was produced from 63-67 so there is bound to be revisions along the way.

 

You found a gem! Good work! Sell it. A restorer needs it. Follow this advice:

5.0s are dime a dozen and with the roller cam, simple mods make tire frying torque & HP. Look deep & you can find a roller cammed 351...

3blap.

 

What can I say, I just really like the 289. Maybe it has something to do with my desire to root for the underdog. Who knows.

 

In the end, you are the one who has to be happy with your ride.

Hell, I pulled the completed frame out from under my Model A, saved a few pieces, and cut up the rest.

I wasn't happy with it.

 

My first car was a '66 mustang GT coupe. My dad built a rowdy little 289 for it that I had fun with for years... so I get it. There's nothing wrong with keeping it at all. It's just you can't tell from the outside how big it is on the inside. AND remember, there's no replacement for displacement! Bigger engines don't work as hard as a littler engine making the same power...

3blap.

 

One thing with the hi-po, they don't make a lot of torque down low. So you'll need a lower rear axle gear to make it drivable (or an overdrive trans). OEM installs of these were in cars that weighed about 2800 lbs, so if installing it in anything heavier you'll need on the order of 3.5 gears or lower if you don't want to be replacing clutches often (from slipping them to get going). Generally, these motors had 3.89 or 4.11 gears behind them. Great for 'go', but a real drag on the freeway.

 

If I install it in something it will definitely be a 1964-65 Falcon or Comet. I had a '65 Falcon with a mildly built 289 a couple years back and that car was very fun to drive. Although, you are absolutely correct about the gearing. The deeper gears would really allow them to live up to their potential. My Falcon still had the stock rear gears so from a dead stop it was a bit of a dog. But, from 15 or 20 mph? Watch out!

 

I appreciate all the help so far. Hopefully you all can help me a little more.

I have wire brushed and looked and looked and determined with certainty that this was either tied to Shelby, Holman Moody, etc or one of the handful sold over the parts counter(no serial # stamp).
I have been able to get the name of the guy who owned the salvage yard it came from back in the day(before he retired/closed the yard). I also got a phone number for an auto repair shop he used to own and sometimes hangs out at. I left a message a week or two ago and they said they would pass it along whenever he stopped in. So far I haven't heard anything.
Does anyone have a suggestion on any other way I could approach this? Is there any way to document any of the dealers that sold them over the parts counter? Or any way to find racers in this area that may have gotten one when they were new?

Maybe I have just gotten my hopes up, but I have a feeling there is a cool story to go with this engine if I could figure out where it came from before the salvage yard.

 

Good luck!

Back in the 90's my father bought a "Holman and Moody prepped" HiPo off of a Tiger guy while he still lived in Austin. I recall him paying $2,500 for it at the time. The engine sat on a stand for many years until he went through it in 2014 and there was no indication that Holman & Moody touched the engine. In fact, they weren't sure it was even a HiPo block until a guy from Canada who used to be affiliated with that stuff back in the day at Ford ID'd the block as a '67 service block. Turns out it was a complete HiPo though. So, the thought process is that it was an over the counter HiPo, probably from near the end of the line.

I might be able to get the Canadian guys info as he has some parts at my Dad's buddy's place to get work done on it. But, I will also have to get permission to pass info on.

3blap.

 

Thanks

 

These motors weren't in the 'standard' Ford parts chain. Ford built them, but warehoused most of them with Holman-Moody. Shelby was a 'semi' satellite warehouse; they sold them as a 'dealer', but it wasn't really a main part of their business (and after Ford bought them out, even that stopped). If you ordered one through a Ford dealer, they were usually shipped from Holman-Moody. This was true for the motors that were used in specific racing series or were sold for use by other 'manufacturers'. So Holman-moody 'stocked' the 289 HiPo, Boss 302s, 427s and Cammers, and the Boss 429s (although not all at the same time... LOL).

 

Just for general interest, there were several Ford “small block” mechanical advance dual point distributors made in the 1960s. (not covered are the extremely rare GT40 MKI race coupe or 1969-70 Boss 302 Trans Am race only versions)


Ford 260/289 c.i.d. mechanical advance dual point distributors made by FoMoCo®.


XHP-260 engines, little documentation has survived on the Ford engineering hand made prototype engines. Each engine block was stamped with a unique serial number and the same number was hand painted onto each rocker arm cover. The very first engine, XHP-260-1, was photographed in the prototype Cobra during and immediately after engine installation in California showing what appears to be a standard vacuum advance distributor. In later pictures an experimental dual point is shown. There is some evidence that thirty five (35) custom distributors made. The FoMoCo marked mechanical advance dual point distributor for these engines were identified with plastic labels under Ford engineering experimental number XE 139764 plus a second label for a serial number. A standard vacuum advance mechanism was installed but the connector link inside was cut off with something like a hack saw. The presumption is that the modified device was attached as an easy way to cover the large hole that would have been left in the front side of the main housing if nothing was used to cover it. There was no plug threaded into the vacuum port of the device. At this time only one (1) of these prototype distributors is still for sure still in existence. Ed Hugus, Shelby American, and AC Cars installed XHP-260 engines in new Cobras but new Cobras were not the only homes for these prototype engines.

HP260 engines, little documentation has survived but these engines were nearly production ready. Each engine was given a serial number stamped into the block. There is some evidence that Ford planned on introducing a 1963 model year Falcon High Performance 260 engine option. Dearborn Steel Tube built up a test car for Ford and a magazine did a new car road test on it and published an article on the car and its performance. For whatever reason(s) the plan was dropped. It may be because the 1963½ model year High Performance 289 Fairlane was close at hand. No factory documentation has been made public to tell us how many HP260 engines were made. We do know that at least 137 engines were made because a HP260 serial 137 just happened to have been purchased from Shelby American in the summer of 1964 clearance sale. HP260 engine 137 went into a Ford Hot Rod and as of last report a few years ago was still in use. The FoMoCo marked mechanical advance dual point distributor for these engines were identified with stamped in lettering under a production engineering number C2FF-12127-A. There was a housing for a vacuum advance installed but there were no internal parts installed, none at all, just a bare outer housing. A threaded plug blocked off the location of the vacuum line used on normal distributors. The presumption is that the housing was attached as an easy way to cover the large hole that would have been left in the front side of the main housing if nothing was used to cover it. At this time just two of these C2FF-A assemblies are still for sure known to exist. . Ed Hugus, Shelby American, and AC Cars installed HP260s in new Cobras but new Cobras were not the only homes for these rare engines.

HP289 engines. There is quite a lot known without doubt about these engines. Bob Mannel reports in his book that Ford started production of them in December 1962. ( I have corresponded with a very early Cobra owner that has information from the Shelby American engine installation work order putting a HP289 in his Cobra during the second week of December 1962. )


There was a series of HP289 mechanical advance dual point distributors used in production.


Early 1963 model year, FoMoCo marked C3OF-12127-F. The one I had which was removed from a very early HP289 powered Cobra was dated 3BA (1963 Feb. 1st week). They were not used long in production. There was a housing for a vacuum advance installed but there were no internal parts installed, none at all, just a bare outer housing. A threaded plug blocked off the location of the vacuum line used on normal distributors.


Most of the 1963 model year and 1964 most of model year, FoMoCo marked C3OF-12127-D. This version totally dropped a place to install a vacuum advance mechanism. The latest production date I have come across, in a Cobra, was 4GB (1964 July 2nd week).


Very end of the 1964 model and through the 1967 model year, a new for 1965 design FoMoCo early and AUTOLITE late C5OF-12127-E. The earliest FoMoCo marked one I have come across was dated 4FE (1964 June 5th week), which was with parts from a Shelby American prepared race Cobra. There was no place to mount a vacuum advance unit.


Modern service part, Motorcraft® C5OF-12127-E. These assemblies usually were made from standard housings made with a formed sheet metal cover used to block off the unneeded vacuum advance mounting location.